davaniel Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) Edit: This thread is not particularly, like the title suggests, suggesting that concealment is fine, the title is more meant as some kind of trolling. It's mostly about our night of running a full concealment operatives ranked team. Edited January 10, 2013 by davaniel Unclear title Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerilas Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0X6E3...=youtube_gdata this video does not exist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohto Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0X6E3...=youtube_gdata No video here bro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davaniel Posted January 9, 2013 Author Share Posted January 9, 2013 Bah. Copy paste went wrong, I think I fixed it now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaknaphein Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Poor concealment operative.....you are fine as a mosquito harassing enemies. But that's just it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkchip Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Yes Yes as i have said before and i will have to say again we are fine in PvP. It's PvE that we are having issues any one worth his salt will know that we are fine in PvP if we are played right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tatatan Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 (edited) awesome video!, thanks Question is, if this would be a tactics suistainable??, which i really dont know. I never played like that. Only once i PuGed with like 5ops (rest i dunno) - it was a huttball and we lost like 6-3 or something like that. Another question that comes to my mind is, how would fare 8 assassins? :-) We will see what the new 5 levels will bring. Untill that time, we wont see any class balancing anyway. I hope, Lethality will be able to be more constructive PvP wise. These days, i only play Lethality in PvE and for PvP (if i do some with Op, which is not often nowadays) i respec usually to hybrid healer/concealment. I'd dearly like to play Leth in PvP too, as i like the basic idea behind Leth. Well, we'll see in couple of months. Edited January 10, 2013 by tatatan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
POPsi Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 don't really get the point... in the entire video you killed like 3 people, and demonstrated how you interrupt being a stealther some cap attempts and get stomped afterwards. There is nothing particular neither about the gamestyle, nor about operatives in this video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defecter Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 (edited) I thought this would show an exceptional Operative fighting other classes in a relatively fair fight. Instead, it's a stream of 2 or 3 versus 1 and interrupt tactics on capture points. Not to mention that the team still lost two out of three matches. If anything, this video shows how woefully underpowered concealment operatives are compared to other classes. That all being said, I loved the video and the idea behind it. Especially when everyone is stealthed and the entire opposing team seems to be going 'What the hell...?'. Edited January 10, 2013 by Defecter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davaniel Posted January 10, 2013 Author Share Posted January 10, 2013 don't really get the point... in the entire video you killed like 3 people, and demonstrated how you interrupt being a stealther some cap attempts and get stomped afterwards. There is nothing particular neither about the gamestyle, nor about operatives in this video. Yeah I understand what you're saying, I should've just made the title 'Concealment ranked game' since it was more about that than about how concealment is fine. However, we won one game against a pretty good normal setup ranked team (we had 8 conceal, so no healers), and we lost (and this was silly, forgot to put it in vid) a Novare with 2% left. One of the ancient hypergates was really close but because we had the wrong idea about the points system we decided not to interrupt the cap and pick up a few orbs so as to not feed them kills. The video is not about the concealment playstyle since I'm very much aware that the particular things I'm doing myself with my char (waiting until it's my turn to interrupt) isn't the most awesome you can do with concealment. Concealment ranked, however, is pretty epic, and winning a ranked game like that as well. Sorry if I made it unclear. Hope you can appreciate the video more from this point of view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZUZiK Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 For those that don't get the point. The team was made for fun, not for competitive play. Aerie made this video for entertaining purposes (nice video btw mate). If you don't enjoy it, just move along Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
POPsi Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Yeah I understand what you're saying, I should've just made the title 'Concealment ranked game' since it was more about that than about how concealment is fine. However, we won one game against a pretty good normal setup ranked team (we had 8 conceal, so no healers), and we lost (and this was silly, forgot to put it in vid) a Novare with 2% left. One of the ancient hypergates was really close but because we had the wrong idea about the points system we decided not to interrupt the cap and pick up a few orbs so as to not feed them kills. The video is not about the concealment playstyle since I'm very much aware that the particular things I'm doing myself with my char (waiting until it's my turn to interrupt) isn't the most awesome you can do with concealment. Concealment ranked, however, is pretty epic, and winning a ranked game like that as well. Sorry if I made it unclear. Hope you can appreciate the video more from this point of view. Don't misunderstand me, I'm not saying your are bads or whatsoever. In another thread I actually said that I'd quite enjoy such a setup myself. However, this didn't come through from the video- probably a mistake in the editing, but if I was doing such a video, I'd try to make sure to show some mass ambushes by the team at least, and stuff like that that actually shows how fun it can be doing an all stealther WZ. But this video didn't really show skill, nor the fun factor- I'm not saying there was none, it's just missing from the video Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxtofunator Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Ok, so you run a team made up of 8 characters, all specced the same way, and expect to do well? I understand this is more for fun, which I would honestly do with my friends as well. At the same time though, if you run a team like this in a ranked warzone, expect to be smashed, and hard [pun not intended]. Any time you have 8 dps, and the enemy team has healers, and possibly tanks, it will instantly get harder for you, that is just the nature of this. If you were to run maybe half assassin, half operatives, you would do well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snave Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 Ok, so you run a team made up of 8 characters, all specced the same way, and expect to do well? I understand this is more for fun, which I would honestly do with my friends as well. At the same time though, if you run a team like this in a ranked warzone, expect to be smashed, and hard [pun not intended]. Any time you have 8 dps, and the enemy team has healers, and possibly tanks, it will instantly get harder for you, that is just the nature of this. If you were to run maybe half assassin, half operatives, you would do well. This team was run in a ranked warzone. Granted we only won 1 / 4 games but another 2 of them were razor close and could have quite easily been wins. No one is saying 8 concealment is a great set up, we're not even saying it's fine, this was for fun and it was fun so mission accomplished. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxtofunator Posted January 10, 2013 Share Posted January 10, 2013 This team was run in a ranked warzone. Granted we only won 1 / 4 games but another 2 of them were razor close and could have quite easily been wins. No one is saying 8 concealment is a great set up, we're not even saying it's fine, this was for fun and it was fun so mission accomplished. I did say I understand it was for fun, but other people in here take it as saying operative is either OP still or that they suck, either way they look at it, they are looking at it wrong. My suggestion is that you should make a video run of a full stealth team and see how well that goes, record it, and show people how strong us stealthers are when we unite rather than bicker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randiesel Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) don't really get the point... in the entire video you killed like 3 people, and demonstrated how you interrupt being a stealther some cap attempts and get stomped afterwards. There is nothing particular neither about the gamestyle, nor about operatives in this video. ^ This, lol. It's a video of showing how a bunch of ops pulled subpar damage, all but the one guy who did decent. Edited January 11, 2013 by randiesel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snave Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 ^ This, lol. It's a video of showing how a bunch of ops pulled subpar damage, all but the one guy who did decent. Well the point was for 8 operatives to go and have fun in ranked. Not sure how you can't get that. We took 1 victory and almost took another 2, the tactics we used involved us preventing caps rather than going for out and out damage because with no healers we're never going to win a war of attrition. Maybe you guys can get together and show us how it should be done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randiesel Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Well the point was for 8 operatives to go and have fun in ranked. Not sure how you can't get that. We took 1 victory and almost took another 2, the tactics we used involved us preventing caps rather than going for out and out damage because with no healers we're never going to win a war of attrition. Maybe you guys can get together and show us how it should be done? First off, you're flaunting a title of "operatives are fine" and you've already created at least 3 threads on this, that I've counted at least. I understand you all grouped up for the "fun" of it, which is fine, but you're advertising it as something completely different than your "innocent" reply to my comment. You're throwing it out there as a "look at me and look at how awesome I am" depiction, so you should expect to get negativity. And, as my signature shows I have various toons on various servers. I don't know what server you even play on, but I'd gladly game with/against you if it's on one that I actually play on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wainamoinen Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) There may be some transatlantic misunderstanding. I see the phrase "Concealment is fine!" and take it as being heavily ironic, particularly with the exclamation mark at the end. As in "Concealment isn't fine at all, but look at the funny time we had running 8 of us in a ranked warzone". Only that's really not a very snappy title, so shortened. On the subject of multiple threads posted, I think that was partly down to different people involved in the run posting separately, partly posting on differenet subforums (PvP/Operative), and partly down to enthusiasm after they had a great time. I really didn't get the feeling it was an attempt to claim concealment ops need no improvements to function properly in ranked. In fact, I'm sure ti wasn't. Just a bunch of players who decided to do something fun with the poor, abused class they love and post the results in case others enjoy. More power to their jackbooted imperial elbows. Only the worst kind of Imps would wear elbow jackboots. Edited January 11, 2013 by Wainamoinen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randiesel Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 There may be some transatlantic misunderstanding. I see the phrase "Concealment is fine!" and take it as being heavily ironic, particularly with the exclamation mark at the end. As in "Concealment isn't fine at all, but look at the funny time we had running 8 of us in a ranked warzone". Only that's really not a very snappy title, so shortened. On the subject of multiple threads posted, I think that was partly down to different people involved in the run posting separately, partly posting on differenet subforums (PvP/Operative), and partly down to enthusiasm after they had a great time. I really didn't get the feeling it was an attempt to claim concealment ops need no improvements to function properly in ranked. In fact, I'm sure ti wasn't. Just a bunch of players who decided to do something fun with the poor, abused class they love and post the results in case others enjoy. More power to their jackbooted imperial elbows. Only the worst kind of Imps would wear elbow jackboots. Ok, we'll said. In a different light I see your point. But still no need to make multiple threads. And my post wasn't even as negative as the one I quoted. I skipped around the video a bit, but all I saw was a bunch of interrupting from stealth using rifle shot instead of HS, OS used by a bunch of guys and not actually engaging in head to head combat. The object of the game IS fun, so that's hat you guys were doing and I respect that. Just there are, as mentioned, several threads about this already and the "concealment is fine" or "concealment is underpowered" arguments are already a sore topic for all, so just expect comments of all kinds, positive an negative, when posting something on the topic. Honestly, just have thicker skin. Let some stuff roll off your back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynfast Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 1st point for doin this was for the lols. But theres also sooo many posts qqn operatives arent viable in ranked and havin even 1 of them in your ranked setup is stupid. So id say its hardly unviable as we won a game there against proper setup team with 8 so ´´unviable´´ concealment operatives. And with no heals or tank whence our ''borin'' interrupt play. Wzs arent won by dmg only fyi. But do you expect any other dps class to survive in the open against proper setup team? And our ranked team usually has 1 concealment operative in its setup. And i would even say a stealth team with 2 tanksins, 2 op healers and mix of sin and op dps would be lethal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randiesel Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Yeah, and that's fine. But actually lots of stuff in the video could've been accomplished with an 8 man medic team, i.e. strolling up o someone capping a node while in stealth and using rit shot to interrupt them. You don't need 8 concs to achieve that. The core of how concealment is played was never once depicted, meaning opening up AB > HS, bursting down opponents and showing that concealment is viable as a spec to kill your opponent. All I saw were interrupts running from opponents, traveling between nodes and rinse/repeating. I'm not saying anything other than the core functionality and usability of concealment were never actually shown. You won your matches and had fun doing so. I don't have any videos where I can go "this is better and shows how it should be done". I'm merely expressing what I got out of the video, which I would say could've been accomplished by a team of medics as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randiesel Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wJsjqqkWHKg A quick YouTube search and I saw essentially what I would've expected to find given the title. This link has a breakdown showing how the Scrapper overcomes our weaknesses. Your video shows you guys getting together to have fun. All good, just expected to see something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lynfast Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 Yeah, and that's fine. But actually lots of stuff in the video could've been accomplished with an 8 man medic team, i.e. strolling up o someone capping a node while in stealth and using rit shot to interrupt them. You don't need 8 concs to achieve that. The core of how concealment is played was never once depicted, meaning opening up AB > HS, bursting down opponents and showing that concealment is viable as a spec to kill your opponent. All I saw were interrupts running from opponents, traveling between nodes and rinse/repeating. I'm not saying anything other than the core functionality and usability of concealment were never actually shown. You won your matches and had fun doing so. I don't have any videos where I can go "this is better and shows how it should be done". I'm merely expressing what I got out of the video, which I would say could've been accomplished by a team of medics as well. Well then it wouldnt have been 8 man concealment team wouldnt it? And we wouldnt have won that ciwil war as medics. Sadly idk if Aeriy recorded the novare match cos the openin of it was a total rape to the opposin team. http://www.twitch.tv/s7elioss/b/355230292 check the stream at 1h18min mark for the match if your interested, the openin kinda portrays concealment effectiveness you were lookin for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnaje Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Well then it wouldnt have been 8 man concealment team wouldnt it? And we wouldnt have won that ciwil war as medics. Sadly idk if Aeriy recorded the novare match cos the openin of it was a total rape to the opposin team. http://www.twitch.tv/s7elioss/b/355230292 check the stream at 1h18min mark for the match if your interested, the openin kinda portrays concealment effectiveness you were lookin for. Thanks for the stream link. I enjoyed it very much. More so since it showed how others react to concealment. Shocked when they see or get jumped by them and annoyance (or being effective). It appears to me that stealth is the only thing that made their team effective though. They died more then they killed, didn't have much for objective points, and all but 1 had crap dmg (and that 1's dmg was ok). This makes me wonder two things: 1. If a team of assassins could be more effective since they could live longer and get to the objectives quicker. 2. If Infiltrate could be changed a little to be more effective. Since stealth was the only thing that kept them in that match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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