I haven't read if you are denied to ability to earn planetary comms for missions below your current level, and I am highly concerned how this change to the comms system will impact the GTN and crafters. I apologize if this is too long for you to read, as most forum-ites have the attention span of a knat... but I feel this is something that needs to be addressed, or at least discussed.

So traditionally, the commendations for a particular planet were only really useful to you if you were properly leveled for the planet. If you were overleveled, the comms were no good to you, leading a lot of people to horde them (bad), or dump them for gear to sell to other players (good). I think the new system of planetary comms is meant to make comms more generally useful to the player that earned them in that regard. If you're underleveled, you always need that better gear, but if you're overleveled, lacking gear at your level never hurts you because you're already more powerful than the challenges you're going to be facing.

However, much of the GTN is dedicated to providing a player-to-player system to obtain the upgrades a player needs, precisely when he needs them - and thus an economy is formed. If you wish to level your character's gear beyond what your current comms can support, you use your credits on the GTN to get the gear you need. This provides a service to the player, but also a means of income for crafters and other players to earn money creating and selling goods for others.

My fear is that the new system ruins this economy by allowing players to trade comms earned at low levels to be used for goods at high levels, thus eliminating the need to participate in missions (for credits and materials) and the larger economy to maintain gear leveling. Worse, I fear that if there is no system in place (and I haven't yet heard of any) to prevent players from earning comms for grey-leveled missions, it will allow players to go replay missions on previous planets and earn comms they can use on higher level ones - which can be, certainly, game-breaking.

Obviously, a mission on Coruscant does not have the same difficulty, nor does it offer the same experience or monetary/gear reward, as one on Corellia... but under the new planetary comms system, a comm earned in either has the same value, and the items that can be purchases with said comms are of the same price. But clearly a level 10 gear mod does not have the same value as a level 50 one, and yet the new comms system makes it so, and gives players equal access to either... this, essentially defeats the purpose of having a GTN for gear leveling and for crafting in general.

Why such a system was implemented, but prices not adjusted in the vendors, is beyond my understanding. For such a system of universal currency to work, as in any other scenario, items of higher value have to cost more. A Corellian mod should cost significantly more comms than a Coruscant one... but it did not appear that this was so when I checked. Bioware must either return an individual planet comms system, or BETTER, level the prices with the value of the mods. It's the only way to make the system fair.

Otherwise, players MUST be prevented from earning comms from lower level missions, using mods earned from lower level missions on higher level gear, or being able to horde more comms than it takes to buy the highest level gear at any planetary vendor... thus ensuring comms can only be used for gear appropriate to the planet in which they're earned, or for the next upcoming planet (for over-leveled players) - no highe - and giving players incentived to use their comms when they earn themr.

An alternative would be a system like I was told existed in the beta, where lower-level planet comms could be traded for higher level ones at a reduced value... much like the warzone-to-planetary comm trade works. This system would have been greatly preferrable to the system that was implemented for planetary comms.

Anyone else share this concern?

I completely see the (possible) economy issue. But, I do not believe the answer is to remove the potential to earn a reward just because you outlevel content. A person who does a lot of flashpoints, PvP, or all quests will eventually outlevel a lot of the content in the game. Now you're penalizing the player for not following a strict system of "level this fast for this reward or else" and I don't think that's the right direction.

I'm sorry I don't have a solution to the (possible) economy issue, but two wrongs don't make a right to me.

you can only have 50 coms at any given time. you HAVE to spend them before you can earn more. coupled with time it takes to travel between planets and how much quicker it is to earn gold through dailies and high level quests? and doing low level quests for coms becomes not worth the bother.

people who've been buying gear on GTN, will continue to do so. people who crafted it for themselves, will continue to do so. and people who like me, spent coms on upgrades at the time of finishing the planet, updating the gear every 4 levels essentially - for character AND companion? will continue to do so. the only difference is - overflow is actually useful, for anything other than "buy some mods to sell on GTN"

So traditionally, the commendations for a particular planet were only really useful to you if you were properly leveled for the planet. If you were overleveled, the comms were no good to you, leading a lot of people to horde them (bad), or dump them for gear to sell to other players (good).

Not exactly true. If I was over-leveled, then I just bought mods for my alts with them. They weren't useless to me. In fact, it got to the point where I could mod most of my gear while leveling just from the commendations from my higher level alts.

Theres a few flaws in your thesis.

First one is glaring, and that is you have always been able to do this since release.

Next is 50 isn't a yardstick anymore, so really pointless using it as one.

Finally, and this is a clause to the first I mentioned, the high level mods are of far less value to the crafter than low/mid level.

So, prior to 2.0, as a 50, I could farm every H2 & H4 solo up to and including Voss, buy mods with the comms and profit.

In 2.0, I can do the same, but, the difference being, I can now select which level range I want to spend the comms on, instead of having a wide range of levels of mods to sell.

But to counter this somewhat, while leveling, I can now purchase mods for my level, and not just buy a stack and flood the GTN with them as I used to because as you mentioned, being over leveled by a big margin at the end of the planet meant the comms were useless to a lot of people. This could allow more opportunities for the crafters.

Time will tell, and I'm sure the dev/s in charge will monitor the situation, but personally, I don't see a problem.

While I am concerned for a select few of the crafters, the ones that price their items fairly, but the ones that are greedy and severely overprice everything they make, I say let them get screwed over for once.

I like how they have done the commendations, though I would like the binding to be Bind on Legacy, the items you get via commendations to be bind on legacy, no economy issues.

As the previous posters stated, this has no negative effect. If anything it will have a positive effect.

Your limit for comms went from something like 13.000 down to 50. You can only buy gear at exactly or below your level.

At best, you can keep 3 or 4 pieces of gear at level with that - the rest will come from the GTN or crafting.

Near the end, everyone will try to hold on as much as possible to their comms for the Makeb gear at 50.

Any overleveled char doing grey quests for "profit" is beyond help and won't have much negative effect to your sales on the GTN. (Doing any heroic content at any level takes time. Even a 50 will have to spend quite a bit of time running through "greys" on say Tatooine. In that time he could have easily completetd dailies or the Voss weekly which has a much, much bigger return on time invested.")

Since crafting those mods (by that i mean everything - mods, armorings, enhancements, barrels, crystlas) is fairly cheap for the majority of the level range, you shouldn't have a problem making a living with one of those professions.

My FP addicted chars have actually lost their main source of income with this change - they didn't craft before because it was cheaper and faster just "dump" the mods i've "outleveled" on the GTN. They can't afford to do that now anymore. Now they will have to craft stuff again - and get upset by the "undercut wars"

After watching the 'crafters' make obscene amounts of credits by REing Raid gear mods and then filling the GTN with 27 mods for the last...FOREVER...so that people can pay them for BiS gear, my concern for their economic welfare is somewhere just above absolute zero.

But not much.

I think the only valid solution would be to buff crafting comms to be greater or equal to that of the planetary comm blues.

Its so delightful since the patch to receive a planetary comm regardless of what level i am, where im playing and how im getting it, and know that its actually going to be useful. Somehow, this has added enjoyment to my game, so positive!!!

I've made a good amount of credits from cybertech myself, so feel for your concern, but buffing cybertech is the only solution id suggest. The new rewards are awesome!!!

Certainly I feel the annoyance at those crafters who charge obscene amounts of money for goods that simply aren't worth it, just because they can. Even as a crafter, I dislike those typed of people because it sets unreasonable levels at the market which don't benefit anybody but the crafter. Generally, though, I have to opposite problem, with players often flooding the market with items far below market value, and undercutting all legitimate crafters.

There are some good points here, and I acknlowledge there are definite benefits to the new system... but I also see that there are no safeguards in place to prevent its abuse and the subsequent ruination of the GTN as a result.

The 50 comms limit is a definite help, though I'm not sure it's a low enough amount to be effective. I'll have to review the individual shops on the fleet, but I'm almost certain that amount is well more than the cost to obtain the highest cost items at any vendor, and is enough for 25 basic mods and enhancements. This might be less of a concern if other safeguards were in place, but they don't appear to be.

The danger to the GTN of allowing mid-high level players to run low-level heroics for planetary comms that they can spend on any level gear is a real one that needs to be addressed if the new system is to do what's intended and NOT bring down crafting and the GTN as well.

Generally, though, I have to opposite problem, with players often flooding the market with items far below market value, and undercutting all legitimate crafters.

Well, on tor and as real life, its better to think that the combination of buyers and sells is what sets the price of the market.. theres no such thing as "fair value" like that. Just like in the real world, if noone wants, or there an oversupply of something, people who want to guarantee the sale will have to start selling at below some definition of cost. Its stickier here as mats can be bought from the gtn, crafted at a cost, or (in majority) acquired for free while in the world... Fair is what the market sets!

The 50 comms limit is a definite help, though I'm not sure it's a low enough amount to be effective. I'll have to review the individual shops on the fleet, but I'm almost certain that amount is well more than the cost to obtain the highest cost items at any vendor, and is enough for 25 basic mods and enhancements. This might be less of a concern if other safeguards were in place, but they don't appear to be.

Id be more inclined to increase the limit than reduce it.. potential buyers are the ones who would have otherwise gone to the gtn will be suddenly reminded that their planetary comms are about to hit a cap so they better go spend them.. away from the gtn economy! Unless you're thinking about competing sellers having lots of stock from comms at a particular level market/level bracket id rather increase this.. one less reason not to use the gtn at least.

The danger to the GTN of allowing mid-high level players to run low-level heroics for planetary comms that they can spend on any level gear is a real one that needs to be addressed if the new system is to do what's intended and NOT bring down crafting and the GTN as well.

Well that makes sense. Will be interested to see its a problem. In my head, people who do this do this probably would be doing it already, unless you're farming for that gambling pack mount or clothing, the thought of running grey content for giggles isn't that common..?

I'm on record as saying that if the 50 planetary commendations limit is still in place when my subscription runs out, I'm gone. No, I do NOT want to have to scrounge for credits to buy all my gear on the GTN, playing the market and working for the crafters. BW needs to decide if they're creating a game for the benefit of the crafters, or all the players.

its not a weekly limit though, just general one. you can spend some coms and go back to leveling and getting more.

that said - 25 mods and enhancements are 4 commendations each while armorings and barrels/hilts are 10

this is already a safeguard against farming low level content for high level rewards. in order to get a single armoring, you'd have to do 3.3 heroic missions. none of those missions are in a same tight space, do you have to travel around to get them. you have to travel between planets, deal with all those loading screens. its simply not worth it. it will still be easier to either just craft the mods, and/or do high level dailies for credits.

also - recipes to make 25 grade modifications are available at 410 skill (verified personally). material costs from cursory glance seems to be relatively low. from what I can tell right now, they will be more profitable and faster to craft then to grind for.

its not a weekly limit though, just general one. you can spend some coms and go back to leveling and getting more.

 

that said - 25 mods and enhancements are 4 commendations each while armorings and barrels/hilts are 10

this is already a safeguard against farming low level content for high level rewards. in order to get a single armoring, you'd have to do 3.3 heroic missions. none of those missions are in a same tight space, do you have to travel around to get them. you have to travel between planets, deal with all those loading screens. its simply not worth it. it will still be easier to either just craft the mods, and/or do high level dailies for credits.

 

also - recipes to make 25 grade modifications are available at 410 skill (verified personally). material costs from cursory glance seems to be relatively low. from what I can tell right now, they will be more profitable and faster to craft then to grind for.

Here's how I play - due to my schedule and other considerations, I rarely do flashpoints or heroics. I do the missions on a planet, go buy mods for the improvably gear, and move on to the next planet. I like that play style. I've enjoyed that playstyle for several months. I spent a week as a premium player, matching up my renewal time to paycheck time, and hated having to go back and buy the mods. On Hoth and a few others, I wind up with more than 50 commendations before I turn them in, and it's never been a problem, they just accumulate.

One side effect of this playstyle is, as I get in the latter part of the game, I'm often below the level of the missions, by two or three levels (sometimes even four). Which means when I buy the mods, I can't always use them, but that's what inventory and cargo holds are for.

Now, due to these arbitrary changes, I'll have to go back to the main area more often to buy the mods, I can't buy the top-for-that-planet mods and even when I'm done with the planet I may not be able to buy them. Because of this arbitrary change to gameplay, I'll now have to go scrounging on the GTN, spend a lot more time crafting, shluffing stuff between alts, all of which is time away from blasting the bad guys which is why I play this game.

I get some people love crafting, love playing the market, love tweaking the gear and so forth. Cool. I don't. And until 2.0, I didn't have to. Now, I have to spend less time playing the parts I find fun and instead spend it with stuff I hate doing and scrambling to try to find a way.

Now, I have another activity where I have to do stuff I hate to do and scrambling to find a way to make things happen. It's called my real life. I play games to get away from it, and I don't have to pay EA $15/month plus point purchases to participate.

I agree with you. I don't like this low limit either. my playstyle is similar to yours, except I do flashpoints while leveling so I generally stay at or above level of whatever planet I'm going through, so I end up upgrading gear for me and companion every 4 levels.

but consider this.

their original intention? was to have a weekly maximum of 50 coms. think about it. 50 a WEEK. at this point, I'm so happy that they reconsidered, that I'll take extra travel if that means the rest of my playstyle is largely intact... and that I'll now have use for commendation overflow, instead of them just sitting in my currency tab, unused

or in other words? you are NOT going to have to scrounge the gtn. instead whatever coms may have gone unused because you outleveled the planet? will now be useful for you to buy upgrades with

Now, due to these arbitrary changes, I'll have to go back to the main area more often to buy the mods, I can't buy the top-for-that-planet mods and even when I'm done with the planet I may not be able to buy them. Because of this arbitrary change to gameplay, I'll now have to go scrounging on the GTN, spend a lot more time crafting, shluffing stuff between alts, all of which is time away from blasting the bad guys which is why I play this game.

Are you really raging because you're going to have to go to fleet or back to a planet instead of ignoring comms? Really? Is using a fleet pass so much trouble that you condemn a game mechanic for? wow.

Just in case, the op was concerned that the new changes would keep people from going to the gtn, reducing the market for crafted mods as people can buy current mods for themselves with "spare" mods from lower level planets.

Thinking about it.. that's not even a concern. It just allows players doing the same thing to buy better gear from the same "class" of vendor.. you get 10 comms in play. The only difference will be that you can choose the current planet youre on, or the next planet if you're overlevelled. I cant think of an impact to anything from this.. no nothing.

Are you really raging because you're going to have to go to fleet or back to a planet instead of ignoring comms? Really? Is using a fleet pass so much trouble that you condemn a game mechanic for? wow.

 

Just in case, the op was concerned that the new changes would keep people from going to the gtn, reducing the market for crafted mods as people can buy current mods for themselves with "spare" mods from lower level planets.

 

Thinking about it.. that's not even a concern. It just allows players doing the same thing to buy better gear from the same "class" of vendor.. you get 10 comms in play. The only difference will be that you can choose the current planet youre on, or the next planet if you're overlevelled. I cant think of an impact to anything from this.. no nothing.

Yes, I am "raging". If you could buy armor/barrels/mods/enhancements above your level, maybe you could say "well, it's just some time wasted going back to the entrance point at the planet". But in addition to the level cap, you can't buy a barrell that requires level 25 unless you are level 25 now. Meaning if my inventory fills up with the 50 commendations and I'm not yet level 25 as I leave (whichever planet you'd leave at 25, don't have them all memorized), either I'm going to lose commendations as I keep playing with the cap full, or I have to buy less useful pieces that I'd soon be able to use.

Yes, I am "raging". If you could buy armor/barrels/mods/enhancements above your level, maybe you could say "well, it's just some time wasted going back to the entrance point at the planet". But in addition to the level cap, you can't buy a barrell that requires level 25 unless you are level 25 now. Meaning if my inventory fills up with the 50 commendations and I'm not yet level 25 as I leave (whichever planet you'd leave at 25, don't have them all memorized), either I'm going to lose commendations as I keep playing with the cap full, or I have to buy less useful pieces that I'd soon be able to use.

That's a fair concern, but do you really get 50 comms from just questing? I get comms at a fair rate, but the great majority come from flashpoints and their dailies. Fair enough if you fill up from questing though. Actually is that true? For my dps only classes this would be great if i can get modded blues easily just by questing.

Yes, I am "raging". If you could buy armor/barrels/mods/enhancements above your level, maybe you could say "well, it's just some time wasted going back to the entrance point at the planet". But in addition to the level cap, you can't buy a barrell that requires level 25 unless you are level 25 now. Meaning if my inventory fills up with the 50 commendations and I'm not yet level 25 as I leave (whichever planet you'd leave at 25, don't have them all memorized), either I'm going to lose commendations as I keep playing with the cap full, or I have to buy less useful pieces that I'd soon be able to use.

I don't get this. you couldn't buy a barrel before either, you would have to go to the next planet, do enough content to purchase it? how is this any different?

If you're at par with the planet, or even a level behind, the gear at the comms vendor is perfect for that planet, just spend them and upgrade your gear, one visit when you get close to the cap, and one visit just before you leave.

I just can't see the issue.

What's even better is, that I can go a planet forward or even back, and get my barrels for the level I am.. You have never been able to do that before.

Theres nothing stopping you getting 150 comms from 1 planet in a single day if you want, you just have to spend as you go.

To the point... when we're talking about a play style where a player is earning comms, and then turning around and immediately (and I mean with a level or two or four of the mission he's earning rewards on) buying his mods and upgrading to his current level... that's really not a concern of mine at all. That's exactly how the comms system is supposed to work. Your upgrades and level are supposed to keep pace with your story/planet.

While I do feel a bit sorry for you that you're not able to "burst upgrade" as you would have normally, ultimately you're already using the system as intended, and as such your adjustment to the new system will be minimal. Other than having to travel back to a vendor a little more often, otherwise your experience will be unchanged, if not a lttle improved during that sort of middle area where you're slightly over-leveled for the planet you're on, but not quite properly leveled for the next one.

No... my concern is the other folks... folks who, like myself, run all the missions, and find themselves overleveled... or those who tend to spend more time upgrading gear, companions, whatever. Or conversely, folks who run only the bare essentials and buy what they need specifically in the market. The folks, essentially, that fuel the GTN. See... comms are supposed to get you through the planet you're on - that's it. You start a planet at level 25, say, and leave it at level 30... so by the time you left the previous planet, you should be pretty well geared around 25, and by the time you leave this one, you should be pretty well geared at 30.

But it doesn't always work out that way... double xp weekends, complementary boosts, rested, thorough mission running... a lot of people get over-leveled by a wide margin. Hell, I mostly stopped running Heroics at level 25 for that reason. You might come into that level 25 planet at level 28, and leave it at level 35. But your comms are only supposed to get you to 30. The challenge for you, hasn't changed though. You don't need to hit the next planet in level 35 gear... You'll pick that up via comms as you go.

I, for instance, hit level 50 on Hoth... and this is without playing PvP, Ops, Flashpoints, etc. Just missions, and ditching most of the Heroics. It's conceivable I could have hit 50 far sooner. Under the old system, though, my gear would still generally keep place with my planet/story, rather than my level. Sitting on Hoth, my companions were still, at best, rocking level 40 gear, and a lot of mine was leveled here and there according to what I could afford. Under the new system, though, I could easily be geared for whatever level I was, regardless of the level of my story/planet, without having to invest in the player-to-player economy. This is not a good thing for that economy, and it's not a good thing for gameplay either.

Under the old system, most people in that "over-leveled" situation end up hoarding the unused low-level comms, or buy mods and dump them on the GTN for cash. While it's been suggested previously in this thread that dumping mods from unused comms on the GTN is undesirable, it's actually not at all... it's very desirable. You use an unwanted comm to buy a mod to dump onto the GTN. I buy that mod. That gets me the mod I need, and puts cash in your pocket. Cash you can then use to buy whatever you want. Say that what you want is a properly leveled piece of armor, which I happen to be selling. That nets you the armor you need, and I get cash in my pocket. Or I build an augment, same deal. Regardless, money is flowing and people are getting exactly what they want, when they want it.

In that way, it's a bit like a real economy. The only way to get the money flowing, essentially, is to dump money onto the market and encourage people to buy. This fuels both consumers and sellers and manufacturers and middlemen. It's good for everyone. The new comms system does the opposite. It has the potential, from level 10-50, basically, to make players far more self-sufficient in kitting up. This, of course, will make some players very happy... but many I think, and crafters and the GTN in general, will suffer for it if it's not handled carefully. And it could have very detrimental effects in gameplay as well, as it disturbs the natural progression of the game... essentially allowing most players to be kitted above their planet/story/challenge level without any cost or effort on their part - as they no longer have to spend earned cash in the marketplace to kit up above the level of the comms they're earning.

I want to be optimistic... as there are real benefits to the new way of doing things... I'm just worried that not enough safeguards are in place to keep things working they way they should.

Yes, I am "raging". If you could buy armor/barrels/mods/enhancements above your level, maybe you could say "well, it's just some time wasted going back to the entrance point at the planet". But in addition to the level cap, you can't buy a barrell that requires level 25 unless you are level 25 now. Meaning if my inventory fills up with the 50 commendations and I'm not yet level 25 as I leave (whichever planet you'd leave at 25, don't have them all memorized), either I'm going to lose commendations as I keep playing with the cap full, or I have to buy less useful pieces that I'd soon be able to use.

wait a minute, WAIT A MINUTE...

I cannot pre emptively buy upgrades now? like say, when I quest on Nar Shadaa and I get there at lvl 20, but upgrades I want are lvl 23 - I cannot buy them now, until I actually hit 23? seriously????? (oh and btw, you know how you end up getting extra coms? flashpoints. flashpoints give you 5 for first random, occasional drop off the boss body, and a few more for a daily. coms are not the only reason I chose a daily and pick a random though. you also get gold and random means faster group - so yes, i've ended up on Nar Shadda etc with coms for it, before I started questing there. )

ok, NOW I'm kinda annoyed. I have to test it next time I play, I haven't done anything on my lowbies since Makeb hit, so I didn't know about this particular nuance.

I'd be even fine if they restricted lvl 50 upgrades from being bought until you are lvl 50. not happy, but I'd deal. but this is a bit much >_>

As a cybertech, the margin on blues were never worth the effort to sell via the GTN. Mid-range (level 27-35) purples sold well in small quantities but only if I could find a sweetheart deal on the mats or if my gatherers got lucky. Now that that character hit 50, running dailies has much better ROI (return on investment).

I had pretty much the same concerns regarding the market. But spending my excess comms before 2.0 made me realize there are some gaps that crafted mods could cover. So no, I don't think the sky is falling.

I see your logic scarecrow, but still don't see it as a problem.. some extra data for the picture:

- If you care about gear planetary mods would be the best until endgame? Aside from pvpers, i cant see even the most gear obsessed leveler spending 30-50k on a purple hilt/item that's going to be replaced in 5-7 levels.. I'm pretty gear obsessed myself, and i see crafted greens at least a sorry second to comms mods. As my alts grew pretty soon i personally had this problem, and my solution was to take up cybertech.. I was short of funds as it was..

- If you're just overlevelled naturally, wouldn't you be less inclined to upgrade your gear as you already have level and skill advantage?

I dunno. I think PVP players could be an a different league as they need gear to do their thing.. but pve quest people dont really need it.. and flashpoint people are covered naturally (need for yourself and daily comms for your companion).

Yeah again i think if anything, reinforcing cybertech so that the output is comparable/better in stats to planetary comms of the same level is the only action, if anything.