Greetings everyone!

 

This post will be about how to reach for the most optimal dps PvE endgame setup for Operations as a dps Scoundrel. Our Operative brothers are ofcourse more than welcome to chime in aswell. Im asking about both our dps trees here, Scrapper (Concealment) and Dirty Fighting (Lethality). Please keep the diskussion about how to do it rather than "it's impossible, reroll Sentinel".

 

Backgroundwise: I have been playing SWTOR since beta and have mained a Jedi Guardian as a tank most of that time. I have some alts the most important once are an Operative lvl50 and now a Scoundrel lvl50. I've played PvP extensively on my Scoundrel and have had much fun and success, now I've decided it's time to try out the PvE arena aswell.

 

I seem to be one of those people who just have to do what I'm not suppose to and after reading month after month how utterly useless a Scoundrel is dpswise I just had to try it out for myself.

 

What I would like to ask are some fairly basic questions about Stats, Skills and trees.

 

 

What stats should I aim for and why? (Cunning, Power, Accuracy, Crit, Surge and so on)

Is there a difference between Scrapper and Dirty Fighting?

More crit for DF to ensure regen etc?

 

For reference I know about critrating/crit from cunning vs %, ergo I know about the DR curves and how they work (kudos to this forum for that, thx )

 

 

Which skill tree is preferable and why?

I feel most at home playing Scrapper, but is that a good tree for the Operationsarena? Pros/Cons?

Are hybridbuilds an option or is it always more preferable to go all the way up in one or the other?

 

Many fights revolve around miniburstphases on the one hand which suits Scrapper, but on the other hand the lack of a take down skill like "Cold Blooded" in the DF tree should hurt Scrapper or..?

 

 

On a somewhat related topic, I read that the skill Flash Powder doesn't work on Ops Bosses, is this true? If it's not true then that could be some of the utility I feel we could use as a class for Bossfights.

 

 

Many thanks for your thoughts!

 

Regards,

 

Belem

my scoundrel and operative are still lowbie, but my main since launch is a gunslinger, and for PvE the dirty fighting tree is great DPS.

Without your offhand firing on wounding shots you loose some dps compared to a GS, but you should still be able to hit 1500-1900dps on the ops dummy with dirty fighting.

 

here is the skill layout I'd recommend

 

DF tree

Flash Powder doesn't work on bosses, because CC doesn't work on bosses. The tooltip reads that it reduces accuracy "after flashbang ends" If it never begins, it never ends. Edited February 18, 2013 by bbare

Thx for your replys friends!

 

Smellmop thx for the tree and advise, Ill take your build out for a spin and Bbare thx for the clarification. Its a shame about Flash Powder, it could have been such a nice utility for us.

 

But what about stats for PvE then?

 

For a Scrapper, which is what Ive been playing most of my time, in a PvP environment Accuracy is useless as far as I know, but Im guessing thats not the case in Bossfights. I have only limited knowledge about PvE stat weights so I could use some advise. Here is what I am aiming for right or wrong:

 

* Get mods and enhancements with the highest secondary stat (crit/power) for an increased overall statpool at the exspense of a little lower cunning and endurance.

 

* Alacrity isnt that useful as far as I can see on a dps Scoundrel no matter what spec, so that has the lowest priority

 

* Accuracy.. Im unsure about this one, Ive read that bosses in general have somewhere between 6-8% defence rating, so Im assuming its a good idea to have 6-8% accuracy. Correct?

 

* Otherwise its the basic lineup without skillpoints, but with classbuffs:

36ish % crit (with companion affectionbonus)

75ish Surge ( with companion affectionbonus)

and the rest in power

 

Surge will be higher as I will actively avoid Alacrity.

 

 

Thx again for taking the time to help out an old grissled backshooter!

 

Belem

Hey there,

 

my main is a scoundrel, which I usually heal with but a quarter of the time I love to dps with. They are a very difficult class to pve dps with and that is what turns people off from it. This doesn't mean that they are terrible at it, just the difficulty pushes people away from it. Scrappers are in the lower end of the pve dps list right now (Dirty Fighting is pretty good though, fyi) but a lot of that is people can't play it correctly. I myself am not perfect/great, but I am trying.

 

The main source of frustration is the energy bar that you are given. When you go below 60 points it slows down the regen so you want to stay above it MOST of the time. While gunslingers/snipers have a similar energy bar, theirs is a little easier since they have more cast bars that give them more time to recover energy. Scrappers instantly burn them.

 

Scrapper dps keys:

-Keep your bleeds up as much as possible. Flechette Round and vital shot will be doing good damage per energy spent on them. They also proc sucker punch to flying fists.

-Keep 1 level of upper hand up at all times. It increases your damage (though I think they should increase it a bit more)

-Precast Freighter FlyBy. If you can in a fight use it on rotation for a stationary boss. If not stationary use Sabo Charge.

-Dont use Overloaded shot, or whatever that 10m skill is called, its a waste of energy. Use Termal grenade if you have to be 30 meters.

-Your ranged attacks arent great, but not worthless.

-Know when to blow all your energy. Certain fights give you small windows to do a lot of damage (SOA, Kephess fights). Don't blow all of your energy at the beginning though, wait a little for others to apply their damage debuffs and then when the time period is about over, open up with everything!

 

Gear:

The 4 piece pve dps scrapper set is your best one right now with the increase to backblast damage and also the +5 energy. You may not think that 5 energy is much, but it gives you more to work with cause you start at 105, not 100, and so you can use 45 instead of 40 comfortably. Before the battlemaster gunslinger 2 piece was the best with the 2 piece enforcer, but now its the 4 piece enforcer, bummer.

 

You want the PVE and PVP Boundless Ages Relics. Use the PVE one when you have the energy to put out a lot of damage, like at the beginning of the fight and whenever you can Shoot First.

 

Stats- Cunning>Power imo cause of the crit bonus from Cunning, but power is great too. Crit to 350ish. Crit diminishing returns is not based on your overall crit, which comes from buffs/main stat/secondary stat, but on your Critical rating. Scoundrels get damage buffs on crits, so you WANT crits. Accuracy I used to get none but now I want a little (2 enhancements) and the rest into surge.

 

Scrapper dps is a rhythm dps style, which some people don't like. You don't want to use all of your skills on cooldown, just the best ones that won't hurt your energy regen.

Edited February 19, 2013 by CJAShadow

Outstanding, thanks a bunch for taking your time to help me out!

 

Hmm, perhaps my rotation/priority needs a bit of work then.. well off to find my ex then (Operations dummy)

 

Thanks again!

 

* Get mods and enhancements with the highest secondary stat (crit/power) for an increased overall statpool at the exspense of a little lower cunning and endurance.

 

* Alacrity isnt that useful as far as I can see on a dps Scoundrel no matter what spec, so that has the lowest priority

 

* Accuracy.. Im unsure about this one, Ive read that bosses in general have somewhere between 6-8% defence rating, so Im assuming its a good idea to have 6-8% accuracy. Correct?

 

* Otherwise its the basic lineup without skillpoints, but with classbuffs:

36ish % crit (with companion affectionbonus)

75ish Surge ( with companion affectionbonus)

and the rest in power

 

Surge will be higher as I will actively avoid Alacrity.

 

a couple things. you are 100% correct on going with mods/enhancements with higher secondary stats.

 

for DPS, you are generally going to decide between accuracy and surge. it is very possible, with fully optimized endgame gear, to reach 75% surge and 110% tech accuracy.

 

you will not get 'higher surge because you're not taking alacrity' because it should not fit into the equation period.

 

 

 

that said, the only ranged attack i use is flurry of bolts, so any amount of accuracy i have affects that one skill only. i don't even slot quickshot. so instead of having much higher surge because i'm ditching alacrity, i have much higher surge because i'm dumping accuracy.

 

raid bosses have 10% defense, so ideally, that is your goal if you have a lot of ranged attacks. as i already said, since i'm only using one ranged attack (that accounts for 6-7% of my overall dps), my current build has exactly 1% bonus accuracy from max companion affection, and 30.12% surge bonus (80.12% crit multiplier)

anyone can easily take one enhancement, implant, or earpiece with surge and replace it with accuracy and lose minimal crit multiplier and gain a few % of accuracy. once you are at 77-78% crit multiplier, no matter what you put in after that will have a fairly minimal impact on your overall dps.

Edited March 1, 2013 by oaceen

I've mainly played as a healer on both my Scoundrel and Operative but am starting to look into dirty fighting dps now and from what i've learned so far you will want as much cunning as you can then ~110 accuracy and 30% crit. Then you can just get your power and alacrity as you want it. Alacrity is going to change in 2.0 though so that might mix things up abit. Edited February 24, 2013 by Amlici

Thx again for the informative replys friends!

 

Ive been away for a few days so I apologize for the late awnser. I have also been trying to absorb all the new information for 2.0. I have to say that Im causiously optimistic about alot of the stuff they have in store for us and overall the changes seam to have some form of thoughtprocess attached to them. The community is also responding well to try and work out the most glaring gaps BW might have missed.

 

That being said I think this thread needs to take a nap for now and be reawakened when 2.0 is out. It is still a worthwhile diskussion, but for now it seams sort of pointless.

 

See you Starside!

 

Belem

want as much cunning as you can then ~110 accuracy

 

If we are still talking about the current game, then accuracy is not what you should prioritize next after cunning.

In fact accuracy is your least important stat.

 

Currently (in 1.7) bosses or any pve mobs do not have any "defense" against tech attacks, but only against ranged (that are by ability type defined as ranged) attacks

 

Tech attacks have 100% base accuracy and accuracy over 100% reduces the targets resist chance, but since all pve mobs currently have 0 resist chance, accuracy does not benefit tech attacks at all. Since like 99% of your dps will be tech attacks accuracy is nearly useless. (Note: This will change in 2.0 when PvE enemies will have resistance and accuracy does become useful and important for all classes)

 

The defense chance of bosses applies only against ranged attacks.

So the only attacks that scoundrel has that can be dodged by the bosses defense chance are Flurry of Bolts, Charged Burst, Quick Shot and Blaster Volley.

Furthermore, the only one attack that can miss even on targets without defense is Flurry of Bolts.

Quick Shot and Charged Burst are not even part of your normal attack rotation at all, and Blaster Volley is very situational, so it really comes down to benefitting your Flurry of Bolts only.

 

So you really should be prioritizing getting other stats up (mainly Surge which is the one that occupies same itemization slots as accuracy) before you put any accuracy at all in your gear.

 

And as said, this is as it is now, accuracy is almost useless.

 

Of course this will change in 2.0. Then accuracy will actually be the most important secondary stat for all dps, but even then you don't want 110% ranged accuracy.

 

You will want 100% ranged (basic attack) accuracy, which will be 110% special attack and 110% tech accuracy.

(note that special attack is not the same thing as tech attack, but even your ranged attacks except one are special attacks with 100% base accuracy too, and Flurry of Bolts is the only basic attack with 90% base accuracy)

Going beyond 100% ranged basic attack accuracy, will not benefit any other abilities except Flurry of Bolts

Edited March 1, 2013 by Eternalnight

If we are still talking about the current game, then accuracy is not what you should prioritize next after cunning.

In fact accuracy is your least important stat.

 

Currently (in 1.7) bosses or any pve mobs do not have any "defense" against tech attacks, but only against ranged (that are by ability type defined as ranged) attacks

 

Tech attacks have 100% base accuracy and accuracy over 100% reduces the targets resist chance, but since all pve mobs currently have 0 resist chance, accuracy does not benefit tech attacks at all. Since like 99% of your dps will be tech attacks accuracy is nearly useless. (Note: This will change in 2.0 when PvE enemies will have resistance and accuracy does become useful and important for all classes)

 

The defense chance of bosses applies only against ranged attacks.

So the only attacks that scoundrel has that can be dodged by the bosses defense chance are Flurry of Bolts, Charged Burst, Quick Shot and Blaster Volley.

Furthermore, the only one attack that can miss even on targets without defense is Flurry of Bolts.

Quick Shot and Charged Burst are not even part of your normal attack rotation at all, and Blaster Volley is very situational, so it really comes down to benefitting your Flurry of Bolts only.

 

So you really should be prioritizing getting other stats up (mainly Surge which is the one that occupies same itemization slots as accuracy) before you put any accuracy at all in your gear.

 

And as said, this is as it is now, accuracy is almost useless.

 

Of course this will change in 2.0. Then accuracy will actually be the most important secondary stat for all dps, but even then you don't want 110% ranged accuracy.

 

You will want 100% ranged (basic attack) accuracy, which will be 110% special attack and 110% tech accuracy.

(note that special attack is not the same thing as tech attack, but even your ranged attacks except one are special attacks with 100% base accuracy too, and Flurry of Bolts is the only basic attack with 90% base accuracy)

Going beyond 100% ranged basic attack accuracy, will not benefit any other abilities except Flurry of Bolts

 

This ^^.

 

As game is now (1.7), accuracy and alacrity are both completely worthless for scrapper spec. Every ability can't miss and has no cast time. I stacked crti rating till about 400, then just slammed the power on all the way. For what it's worth, unstimmed but buffed, in about 1/2 61 and 1/2 63, I can hit around 1600-1700 dps on a 5 minutes parse. With a stim and the rest of my gear in 63's I am guessing I would hit around 1800.

 

2.0 will change how you optimize the end game scrapper so drastically that I don't think you should even attempt to optimize until 2.0 comes out. That is just my opinion of course.

 

 

The one upshot to this lack of accuracy/alacrity on the current config means you are geared perfectly well to be an excellent healer as well!. Just respec your points, arrange your bars, and 20 seconds later you are a healer.