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The Clone War's Canon Conundrum

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
The Clone War's Canon Conundrum

JBFett's Avatar


JBFett
12.22.2012 , 11:46 AM | #1
Does anyone else feel like The Clone Wars is pretty much taking a **** on all previously establish canon?

Examples: Mandalorians during the Clone Wars, Adi Gallia's Death, Asajj Ventress' backstory, Grevious' backstory, Dooku's backstory, the Entire CIS' backstory, Maul being revived, Asoka Tano, The Battle of Kamino, and Even Piell's death. I'm sure there's more but those are the one's I could think of off the top of my head.

Examples of Sources which have been changed: Dark Horse Comics set during the Clone Wars (Republic, Oppression, ect.), the Republic Commando books, the entire original timeline for the Clone Wars; again these are just the things I could think of off the top of my head.
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Bird_of_Thunder's Avatar


Bird_of_Thunder
12.22.2012 , 11:57 AM | #2
TCW is retconning everything. although i did enjoy the mandos and Maul's revival, everythibg else is just bad
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JBFett's Avatar


JBFett
12.22.2012 , 12:05 PM | #3
Thank you. Now that I have at least one supporter, I must ask: Does anyone else wish Mr. Chee would get over his obsession with keeping Star Wars as one timeline, and simply make it another? I feel like he's only doing this to satisfy the pockets of his higher ups, and maybe himself. He's compromising the history of stars wars, by overriding what I perceive as better material, with material that I perceive as worst. That, as a fan, makes me highly upset, and I feel like I'm not the only one who feels this way.
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Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
12.22.2012 , 12:40 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by JBFett View Post
Thank you. Now that I have at least one supporter, I must ask: Does anyone else wish Mr. Chee would get over his obsession with keeping Star Wars as one timeline, and simply make it another? I feel like he's only doing this to satisfy the pockets of his higher ups, and maybe himself. He's compromising the history of stars wars, by overriding what I perceive as better material, with material that I perceive as worst. That, as a fan, makes me highly upset, and I feel like I'm not the only one who feels this way.
Its all your opinion though I mean you pretty much clarified that, just because you see something as bad doesn't mean it is the same way for everyone on the planet. Life would be pretty dull if people were wired the same way.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.22.2012 , 01:33 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by JBFett View Post
Thank you. Now that I have at least one supporter, I must ask: Does anyone else wish Mr. Chee would get over his obsession with keeping Star Wars as one timeline, and simply make it another? I feel like he's only doing this to satisfy the pockets of his higher ups, and maybe himself. He's compromising the history of stars wars, by overriding what I perceive as better material, with material that I perceive as worst. That, as a fan, makes me highly upset, and I feel like I'm not the only one who feels this way.
No way, one timeline - no multiverses. This is Star Wars not some comic series. Retconning happens and we have to deal with it. Personally the only thing that irked me is Grievous's backstory (Ventresses' backstory was retconned? I thought they just adapted it from established EU?) But that is kept kinda vague anyway and the changes are fairly minor. So I have nothing wrong with this.

And for the record I like the New Mandalorians: same old, same old warrior clan gets dull after a while.

MasterMe's Avatar


MasterMe
12.22.2012 , 01:53 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
No way, one timeline - no multiverses. This is Star Wars not some comic series. Retconning happens and we have to deal with it. Personally the only thing that irked me is Grievous's backstory (Ventresses' backstory was retconned? I thought they just adapted it from established EU?) But that is kept kinda vague anyway and the changes are fairly minor. So I have nothing wrong with this.

And for the record I like the New Mandalorians: same old, same old warrior clan gets dull after a while.
^^ This ^^

JBFett's Avatar


JBFett
12.22.2012 , 02:31 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Wolfninjajedi View Post
Its all your opinion though I mean you pretty much clarified that, just because you see something as bad doesn't mean it is the same way for everyone on the planet. Life would be pretty dull if people were wired the same way.
Yes. It is my opinion, but I can't be the only one who has it. I will openly admit, I consider nothing published within the last four years under "The Clone Wars" market brand to be in my version of Star Wars, simply because it does not live up to the expectations of what I perceive as "Star Wars". I feel like Anakin should have never had an apprentice, and I feel like Grevious should have remained a pretty bad *** guy. Again, I feel like the creative (arguably better) works of former writers, and artist is being erased, in favor of making money off of a tv show written to appeal to children. I simply wish to see if I am the only one of this opinion.

Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
Personally the only thing that irked me is Grievous's backstory (Ventresses' backstory was retconned? I thought they just adapted it from established EU?) But that is kept kinda vague anyway and the changes are fairly minor. So I have nothing wrong with this.

And for the record I like the New Mandalorians: same old, same old warrior clan gets dull after a while.
Well... Ventress' story wasn't so much 'changed' as it was "unnecessarily added to". Originally she was solely Rattatak, however The Clone Wars changed it to shoe-horn the Dathomir Witches in, therefore effectively obliterating the Rattataki species from Star Wars Cannon. See how that causes a problem considering Rattataki are in this game?

And while I can somewhat agree with the Mandalorians, I hate how the traditional Mando's are portrayed as solely evil. Which leads to another problem the show raises, everything presented in it is black and white. There are no 'good' guys on the Sepretist side, and everything formerly established that could allow someone to sympathize with the CIS has been completely destroyed, or obscured.
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Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
12.22.2012 , 02:52 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by JBFett View Post
Well... Ventress' story wasn't so much 'changed' as it was "unnecessarily added to". Originally she was solely Rattatak, however The Clone Wars changed it to shoe-horn the Dathomir Witches in, therefore effectively obliterating the Rattataki species from Star Wars Cannon. See how that causes a problem considering Rattataki are in this game?

And while I can somewhat agree with the Mandalorians, I hate how the traditional Mando's are portrayed as solely evil. Which leads to another problem the show raises, everything presented in it is black and white. There are no 'good' guys on the Sepretist side, and everything formerly established that could allow someone to sympathize with the CIS has been completely destroyed, or obscured.
The Dathomir witches aspect is vital to the series, including the development of Ventress' character and story, as well as the introduction of Savage Oppress and the return of Mail, as well as another addition to the 'independents' category of star wars. I love the fact that Ventress is a Nightsister, it suits her perfectly. And Ventress doesn't represent the entire Rattaki species - even if she was the first.

I doubt you are an avid watcher of the Clone Wars but there was a whole arc portraying the Separatists as 'good' and 'democratic' and basically established the fact that Count Dooku and the greedy Trade Federation etc are evil and corrupt but the people who choose to follow them are not. Which is an improvement to the Star Wars universe as in the films they were portrayed as rather evil.

Same goes for the Mandalorians, Death Watch are clearly the bad guys but by the looks of it in future arcs we are going to see the return of the 'true' mandalorians who are essentially good as they team up with Kenobi for whatever reason. (not to mention the fact that the New Mandalorians are mandalorian as well so again, not solely bad guys, far from it)

I think you need to remember that EU is back their in the shadows, these works are up their in the forefront. It is the EU works you should take with a pinch of salt, not these. And TBH these guys are better at writing story...

Wolfninjajedi's Avatar


Wolfninjajedi
12.22.2012 , 03:04 PM | #9
Tbh imo the only 'true' Mandos are The Taung! Every other after are just the Newer or "poser" Mandos.
"There is one lesson you've yet to learn. How to become one with the Force!"
―Cin Drallig to Darth Vader

Maucs the Tauntaun King, former SWG player.

JBFett's Avatar


JBFett
12.22.2012 , 03:11 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
The Dathomir witches aspect is vital to the series, including the development of Ventress' character and story, as well as the introduction of Savage Oppress and the return of Mail, as well as another addition to the 'independents' category of star wars. I love the fact that Ventress is a Nightsister, it suits her perfectly. And Ventress doesn't represent the entire Rattaki species - even if she was the first.

I doubt you are an avid watcher of the Clone Wars but there was a whole arc portraying the Separatists as 'good' and 'democratic' and basically established the fact that Count Dooku and the greedy Trade Federation etc are evil and corrupt but the people who choose to follow them are not. Which is an improvement to the Star Wars universe as in the films they were portrayed as rather evil.

Same goes for the Mandalorians, Death Watch are clearly the bad guys but by the looks of it in future arcs we are going to see the return of the 'true' mandalorians who are essentially good as they team up with Kenobi for whatever reason. (not to mention the fact that the New Mandalorians are mandalorian as well so again, not solely bad guys, far from it)

I think you need to remember that EU is back their in the shadows, these works are up their in the forefront. It is the EU works you should take with a pinch of salt, not these. And TBH these guys are better at writing story...
Okay. I will admit, I am not an avid watcher of the series, because every time I try to get into it I find myself disappointed by how bad it is. I didn't claim to be one either. I lost interest in the show rather quickly once they started spiting out canon contradictions left and right. I have seen the trailers for Season 5, and I hope they actually let the "bad guys" win, but lets be honest, in a kids show the bad guys never win. They haven't won a single time in the episodes I've watched of the series.

Finally, I don't think you have read the comic series put out by Dark Horse about the Clone Wars if you say that the writing on The Clone Wars is better than the writing of those comics. I urge you to either pick up the TPBs, or download, the issues of Star Wars: Republic, Star Wars: Dark Times, and Star Wars: Obsession. After reading those, you can not tell me that the staff at The Clone Wars has a better understanding of what Star Wars truly is than the wonderful artist at Dark Horse.
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