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Commando changes link here


Furiel's Avatar


Furiel
02.05.2013 , 03:36 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by ArchangelLBC View Post
This is my concern as well. The DR nerf may be because of the increased damage potential from 15% faster firing grav rounds, but you can only cast so much given the ammo and I worry that in practice the net result will be a big old nerf.
OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)

Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)
Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...
Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.

BW declares us fixed, because we can be uninterruptible gods for 6 seconds every 3 min with our new CDs, so basically long enough to get off 3 GR and a DR, of course that assumes we don't get stunned or KBed or get lept to in that time... I say this jokingly, but I'm secretly concerned this is what they will actually do...
Furiel Plush
Cardinal and Raid Coordinator of The Church of Alvis

ArchangelLBC's Avatar


ArchangelLBC
02.05.2013 , 04:31 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Furiel View Post
OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)

Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)
Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...
Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.

BW declares us fixed, because we can be uninterruptible gods for 6 seconds every 3 min with our new CDs, so basically long enough to get off 3 GR and a DR, of course that assumes we don't get stunned or KBed or get lept to in that time... I say this jokingly, but I'm secretly concerned this is what they will actually do...
I feel this is ridiculously optimistic.
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Kitru's Avatar


Kitru
02.05.2013 , 05:32 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by Furiel View Post
Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.
I have a feeling that Advance the Line is going to be an ability for all Commandos rather than just for Gunnery Commandos, but, rather than being Immunity/KB interrupt (which is essentially what Tech Override is *supposed* to do; it also doesn't make sense that "Advance the Line" would allow you to stand there and just cast; that's *holding* the line), I think it will most likely be an ability to cast on the move for a given duration (since to *advance* the line, you kinda need to move forward). It's been one of the more oft asked for abilities for Commandos, especially since that's kinda of what the Commando does in one of the trailers (using an Assault Cannon, he slowly walks up while hitting Malgus with a continuous stream of fire). It sounds a bit optimistic, but, just based on the name, that's exactly what it sounds like it'll be.
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PanzerJagdhund's Avatar


PanzerJagdhund
02.05.2013 , 05:52 PM | #14
Yep, just need to wait for more info. Who knows, maybe one of the changes is what all of us troopers wanted: an energy system that is equal to that of the bounty hunter.
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DariusCalera
02.05.2013 , 06:00 PM | #15
I am assuming that these changes are for the expansion correct?

(Link won't work for me)

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Flying-Brian
02.05.2013 , 08:24 PM | #16
My worries (which start with the person who came up with the new skills has no idea how the class works, has never played it and designed everything off a spreadsheet of ultra secret BW metrics).

It seems they are trying to address the issues of PVP survivability with new defensive cool downs, and skills that will shorten cast times. Because they think that the shorter cast times will increase the available damage, they are nerfing the only instant attack that could do any damage (and from how it looks, taking away the only chance of that 5k damage medal from you).

Without seeing how these will work together and the other changes in the skill tree, it looks like the changes that are made to try to help the PVP aspect of play are going to have very negative reactions on the PVE side of play, by lowering damage, adding in defensive skills that are not needed and then messing with ammo use and regen just to make things worse.

I don't like this at all.

And as can be seen from the past PTS tests, once they put it up , the chances of getting anything changed for the better from player input is slim to none.

firestarter's Avatar


firestarter
02.06.2013 , 12:32 AM | #17
And where are the changes for the Pyro Merc / Assault Commando??????
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Gyronamics
02.06.2013 , 02:18 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by firestarter View Post
And where are the changes for the Pyro Merc / Assault Commando??????
Back to my cunning plan to steal more from the Gunnery tree with our extra 5 points to make Assault more user friendly.

As the current tree stands it would be pushback resistance without giving up 3% crit. Plus the last 2 in +30% crit dmg on FA.

Or in PVP, steal stockstrike root and bigger knockback because Assault for commandos gives NO talents to mess with other players worth a dam. That snare is pathetic and useless, it's a 30m ranged class, attacking is never an issue. Defensively it's just crap while anything you're trying to escape from (melee) has far more effective means to keep you there or keep up with you.
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Furiel's Avatar


Furiel
02.06.2013 , 09:16 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Flying-Brian View Post
My worries (which start with the person who came up with the new skills has no idea how the class works, has never played it and designed everything off a spreadsheet of ultra secret BW metrics).

It seems they are trying to address the issues of PVP survivability with new defensive cool downs, and skills that will shorten cast times. Because they think that the shorter cast times will increase the available damage, they are nerfing the only instant attack that could do any damage (and from how it looks, taking away the only chance of that 5k damage medal from you).

Without seeing how these will work together and the other changes in the skill tree, it looks like the changes that are made to try to help the PVP aspect of play are going to have very negative reactions on the PVE side of play, by lowering damage, adding in defensive skills that are not needed and then messing with ammo use and regen just to make things worse.

I don't like this at all.

And as can be seen from the past PTS tests, once they put it up , the chances of getting anything changed for the better from player input is slim to none.
Assumedly with gear scaling for level 55 the damage on DR will come up enough to get the 5k medal with ease, even with the 5% base damage nerf. Still doesn't make me happy tho because it seems like the nerf will make our demo round damage stay static at the top end, which means it'll be less while leveling and gearing up. Add to that the changed to GR damage range and I'm very worried that our DPS will go down alot at launch and we'll have to level and gear up just to get back to where we are today while everyone else will be blowing past us or significantly widening the already existing gap.
Furiel Plush
Cardinal and Raid Coordinator of The Church of Alvis

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Llama-Eight
02.06.2013 , 09:25 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Furiel View Post
OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)
IMO, either they don't have a clue about Gunnery, they're just yanking our chains with these & the previous changes, or they just don't like Gunnery in PvP (ie, incompetance or malice).

Quote:
Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)
Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...
If we keep Muzzle Fluting, then an additional cast time reduction would put it (even further) below the GCD timer (15% cast time reduction on top of the 4% alacrity from skills, though you probably wouldn't take the usual alacrity skills since we don't really need them anymore with this change) so we'd either be standing their doing nothing or moving, but neither of those really increases your DPS (unless you move into range of a target). So I don't think it's really going to increase our DPS much for GR/CB, though it would with FA/PC/HoB, which would give us more ammo regen issues mitigating some of the DPS increase (either due to not firing waiting for ammo to regen or using our free attack).