Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 Malak turned Bastila to the darkside because she was an inexperienced Padawan who had yet to properly handle strong emotions. It wasn't that the torture itself that broke her, it was the fact that Malak made her realize the power that all that pain and anger gave her. Also, Malak grew stronger as he became Dark Lord of the Sith. I'm inclined to think that Malak did surpass Revan, only to be surpassed in turn by him. He does say that Revan was stronger near the end of Kotor I than he ever was as a Sith Lord. "I suppose… I suppose you speak the truth. I alone must accept responsibility for my fate. I wanted to be Master of the Sith and ruler of the galaxy. But that destiny was not mine, Revan. [cough] It might have been yours, perhaps… but never mine. And in the end, as the darkness takes me, I am nothing." I think that's pretty weak from a Dark Lord of the Sith. The non canon DS ending is even worse Yes. I cannot deny it any longer. You are the one who deserves... who deserves to be the Dark Lord. You were the one who found the first Star Map on Dantooine, Revan, and it was you who led us on our quest for the Star Forge. I only followed in your wake. I tried to usurp your rule, to steal the title of Sith Master from you. But now I understand. The destiny is yours Revan. Not mine. You... you are Darth Revan, Lord... Lord of the Sith. And I... I am nothing. What the heck is that? It's just disgusting to hear from any Sith, not to say a Dark Lord of the Sith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacenHallis Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 So what? Even Anakin took Palpatine 13 years to corrupt, why didn't Palpatine just lock him up and let Dooku torture him for a week? Baras was a powerful Sith as well but even Normen Karr's agent could endure all his torture then he said "BAH! I CANNOT BREAK HIM!" and had to risk his powerful apprentice to get the Ravager. Personally I think Malak is a failure as Sith, he failed to kill or surpass his master, and his words before dying disgusted me, especially the dark side end "I AM NOTHING!" should never come out from a Sith Lord. This is like the Satele/Malgus thing all over again. It didn't take Palpatine 13 years to corrupt Anakin. It took him 13 years to become a trusted adviser to Anakin so that he could corrupt him. It took 13 years of building the kid up, so that he could tear him down in a matter of weeks. You're comparing physical and mental torture to subtle psychological machinations. They're pretty much the exact opposite of each other. He wasn't called Darth Sidious for nothing. Palpatine loved the mind games. Malak, however, was very much the impatient kind. Can't find Bastila after a couple of days (or hours, depending on the source) of searching a planet? Might as well just bombard it. Want to cause pain to someone you hate, even if you're no match for him in a straight-up fight? Cause pain to someone he loves. Why didn't Palpatine let Dooku torture Anakin for a week? Any number of reasons. Take your pick: - Anakin was too young. - Anakin was too untrained in the Force. - Anakin was too unproven in the Force. - The chances that Dooku would willingly create his replacement were slim. - Palpatine wanted a true believer at his side, rather than someone who was forced to turn. - Palpatine liked screwing with people. - Dooku hadn't yet outlived his usefulness. Really, I could probably go on. But, Palpatine's moves didn't really start until the duel with Darth Tyranus on the Invisible Hand. That's when he started really pushing it, when his plans were about to come to fruition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 This is like the Satele/Malgus thing all over again. It didn't take Palpatine 13 years to corrupt Anakin. It took him 13 years to become a trusted adviser to Anakin so that he could corrupt him. It took 13 years of building the kid up, so that he could tear him down in a matter of weeks. You're comparing physical and mental torture to subtle psychological machinations. They're pretty much the exact opposite of each other. He wasn't called Darth Sidious for nothing. Palpatine loved the mind games. Malak, however, was very much the impatient kind. Can't find Bastila after a couple of days (or hours, depending on the source) of searching a planet? Might as well just bombard it. Want to cause pain to someone you hate, even if you're no match for him in a straight-up fight? Cause pain to someone he loves. He set the plan since he met Anakin in the end of TPM. Yes Palpatine is patient, but he would not waste too much energy if he could do it easily by force, at least in PT. And if you watch CW/TCW, the corruption already started since the Clone War, which was 3 years before EP III. Why didn't Palpatine let Dooku torture Anakin for a week? Any number of reasons. Take your pick: - Anakin was too young. - Anakin was too untrained in the Force. - Anakin was too unproven in the Force. - The chances that Dooku would willingly create his replacement were slim. - Palpatine wanted a true believer at his side, rather than someone who was forced to turn. - Palpatine liked screwing with people. - Dooku hadn't yet outlived his usefulness. Really, I could probably go on. But, Palpatine's moves didn't really start until the duel with Darth Tyranus on the Invisible Hand. That's when he started really pushing it, when his plans were about to come to fruition. Bastila was also quite young at that time, and Anakin already showed great promise at least in the end of EP II. Bastila also was quite faithful to Malak before she met Revan, and even after she was redeemed, she was afraid to meet Malak again. It's not like he must kill Dooku right after turned Anakin, like Tenebrous, he could keep 2 apprentices together. And Dooku, according to EP III novel, was going to corrupt Anakin for Palpatine after the duel, of course Palpatine betrayed him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldVengeance Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) I think that's pretty weak from a Dark Lord of the Sith. The non canon DS ending is even worse What the heck is that? It's just disgusting to hear from any Sith, not to say a Dark Lord of the Sith. So? Lots of Sith probably sound pathetic when defeated. Palpatine's last words were "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH" Or to use the opposite extreme as Malak, It's not as if *SW SPOILERS* Darth Baras was any less pathetic with his insane denial after being beaten and humiliated. DEFEND ME! DEFEND THE VOICE! Plus Malak wasn't wrong, even before the fight he complains that "fate and destiny, have conspired to keep you alive Revan." Edited December 10, 2012 by OldVengeance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartanik Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) I remember she said it in the game, and wiki stated it as well. In anycase that wasnt what i was talking about. she being dark side or light side, sith or jedi wont matter, they were not a kind of people to lead their lives by lust or rather to be more correct, those kind of instints. They were not Nihilius wich was an extreme case of complete deteach of reason, dare say conscious. Either Revan or Bastilla were driven by their convictions, they lead their lifes with conscious, as a jedi or sith. It's not like he must kill Dooku right after turned Anakin, like Tenebrous, he could keep 2 apprentices together. And Dooku, according to EP III novel, was going to corrupt Anakin for Palpatine after the duel, of course Palpatine betrayed him. Yeah there can only be two. Palpatine meant to get rid of dooku as he did with Maul or tried anyway if a new more powerfull potencial aprentice were avaible to him. Off couse i belive once the jedi were no more the rule of two wouldnt be as much important. Edited December 10, 2012 by Spartanik Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 So? Lots of Sith probably sound pathetic when defeated. Palpatine's last words were "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH" Or to use the opposite extreme as Malak, It's not as if *SW SPOILERS* Darth Baras was any less pathetic with his insane denial after being beaten and humiliated. DEFEND ME! DEFEND THE VOICE! Plus Malak wasn't wrong, even before the fight he complains that "fate and destiny, have conspired to keep you alive Revan." But he didn't admit he's weak and nothing. Yeah Baras' words are weak as well, but not as weak as Malak, he also said "Victory will be mine!" before his death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldVengeance Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) And he sounded pathetic because those words were hollow. Sometimes you've got to admit you were bested. Plus he didn't say he was weak, he said it wasn't his destiny to rule the galaxy. Edited December 10, 2012 by OldVengeance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 And he sounded pathetic because those words were hollow. Sometimes you've got to admit you were bested. Plus he didn't say he was weak, he said it wasn't his destiny to rule the galaxy. Yeah Malak admitted his defeat that's ok, but I don't like him for saying "You did every thing, I just stole your power, I am nothing." As a Sith he should vow for revenge, as the Sith apprentice of Revan he should believe he would surpass his master. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabstJaif Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 Bastila is long gone in TOR, and maybe he could start a new life, there is nothing wrong with it. Also I think Bastila might also have affair after Revan was gone, at least 20-30 years is hard to endure for a chick like her. Nah. I read the book by Drew Karpyshyn. In the book it stated that Bastila still didn't believe he was dead that she sort of felt his presence but as if it was a great distance away. And it also shows her with her son having kids and her as a single grandmother. It could be that she stayed married to him because she believed him to still be alive... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) Nah. I read the book by Drew Karpyshyn. In the book it stated that Bastila still didn't believe he was dead that she sort of felt his presence but as if it was a great distance away. And it also shows her with her son having kids and her as a single grandmother. It could be that she stayed married to him because she believed him to still be alive... You don't have to be remarried, or totally forget someone to have affair... Edited December 10, 2012 by Slowpokeking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabstJaif Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) It could also depend on if he was legally declared dead... And sorry. I had it in my mind for a second that we were talking about Revan getting a new relationship..not Bastila. My bad Edited December 10, 2012 by JabstJaif Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JabstJaif Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 The other thing to realize is this: If you were lucky enough to actually sleep with Revan...I'm pretty sure everyone else is a letdown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarlesx Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 You don't have to be remarried, or totally forget someone to have affair... You think pretty low of Bastila don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldVengeance Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 (edited) Yeah Malak admitted his defeat that's ok, but I don't like him for saying "You did every thing, I just stole your power, I am nothing." As a Sith he should vow for revenge, as the Sith apprentice of Revan he should believe he would surpass his master. Why would he vow revenge? They both knew it would be an empty threat. Revan defeated him and he realized he had failed in the end to take Revan's spot. He probably realized it was pointless to swear revenge he could never carry out as he was dying and used his last breath on something else. He didn't exactly say "You did everything, I just stole your power" either. Edited December 10, 2012 by OldVengeance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 You think pretty low of Bastila don't you? Personally, I think as a Jedi she's not resilient enough, as a Sith she's obviously not good enough, as a character she's quite interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 Why would he vow revenge? They both knew it would be an empty threat. Revan defeated him and he realized he had failed in the end to take Revan's spot. He probably realized it was pointless to swear revenge he could never carry out as he was dying and used his last breath on something else. He didn't exactly say "You did everything, I just stole your power" either. Then he should avoid defeat, he had the Star Forge and Bastila with him and he still lost against his master, that sucks. Yes. I cannot deny it any longer. You are the one who deserves... who deserves to be the Dark Lord. You were the one who found the first Star Map on Dantooine, Revan, and it was you who led us on our quest for the Star Forge. I only followed in your wake. I tried to usurp your rule, to steal the title of Sith Master from you. But now I understand. The destiny is yours Revan. Not mine. You... you are Darth Revan, Lord... Lord of the Sith. And I... I am nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldVengeance Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 You know I bet a lot of people's problems would have been solved if they had just "avoided defeat." Unfortunately nobody can seem to quite manage that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slowpokeking Posted December 12, 2012 Author Share Posted December 12, 2012 Why didn't Malak make Bastila his lover to further enrage Revan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airmo Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Why didn't Malak make Bastila his lover to further enrage Revan? Hey! HEY! - No!....no! Ok?...ok.. But seriously .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarlesx Posted December 12, 2012 Share Posted December 12, 2012 Why didn't Malak make Bastila his lover to further enrage Revan? Please tell me you are joking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarChompo Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 It's entirely possible for Revan to start a new romance.He is a male. Add a bottle and a girl, instant romance. Yeah, we are that shallow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokestalker Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Revan is pretty cool...Sure..But why does almost everyone on the TOR forums wanna choke on his lightsaber? This is a game, not a soap opera..C,Mon people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red_Ripper Posted December 13, 2012 Share Posted December 13, 2012 Sure I understand, but I doubt she could endure a lone life for 20+ years since she was turned against everything she was taught easily by Malak. It's not evil or wrong, just human's nature. God, this is so sad. Cheating has become human nature... Gotta wonder what's going to happen to a world that considers long-term monogohmy abnormal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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