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Sage, the paper dog king of all mmo's!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Sage, the paper dog king of all mmo's!

Lodril's Avatar


Lodril
12.23.2012 , 06:27 PM | #11
I find PVP tedious, so I've not really engaged in it much, but I do have a few questions based on my little bit of experience with playing a Sage recently.

The tanks are almost nothing but melee ranged attacks... why didn't you use the knockback at all? Why did you keep using nothing but that one ability with a pushback rather than switching it up with something less disruptable? It seems like the key would be to keep out of his reach as much as possible by pushing him back, slowing him down, and moving away.

LuciferinDNA's Avatar


LuciferinDNA
12.24.2012 , 03:01 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Lodril View Post
I find PVP tedious, so I've not really engaged in it much, but I do have a few questions based on my little bit of experience with playing a Sage recently.

The tanks are almost nothing but melee ranged attacks... why didn't you use the knockback at all? Why did you keep using nothing but that one ability with a pushback rather than switching it up with something less disruptable? It seems like the key would be to keep out of his reach as much as possible by pushing him back, slowing him down, and moving away.
In martial arts there is a phrase, " every fight ends up in ground fighting" If you fight with a melee class in SWTOR its 100% that it will end up in melee, no matter how much you try to make distance. They jump on you, slow you, freez you, - you make distance, they jump again.... and if you will be able to make that distance some how, they just trow there saber after you. The only thing what you can do vs melee AC's that you roll hybrid and you rather heal out there attacks, then dps back, in this case sometimes, they fell out fom there rhythm and you can start to push-back,slow, sprint, dps- stun-dps interupt - sprint-dps.... But! if they use a macro for there rotation, they never will get tired, never fell out of rhythm and in numbers they will hunt you down 100%

Lodril's Avatar


Lodril
12.24.2012 , 06:07 PM | #13
Except that by pushing them back, you limit what abilities they can use, and force them to keep running up, which takes up time, especially if your telekinetic attacks also slow them down. By keeping them away, you make them use attacks costing more in energy and keep their heavier hitting skills off the table until they catch up. Pushing them away isn't to knock them out of the fight, but rather to control what they bring to it, and keeping them longer at ranges where the sage has a greater advantage.

Washingtoon's Avatar


Washingtoon
12.24.2012 , 06:23 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Lodril View Post
Except that by pushing them back, you limit what abilities they can use, and force them to keep running up, which takes up time, especially if your telekinetic attacks also slow them down. By keeping them away, you make them use attacks costing more in energy and keep their heavier hitting skills off the table until they catch up. Pushing them away isn't to knock them out of the fight, but rather to control what they bring to it, and keeping them longer at ranges where the sage has a greater advantage.
You push them back what, 5 m? 1 meter outside their melee range but still within range for some of their other abilties. The KB should be like the jugg's and send them flying across the map and land on their backs, which would give you enough time to lose LOS. If you run without losing LOS you're just giving them a free leap plus a few shockwave points.

nokizaru's Avatar


nokizaru
01.01.2013 , 09:12 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by LuciferinDNA View Post
In martial arts there is a phrase, " every fight ends up in ground fighting" If you fight with a melee class in SWTOR its 100% that it will end up in melee, no matter how much you try to make distance. They jump on you, slow you, freez you, - you make distance, they jump again.... and if you will be able to make that distance some how, they just trow there saber after you. The only thing what you can do vs melee AC's that you roll hybrid and you rather heal out there attacks, then dps back, in this case sometimes, they fell out fom there rhythm and you can start to push-back,slow, sprint, dps- stun-dps interupt - sprint-dps.... But! if they use a macro for there rotation, they never will get tired, never fell out of rhythm and in numbers they will hunt you down 100%
Really? And what 'martial art' is that? I've trained in several martial arts for over 10 years and I'm sorry to say we don't subscribe to that philosophy. You prepare for ground fighting, but you don't accept it as 'inevitable'.

Back to topic, I agree that it sometimes feels like you're forever trying to escape their 'home ground'. But more often than not I find I can do it, and it's some of the most entertaining pvp I've had. I play melee dps, too, and once you realise you're up against a Sage/Sorc who can kite and knows their class, you're busting your nut every bit as hard trying to close that distance.
Stop exploding you cowards!

LuciferinDNA's Avatar


LuciferinDNA
01.01.2013 , 07:21 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by nokizaru View Post
Really? And what 'martial art' is that? I've trained in several martial arts for over 10 years and I'm sorry to say we don't subscribe to that philosophy. You prepare for ground fighting, but you don't accept it as 'inevitable'.

Back to topic, I agree that it sometimes feels like you're forever trying to escape their 'home ground'. But more often than not I find I can do it, and it's some of the most entertaining pvp I've had. I play melee dps, too, and once you realise you're up against a Sage/Sorc who can kite and knows their class, you're busting your nut every bit as hard trying to close that distance.
You know this is the post that we can say about, that if you would not post it, you still would be able to act like a wise , )
But this train is gone...

nokizaru's Avatar


nokizaru
01.02.2013 , 04:47 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by LuciferinDNA View Post
You know this is the post that we can say about, that if you would not post it, you still would be able to act like a wise , )
But this train is gone...
Yes....what?
Stop exploding you cowards!

LuciferinDNA's Avatar


LuciferinDNA
01.02.2013 , 07:33 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by nokizaru View Post
Yes....what?
First you questioning credibility about an RL issue, you showing that you pro in this issue from the reason, that you spend 10 years to study it. If you want, send me PM's and we can discuss it, but I don't think that you are interested on real opinions connected to this phrase, you just wanted to troll the forum users ( questioning my credibility, and using it like a lobby vs Sage/Sorce, so the thread) + to ventilate your ego. Yes you trolled them, coz if you spend 10 years by different martial arts you should know this phrase well , )

Second, you came up with some rubbish explanation, that wants to explain us, that the AC is well balanced and gives hard time for poor knights/warriors in the right hand - what is nonsense and maybe true vs a bad low geared warrior/knight.

So you tried to lobby a bit vs the thread and keep your well deserved smash safe from nerf, but you should try it harder , )

I hope you understand that the forum and the class lobby is part of the game and we have to support our class on the forum in every MMO if we realize, that it lacking here and there... And Sage/Sorc needs a huge rebuild to make it balance and viable vs other classes, ACs!
Peace!


Yes...that!

Paelo's Avatar


Paelo
01.02.2013 , 08:23 AM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by LuciferinDNA View Post
coz if you spend 10 years by different martial arts you should know this phrase well
While I haven't been training for quite that long, more like a little over three years myself, I've never heard that expression used as a rule of fighting. Typically, yes, fights go to the ground, but that has a lot to do with the fact that most people (especially the ones without training) inevitably end up grappling eachother, even if they start out swinging wild punches.

Try and tackle someone who has been trained to counter it (not hard, given that it's the inevitable feint/followed by grapple) and is willing to use more....brutal means to prevent it, and the only person who'll end up going to the ground is you.

Quote: Originally Posted by LuciferinDNA View Post
Second, you came up with some rubbish explanation, that wants to explain us, that the AC is well balanced and gives hard time for poor knights/warriors in the right hand - what is nonsense and maybe true vs a bad low geared warrior/knight.
To me this seems a clear indication that you have no idea on how to kite in pvp. Sure, being jumped by a well played Sent/Marra or Guard/Jug will leave you on the back foot, but knowing how to cycle your skills, and being familiar with even the basics of kiting can give you the ability to turn the tables on them. Hybrid spec in particular thanks to the exploding shield and root effect on force wake gives you a lot to play with in terms of gaining distance/cast time.

Granted, there are some things that need to be dealt with in terms of balance (like the current slightly over the top derp sweep damage) but that dosen't change the fact that it is possible still to counter them.
I'm not racist, I hate everyone equally

JizzerDDU's Avatar


JizzerDDU
01.02.2013 , 08:28 AM | #20
Sad to say before I took my long break from the game sage's were decent. I could 1v1 champion/bm geared knights and have a few wins. Now I come back and I dont enjoy it anymore. I quit on sage until I see something major done to them. For now powertech it is.