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The Death of the Class Story - Chapter 4: Rise of the Hutt Cartel


CelCawdro

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I guess its normal for an expantion to cost.

 

Well its an expansion much in the same way as Novare Coast or Explosive conflict could count as "expansions".

 

Sure, it adds a new planet, but unless that planet is huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge its hardly the same as adding a new zone in any other MMO.

And five more levels? really? five?

Regular players will devour that in a day or two tops... and for this they have to pay real money.

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Cel. Are you able to compile some links regarding Makeb being said to be free for subscribers? Thanks!

 

I'm looking for a few - as of yet, I've only found a few references to major content being free for subscribers. Having a more difficult time finding the quotes where it was stated that Makeb isn't a true expansion, thus qualifying it as major content.

 

Jeff Hickman:

“For players like you or me, here’s the subscription, you get everything, have a great time, no worries.

 

“For other players, we’re going to have a restricted but deep experience, where you can come in and play some of the best of what we offer: our story. And our hope is that by playing the story, and interacting with all the other things that are going on peripherally - warzones, flashpoints, crafting, legacy systems, all this stuff - those players will start to reach out and grab the other things that they like.

That one is interesting particularly because he states that even free-to-play customers will only need to pay for peripheral content - by that logic, Makeb should be free from them, as well.

 

And again on the major updates from the main site:

First, you can continue as a subscriber, which gives you unlimited access to all game features and future Game Updates at no additional charge.
I have a job interview later in the day, so I'll dig around a bit more after that, unless I can find some spare time. Edited by CelCawdro
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it's not an expansion, it does not have any class story in there, only a common planet story, and making subscribers pay for it is just pure greed.

 

Did you see how they increased they price for the new orange sets in the cartel market since so many are buying them like hotcakes? They used to be 1200 CC, the new ones are 1440 CC.

 

It's ironic that their new money grabbing scheme is call "rise of the hutt cartel" when everything is developped with the cartel market in mind.

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Very, very interesting...

 

I will be closely watching what they roll out for this "expansion", or if it takles the core problems at all.

So far I've only seen learnings(or rather stolen ideas) in the wrong direction.

 

The decision to let subscribers pay for DLCs has a few implications, seeing how other games handled their Freemium transition way smarter.

I would really die to see this decision being made, and how that impacted internal processes and atmosphere.

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I guess its normal for an expantion to cost.

 

It is at best an adventure pack.

 

Pretty much all freemium MMORPGs have a way to buy adventure packs for cashshop coins, so subs can just "buy" them with their saved up coins.

 

 

Again though SWTOR seems to be going with the nickle and dime method of trying to milk the subscribers into paying twice. :mad:

Edited by Goretzu
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Honestly I don't mind.

 

Now as an quick aside, I loved my class/companion missions while I was leveling. They added some variety to what would otherwise have been a static experience on each of my characters, it gave me a narrative and actually forced me to think of my character as maybe something than just my online handle plus a race/class combination.

 

But here's the thing, Bioware ****ed up with Bonus Series, and Illum. In that after they let players conclude their chapter 3, once all the class specific companion quest were done, once the zones didn't need to be restricted by class any longer, once balancing quests for level or faction was a non-issue, they had a huge window to use the interlude for level 50 content.

 

But Bioware didn't use that chance and now they're stuck. Level 50 content was and is still mostly rather anemic . Rather than an enjoyable alternative to standard fare MMO-leveling, they more or less made leveling the game, and now they're stuck.

 

Since on the one hand the game desperately needs high-end content but on the otherhand players are expecting any new big content patch to bring a wealth of new class/story to the game. Which I'm sorry to say is a waste, since any new class stuff essentially requires Bioware to do 8x the work for the same payoff as simply adding decent level 50 (or I guess 55 content).

 

And there's really no arguing against it because the game needs a reason to keep people subbed. Leveling alts, and such only takes so long before players exhaust that route and simply quit when they're done leveling (which is what happened, and as going F2P proved, SWTOR can't survive with any given generation of playeys only stick around for two or three months).

 

So who cares if they've thrown class stuff by the wayside. Give the players a reason to play their 50s, give players a reason to interact and build those 50s, and keep playing them for month after month after month. Get the game into a position to have a stable end-game meta, and then we can worry about a huge expansion further down the line once the game is actually in a position to give us decent appropriately lengthed new chapters.

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Considering that SWTOR's main hook was their fourth pillar of story & the class story is what makes the game interesting & unique, I'm not sure what they're hoping to achieve. You might as well brand it 'generic MMO rubbish with lightsabers' if you take away the talents of Jennifer Hale, Bertie Carvel, Kari Wahlgren and so on. Other MMOs do the other bits of MMOs better in pretty much all respects.

 

I really don't want to be doom & gloom about TOR, because I really like the game, and yet stuff like this just makes me think EA haven't got a clue, most particularly about when & what to say. They promise subscribers get everything, and then want $5 from subscribers for this pathetic excuse of an 'expansion'. One planet? Not available for Cartel Coins? No class story? What's the point?

 

Where is all the content that was promised even at launch? James Ohlen used the phrase 'we have tons of content ready to go' and frankly if this is all that has resulted after a year of nothing but Section X for anyone that doesn't PvP or do Operations, then I'm deeply unimpressed. There are plenty of other MMOs managing to put PvE content out.

 

Rise of the EA Cartel indeed.

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As a quick note - in all honesty, I would be entirely sated if BioWare came out with a statement saying, "You know what guys? We know we previously said that Makeb would be a major content release that we wouldn't be charging for, but given the size of this particular project, we're going to have to charge a small fee. It's the only way we can justify releasing content patches of this magnitude with the current model."

 

It's simply the backsliding and the failure to explain rationale that gets to me more than the actual method of implementation. I don't mind shelling out $20 (or $10, if I'm given reason to resubscribe). It's the principle of the thing - we were told there would be no charge, and now there is. There's probably good reason for that change, but we'll never hear what it is.

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Considering that SWTOR's main hook was their fourth pillar of story & the class story is what makes the game interesting & unique, I'm not sure what they're hoping to achieve. You might as well brand it 'generic MMO rubbish with lightsabers' if you take away the talents of Jennifer Hale, Bertie Carvel, Kari Wahlgren and so on. Other MMOs do the other bits of MMOs better in pretty much all respects.

 

I really don't want to be doom & gloom about TOR, because I really like the game, and yet stuff like this just makes me think EA haven't got a clue, most particularly about when & what to say. They promise subscribers get everything, and then want $5 from subscribers for this pathetic excuse of an 'expansion'. One planet? Not available for Cartel Coins? No class story? What's the point?

 

Where is all the content that was promised even at launch? James Ohlen used the phrase 'we have tons of content ready to go' and frankly if this is all that has resulted after a year of nothing but Section X for anyone that doesn't PvP or do Operations, then I'm deeply unimpressed. There are plenty of other MMOs managing to put PvE content out.

 

Rise of the EA Cartel indeed.

 

I'm pretty sure Jennifer Hale and all the other actors who voice your character will still be in the expansion.

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I'm pretty sure Jennifer Hale and all the other actors who voice your character will still be in the expansion.

 

To be completely cynical about this: it remains to be seen if there will be any unique dialogue, however. I've played through entire questlines that only have generic responses coming from my characters.

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I'm pretty sure Jennifer Hale and all the other actors who voice your character will still be in the expansion.

That wasn't really my point - I'm sure some voice acting will be in this content update, since they've advertised it as such. My point is that if you take all that away, there's not much left, and it's therefore what makes TOR special & worthwhile. EA's trend appears to be taking that away & watering it down wherever possible, because it's expensive, and that worries me. Back at launch, the argument went 'so why aren't you launching F2P - because we want to put out high quality content and maintain the same level of quality as the voiced story we're putting out at launch'. That compact, for whatever it was worth, appears to have been bent if not broken. It's disappointing.

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That wasn't really my point - I'm sure some voice acting will be in this content update, since they've advertised it as such. My point is that if you take all that away, there's not much left, and it's therefore what makes TOR special & worthwhile. EA's trend appears to be taking that away & watering it down wherever possible, because it's expensive, and that worries me. Back at launch, the argument went 'so why aren't you launching F2P - because we want to put out high quality content and maintain the same level of quality as the voiced story we're putting out at launch'. That compact, for whatever it was worth, appears to have been bent if not broken. It's disappointing.

 

I'd imagine there'll be a significant beta period on the PTS where you can play all the content and see if it's worth it.

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I'd imagine there'll be a significant beta period on the PTS where you can play all the content and see if it's worth it.

 

I'm willing to bet that the presence of Makeb on the PTS will be invite only, if it even becomes available. At least, I would hope so.

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I'd imagine there'll be a significant beta period on the PTS where you can play all the content and see if it's worth it.

I'm not sure what your point is. My individual ability to judge whether I want to spend money doesn't begin to compare to the precedent & direction chosen by a company running an MMO (by definition a long term investment on both sides).

 

It's not so much about 'OMG Makeb costs money, has no class story' as 'hmm, is TOR going in a direction that I really want to still be a part of?'. Most complaints I've observed have underlying reasoning along some sort of principle or precedent line.

 

I will still be able, even for free if I so choose, to play 1-50 and level a bunch of alts, Makeb or no Makeb. Does EA want me as a disillusioned freeloader, or a passionate MMO player who really supports TOR and is in it for the long run? That is the question, and it's not about me particularly, but rather some major chosen segment of their market (which may or may not include me). At some point, companies running MMOs have to recognise the difference between milking passing cows & having active long-term supporters, or they eventually run out of new blood to gouge.

 

Hmm, too many mixed metaphors there... Do they want committed fans or just people who turn up, play & pay a bit, and move on. Large U-turns in their core principles since launch does not a committed fanbase make as it suggests one cannot trust a word they say about the long-term future of the game.

Edited by Grammarye
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This is an economic issue. The cost to create the story content is just too high with the amount of money this game generates. The time needed to create that content is also a factor. I agree that the story is the only thing that sets swtor apart, perhaps those resources can be put towards other game systems that make swtor more appealing. It also seems kinda expensive to me, one planet 5 levels 20 bucks, 10 is you are a subscriber. What happens if you are a subscriber and preorder. Then drop your sub until the new content is released?

 

I will not pre-order unless I am given a lot more information first. The whole you have to order now or you don't get 5 days access is a money grab and insulting to players. This game does not have the track record to be pulling stunts like that.

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I recall them saying around launch that they already had somewhere along the lines of a year's content ready in several phases(complete/worked on/planned out).

 

Now that the year of original plans has come and gone, I'm curious to see how they plan on generating fresh content. I just get a very bad feeling that some stagnant months lie ahead of this game.

 

My hope is that with the price gouging they have implemented that they generate the revenue to feed back into dynamic game content, but it seems EVERY hope I have had for this game has gone unfulfilled.

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Gameplay is not that much different then what you can find in other MMOs.

 

For me it's the story that makes the game fun, and I do all the "click, kill, gather, deliver" thingies for class story. Not for lightsabers or lightnings, not for Star Wars (I'm like ST more then SW :D ). For story. I like it, although it's kinda childish from time to time, but still - story has drawn me to this game and is keeping my wallet open each month.

 

No story = no game = no money for EAWare. Not from me at least. I could pay another 30-40$ for full expansion, with some great chapter full of class stories, planets and side quests/stories. For side quests only... I do not know about the others, but for me it is not worth to pay sub (and showe those 10$ for update) only to get some side story.

 

Meh, still got to end SI story and do some story quest for Republic. So EAWare will be getting my money till spring or so.

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I've been seeing a few threads pop up requesting elaboration on this subject - will unique, class storylines ever be reintroduced? Hopefully that trend continues, and hopefully we get an answer on the subject. I've seen an encouraging amount of BioWare posts lately, but I fear that they were all simple pre-written PR posts that the community team merely sought to find a place for in existing threads rather than creating their own.
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