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Gamebreaking behaviour within hardmode flashpoints


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There has always been some kind of mobskipping in either small or large scale in flashpoints but the latest trend is simply wrong.

 

It seems that teams doing flashpoints skip some of the bosses and have no respect for the ones that are signing up to get better gear.

 

Please respect the players that join flashpoints with groupfinder to gear up, it is enough to wait for ages for them to pop.

 

Alternatively Bioware could make the flashpoint not complete unless all bosses are dead (the way it should be)

 

Thoughts?

 

Is it fair to ignore players in the team that needs gear and steamroll through the flashpoint not listening at all?

Edited by Icestar
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The free recruit gear mk-2 you get now is generally equal, and in some cases better better, than the gear you get from hardmode flashpoint bosses. The quickest way to gear up would be to get to the end to get the columi piece.

 

That said, I'm not one to oppose fighting bosses if some one's in the mood for it, it can be fun, but it is not necessary to gear up.

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I have no problem with this practice at all. Skipping bosses and as much trash as possible means better gear, faster.

 

What about the players in the team asking to kill all bosses since they can drop something they need?

 

This game is about progression. First you get gear from heroics, then you go to other like OP. But first you have to get there and wih all this boss skipping it will take ages.

 

If not be able to gear up in the first place what is the point of ths entire system? Bosses should not be able to be avoided. I dont care how many mobs we skil along the way but the bosses needs to be killed.

 

I would say it is outright rude not to respect someone in team needing a special boss and team members respond "sorry no time only runs this FP for comms".

 

Just let all the bosses be killed before the flashpoint can be completed, problem solved in many ways.

 

Next time you see someone write in chat that they need to kill the bosses, please listen.

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If you can skip bosses you should, if you know you need something from that boss then say that to your group if they are skipping it and they will naturally kill it, if not, just pull and they have to kill it :D

 

I just ran into a group. told them many times and they refused to attack bosses they could skip, they only wanted the comms and be over with it.

 

Many bosses has random set item. It is very hard to specify if that will drop so it is better to kill boss and find out.

Edited by Icestar
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i agree op.

 

in 1.3 the loot tables have been upgraded for those of you that didn't know and or just came back to the game. all bosses with the exception of the first ones now can drop columni or columni grade gear. some also still have their old tionesse drops too which can lead to some of the confusion. but the issue isn't the lack of knowledge but rather being selfish, not caring and wanting to get the black hole coms in the fastest possible means. usually these same people whine and complain about that under geared 50, whom they view as a speed bump in their race, only to speed by every boss that could drop something to help that 50 out. the operations are not much different either.

 

i can tell you one thing. if i was a f2p player which just hit 50 and then bought a week pass to run this content to check it out. then when doing so only to have players race through the zone not allowing me a chance of getting gear or enjoying my game experience i most certainly would not subscribe to this game.

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Sometimes the skipping behaviour makes no sense at all. Some examples:

 

  1. They skip a mini-boss which would go down in no time and drops a daily comm for everybody (nice especially before there was Section X). Then after the FP they pack the a*** lube, travel to belsavis or ilum and get themselves ****** in the *** for several minutes per daily comm.
  2. Skipping a mini-boss that drops a BOE columi implant - a fair amount of money per time, even multiplied by the chance of 1/4 to win the roll.
  3. The obvious stupidity that the thread starter stated. I just was on a HM FP with a very experienced tank, but on that char he just turned 50 and was in full recruit gear. But he insisted in skipping even the bosses that drop Xenotech gear (the one with the same rating as Columi?).

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I just ran into a group. told them many times and they refused to attack bosses they could skip, they only wanted the comms and be over with it.

 

Many bosses has random set item. It is very hard to specify if that will drop so it is better to kill boss and find out.

 

This has become a very frustrating problem. I have geared characters myself but I would never dream of not killing a boss that could give someone a upgrade, infact it really upsets me.

 

I always check my own gear and others if they have lower hp then usual and say "Lets do all bosses, we have players in team that nees do to them"

 

Last night I did 6 Heroics using groupfinder and in only one of them we killed everything but in the other 5 there were problems. One tank even left in the start saying "I only do fast runs" when we politely said that we need to kill all bosses to gear up.

 

I wonder why this mechanics even is in play, to steamroll through the instance getting a few comms while the rest of the team that needs to be there and upgrade for tuture content gets left behind.

 

I can understand the need to skip regular mobs, they dont give anything useful in general at level 50 but to skip bosses is plain dumb unless all in the team got what they need.

 

As a DPS it can take around 30 minutes to 2-3 hours to get a pop with groupfinder and it is REALLY frustrating to hear that the only way the flashpoint is going to be made is a super quickrun straight to the final boss.

 

This needs to be diskussed, perhaps BIOWARE can implement some kind of lock that the flashpoint can´t complete without all bosses dead. That would be awesome and save alot of griefing from players that fail to understand that others need to gear up aswell, not only run fast through for a few comms.

Edited by Icestar
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One tank even left in the start saying "I only do fast runs" when we politely said that we need to kill all bosses to gear up.

He did smart thing, no reason to paint him as bad guy. His time wasn't wasted on something he doesn't enjoy(slow run), your time wasn't wasted on something you don't want(skipping bosses). Can't really blame him for that, as it's better than demanding that group submits to his will. He leaves and gives you chance for someone that will be willing to do same thing as you want.

 

 

I can understand the need to skip regular mobs, they dont give anything useful in general at level 50

Not true. They allow you to play the game. Kill stuff, tank stuff, heal stuff. They give experience of doing that stuff. Just like people might need gear, they also might need practice. And running around mobs doing everything in your power to avoid aggro range can get just as boring as fighing 57th trash pack

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I've had the same issue. I don't mind fighting bosses if we have the ability to get a good drop from that Boss. I got a Xenotech headpiece for my Mara that I would not have received if we had skipped the boss. It's still more powerful than the Tionese or Columi headgear in game. At the same time, my main aim now is more comms so I have no issue with skipping content to get to the end to get those comms.

 

I think it should be agreed upon when the match starts whether the group is skipping or pulling all bosses. If they are ok with fighting the bosses then stay. If not then leave. Don't be surprised if you have to wait longer for the queue though. Other option is doing a FP with memebers of your guild and letting them know what you need or friends you meet throughout the game.

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Bioware gives out free gear to fresh 50s now that is better than what the skippable bosses drop. There is really no reason to do them...But if someone asks, I will usually do them.

 

That being said, OP, you really need to keep in mind that you are basically being carried for free loot by your groups, so you really don't have much right to complain.

Edited by Icebergy
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tbh skipping trash is getting more and more anoying. Sometimes i like killing most trash for no other reason than to kill trash. Experiense the FP as it was ment to be experienced. Lately i have been plaing mostly new alts, and some people even skip in normal mode. Most times i can persuade people to do bonusboss and bonus objectives, but i just dont understand why everyone dont wanna do all bonusobjectives in a FP while leveling.

 

In Kaon and Lost Island we allways kill bonus boss when we do a guildrun. I know they dont drop upgrade, i´m not even sure they drop upgrades for any companon anymore, but we like completing a FP, and they are nice bossfights. Better than the average FP bossfight anyways.

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I can't help but agree with the original poster here. Although I don't benefit from any of the hm drops or the bh comms anymore, I'll often que up just for something to do. It can be really frustrating to wait in que just to blow past everything.

 

What's even more frustrating is getting a group with a newish player who doesn't know how to skip. The rest of the group just blows ahead while the other guy is still getting on his speeder, and when somebody accidentally pulls the group is so spaced out it's near impossible to recover. Worst case scenario someboby ends up quitting because their speed run didn't go exactly as planned, when the wipe could have been avoided by a quick explaination.

Edited by Fiamma_Verde
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Bioware gives out free gear to fresh 50s now that is better than what the skippable bosses drop. There is really no reason to do them...But if someone asks, I will usually do them.

 

That being said, OP, you really need to keep in mind that you are basically being carried for free loot by your groups, so you really don't have much right to complain.

 

Hold on here for a moment, "carried by the team" ?

 

First : This is not a post about somebody getting carried by the team, it is about players skipping bosses incase you forgot I remind you again.

 

Second : This game and many other games are all about natural progression, you do something a little harder for your level and then get rewarded and so on. WoW for example as everyone knows has done this for almost 10 years and so do SWTOR. No player wants to enter a flashpoint killing grey mobs cheering they got that old rusty pickaxe that someone left there 1000 years ago.

 

Thirdly : Nobody has left the team because of anyone having bad gear, getting free loot it is not what this thread is about.

 

I am not even sure you read my original post but please do it again.

 

It is about the increasing problems with hard flaspoints where those that join them do not have even the opportunity to gear up since everything circles around completing the flashpoint quickest possible for some few comms.

Edited by Icestar
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What's even more frustrating is getting a group with a newish player who doesn't know how to skip. The rest of the group just blows ahead while the other guy is still getting on his speeder, and when somebody accidentally pulls the group is so spaced out it's near impossible to recover. Worst case scenario someboby ends up quitting because their speed run didn't go exactly as planned, when the wipe could have been avoided by a quick explaination.

Honestly, Battle of Ilum is the HM FP with most wipes and quits of all, including LI HM. And that even though it is one of the easiest, no matter if you skip or not. Once for example there was a commando healer with us on his first 50, and they didn't take the time to explain, wait for him etc. So he kept pulling aggro or dying from environment, and sometimes they tried to go back to help him and pulled another group on the way. Soon it was only him and me (gunnery commando). We played the entire FP alone with companions, skipping only the hardest bosses, which took a while. After our first wipe at the final boss, GF found 2 people for us.

 

I've played it with 2 dps + 2 companions before, and it was no problem at all. It's not hard, but very prone to wipes due to impatience and lack of communication.

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I hate when people skip. There are a dozen reasons not to:

 

1.) Daily comms drop off most mini bosses and some main bosses. Right now, almost everyone can benifit from daily comms. The list of things to buy and why are just to many to list.

 

2.). Every boss drops at least tionese crystals. Off hand weapons are cheap, 14 comms and 20 crystals (I think) and sell for 12.5k. Most runs will net you enough to buy at least 2. That's 25k, more than you get for the daily it's self.

 

3.). All the trash loot that can be sold to boost your income. With alot of playerd complaining about being poor, I don't know why more people are maximizeing thier credits potential.

 

4.). BoEs that can be sold from bosses and trash loot. Not to mention chances on Columi implants and ear pieces that can be dropped. Could be sold or go to companions. I personally love to send them to alts. Help get them into flashpoints without being a leeching scrub in recruit gear.

 

5.). Legacy xp. I know, some people don't care. But some do.

 

You see, there are alot of reasons to do all the bosses and clear the content. Notice that those are all selfish reasons and helping people gear up wasn't even mentioned. The next time you want to be selfish, at least do it right. And o yeah, bio and scavaging can get mats in the runs that they can either sell or make crafted goods for use or resale.

 

My #1 reason to not skip: needless wipes thwt cost me credits. >:(

Edited by AidanLightwalker
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This has become a very frustrating problem. I have geared characters myself but I would never dream of not killing a boss that could give someone a upgrade, infact it really upsets me.

 

I always check my own gear and others if they have lower hp then usual and say "Lets do all bosses, we have players in team that nees do to them"

 

Last night I did 6 Heroics using groupfinder and in only one of them we killed everything but in the other 5 there were problems. One tank even left in the start saying "I only do fast runs" when we politely said that we need to kill all bosses to gear up.

 

I wonder why this mechanics even is in play, to steamroll through the instance getting a few comms while the rest of the team that needs to be there and upgrade for tuture content gets left behind.

 

I can understand the need to skip regular mobs, they dont give anything useful in general at level 50 but to skip bosses is plain dumb unless all in the team got what they need.

 

As a DPS it can take around 30 minutes to 2-3 hours to get a pop with groupfinder and it is REALLY frustrating to hear that the only way the flashpoint is going to be made is a super quickrun straight to the final boss.

 

This needs to be diskussed, perhaps BIOWARE can implement some kind of lock that the flashpoint can´t complete without all bosses dead. That would be awesome and save alot of griefing from players that fail to understand that others need to gear up aswell, not only run fast through for a few comms.

 

Funny you should mention this, seeing as I was being rushed by an undergeared DPS SORC through Battle of Illum. I wanted to kill bosses, they wanted a comm run. Needless to say it became a comm run.

 

Still tho, this is ridiculous, if you don't like to skip mobs and love to spend 30-1hr clearing 1 flashpoint in the time you could clear 2-3 flashpoints for bigger and better gear in less than 45 minutes, by all means stay out of my group and find another. As a tank I take the stance of: If its skippable, we're skipping it, and if you pull it, I'm going to taunt it off of you, hold aggro, and then once their down chide you about how to skip bosses. Some of us 50's don't have all day to spend on one instance to gear up one player. And to be frank? You wanna gear up at end-game? Find a good raiding guild to carry you through some SM EV or SM KP. The only real benefits of HM FP's right now is the Black Hole comms, unless they change drops.

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I miss swg..

where you could kill 1000th's of nightsisters to finally get the Sith 4/5 holocron after trying for a month or more

and where you could kill 1000th's of ancient krayt dragons to get ancient flawless pearls

 

And this was in the NGE. I have been told that in Pre-cu much more grinding was involved. And here we are, people wanting to be really quick.

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Random columi / xenotech armour pieces do drop from most boss' loot tables now. Gearing in full 56's is faster if you kill most of the bosses, with the exception of skipping mini boss at the end of bonus objectives.

 

It is harmful to some to complete flashpoints in this manner. But as always using the group-finder is a gamble, and odds are group-finder matches are doing it for the black hole comms, not the columi gear. Find a group of like-minded people and make a guild, and do flashpoints together.

 

Until bioware design flashpoints with trash you can't skip, people will skip.

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if you don't like to skip mobs and love to spend 30-1hr clearing 1 flashpoint in the time you could clear 2-3 flashpoints for bigger and better gear in less than 45 minutes

 

I am not even remotely talking about staying and clearing trashmobs, this is about the skipped bosses who are usually very close to the players eventhough they decide to run by.

 

We are talking perhaps 3-7 minutes extra of their time to kill the boss, get the loot and move on.

 

Please dont think that I am defending killing trash, I am all up for skipping trash. It is the bosses that drop loot that is the problem when they are not killed.

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For every group you get that wants to skip all of Battle of Ilum, I get Directive 7 or False Emperor where you basically have to kill it all. Just deal

 

Gearing up through FPs is waste of time anyway. Grab your recruit set and hit up the SM ops. More level 56 than you can shake a lightsaber at.

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For every group you get that wants to skip all of Battle of Ilum, I get Directive 7 or False Emperor where you basically have to kill it all. Just deal

 

Gearing up through FPs is waste of time anyway. Grab your recruit set and hit up the SM ops. More level 56 than you can shake a lightsaber at.

^^this

 

if you want to run a fp in a certain way there is certainly nothing stopping you from forming your own group via general chat on fleet

in fact, i bet there are scores of players looking for the same thing- you just need to advertise it

 

group finder results in having to go along to get along more often than not so use each feature accordingly

expecting random que'ers to lollygag (which is how it is seen to the players just wanting to finish already yesterday) through a flashpoint is a lot to ask

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