Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Things that are Dead should stay DEAD!

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
Things that are Dead should stay DEAD!

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.16.2019 , 12:07 AM | #121
Quote: Originally Posted by MikeCobalt View Post
Malgus's new Body Parts (Implants) are keeping him "In-Line". Like Theron's Implants allowing Gemini/ Vin Atrius to see and hear everything but more Controlling? (Ending of "Saturn 3 Movie) Very Well could be. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out and hopefully there's alot of Big Names involved (Considering what we've accomplished, we deserve big names involved). From Malgus's codex its Acina but that also say's that theory is only Conjecture so maybe others are involved as others here have said. That "Traitors Droid" being cryptic also feeds into this and *Maybe Malgus all this time has just simply been a thought of as a deadly guard dog for Acina.

Malgus Codex
Spoiler


With Malora's appearance here and now this (Not Dead Malgus) really does seem as something she would have a part in or totally lead the project (Uncomfortable Science); Maybe she then would know whats behind this and most importantly How to break that leash..... Then Kill her...on the way to Acina.
Gemini 16 didn't hack Theron's implants, but she could see him and the alliance commander chatting to each other, sugesting that the droids visual range is much greater than the standard light range and the droid can zoom in to get a better look. I doubt the droid could hear what was being said though, unless the droid had parabolic sensors that could pick up the conversation. Gemini droid capabilities weren't really explained through FE and ET, only that they are related to SCORPIO.

Gemini 16 did manage to get into the alliance network and know what the alliance was doing for some time before the encounter on Nathema with Zildrog and the alliance with Vinn Atrius.


As for Acina and Malgus: If Acina is using Malgus for her dirty work all the time? she is already proven weak by having Malgus doing everything she should be doing to prove her own worth. Empress or not, if she is not willing to show how strong she is in taking out a rival? she needs to soon, because the other Sith will sense that without Malgus, Acina may not have that much power at all and could be easily defeated. There are some things Malgus can't fix for Acina, and one day she'll have to prove it in true Sith fashion: in combat.

Baras had many of his own rivals and bodyguards through apprentices, yet it only took one of his own that he betrayed to show how weak he was without that rabid dog: Draag, to protect him. No amount of spy work will grant Baras security, it will only grant him a limited time window into what is coming next.

Vowrawn had guards as well and it only took one bounty hunter to take them out the picture before Baras's former apprentice stepped in to save him from harm. Sith that rely too much on bodyguards hardly remain strong as it can turn into a depedency.

Ironically for Acina, the more practice and fighting Malgus gets in, the stronger he gets and whatever hold Acina has over Malgus and it disappears, it is very likely Acina wouldn't have an answer for Malgus in a straight fight.

TrixxieTriss's Avatar


TrixxieTriss
07.16.2019 , 12:24 AM | #122
There is definitely a precedence for Marr to come back as a force ghost. You could even have him as a more permanent, but limited type of companion or more of a story driven protagonist.

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.16.2019 , 12:39 AM | #123
Quote: Originally Posted by TrixxieTriss View Post
There is definitely a precedence for Marr to come back as a force ghost. You could even have him as a more permanent, but limited type of companion or more of a story driven protagonist.
How can you harm a force ghost that can't be seen? Force ghosts can only be seen when the ghosts interacts between the physical entity and the force by the connection. why would Marr give his enemies the advantage to see him for?

A force ghost Marr companion makes no sense at this point. But i disliked what happened to Marr in chapter 1 of FE, very much so. I am hoping he'll come back again in some form, but unless there is a way to get him back into a body again, Marr is likely going to remain unconcerned with the physical realm beyond his own desires.

Severith's Avatar


Severith
07.16.2019 , 01:00 AM | #124
Lucas always went on and on about how Star Wars was rhyming poetry, the things that happened before happen again and again.

Malgus was always the Vader of the Old Republic, so it works with Lucas's philosophy that the same sort of path is laid out. Malgus and Vader were both idealists, both ended up almost dying because of that idealism, and both ended up with cybernetics that enslaved them to the their emperors.

In case you forget why Malgus tried to form his own empire: He saw the systematic discrimination of other species within the Sith Empire, and wanted to reform the empire as an actual meritocracy, rather than a meritocracy between just the humans and Sith purebloods.

Vader wanted a dictatorship instead of a democracy, because from his perspective democracy created more injustice in the galaxy.

I think it's more than fine that Malgus is back, but it could of involved the players a bit. Maybe a flashpoint or a solo mission where they discover all the people Zakuul had in carbonite, or maybe some weird force cult had stolen Malgus's body and were worshiping it or something.

That would take imagination or some simulacrum of imagination to pull off though.

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.16.2019 , 03:27 AM | #125
Quote: Originally Posted by Severith View Post
Lucas always went on and on about how Star Wars was rhyming poetry, the things that happened before happen again and again.

Malgus was always the Vader of the Old Republic, so it works with Lucas's philosophy that the same sort of path is laid out. Malgus and Vader were both idealists, both ended up almost dying because of that idealism, and both ended up with cybernetics that enslaved them to the their emperors.

In case you forget why Malgus tried to form his own empire: He saw the systematic discrimination of other species within the Sith Empire, and wanted to reform the empire as an actual meritocracy, rather than a meritocracy between just the humans and Sith purebloods.

Vader wanted a dictatorship instead of a democracy, because from his perspective democracy created more injustice in the galaxy.

I think it's more than fine that Malgus is back, but it could of involved the players a bit. Maybe a flashpoint or a solo mission where they discover all the people Zakuul had in carbonite, or maybe some weird force cult had stolen Malgus's body and were worshiping it or something.

That would take imagination or some simulacrum of imagination to pull off though.
Malgus saw aliens as a useful tool as an addition to his new empire, not because he was a force for change but simply because they were something the empire failed to use which gave the republic an edge, he wanted to level the playing field and show his new empire as less stained by old ways, but the problem with Malgus is that he was brought up with those old ways, so he couldn't lead the new empire anywhere even if he did succeed because those old values would be part of his new empire. He needed new leadership not tainted by such things and a Sith wouldn't give up power for another willingly and Malgus is not the type to share.

Then there is Serevin who was notoriously short tempered and didn't really care to know or understand, only use and abuse anyone he could. Bringing the Voss into it was his way of proving to Malgus that he was worth something to have Voss who could see things be apart of this new empire. Malgus only saw an extra resource, of course when Serevin was slain, not one word from Malgus which proved how much the old ways are apart of the man and how little he ultimately cared for those around him.

He mentioned Jindo Krey but that was meant to be a rallying cry and a propaganda tool for the remaining forces on the station rather than to discourage the PC. Malgus was ultimately out for himself even if others thought of him as an ally, very much the same as the emperor and dreadmasters.

IoNonSoEVero's Avatar


IoNonSoEVero
07.16.2019 , 04:33 AM | #126
Quote: Originally Posted by Celise View Post
Malgus saw aliens as a useful tool as an addition to his new empire, not because he was a force for change but simply because they were something the empire failed to use which gave the republic an edge, he wanted to level the playing field and show his new empire as less stained by old ways, but the problem with Malgus is that he was brought up with those old ways, so he couldn't lead the new empire anywhere even if he did succeed because those old values would be part of his new empire. He needed new leadership not tainted by such things and a Sith wouldn't give up power for another willingly and Malgus is not the type to share.
He married a Twi'lek, which at the time would have been a scandal. So I wouldn't go so far as to claim that he didn't have any genuine pro-alien sentiments, beyond using them for the Empire. Of course he also murdered said wife, but because he felt the attachment was a weakness.

that_Spartan_IV's Avatar


that_Spartan_IV
07.16.2019 , 04:55 AM | #127
Quote: Originally Posted by Keta View Post
Vitiate and Revan should have stayed dead. So should have Malgus. Or let us change sides again so we can kill him again. Or just let us kill him and be done with Malgus -- for good this time.
I agree. BioWare has been creatively bankrupt for a looooong time now.
"Two there should be, no more, no less."

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.16.2019 , 05:32 AM | #128
Quote: Originally Posted by IoNonSoEVero View Post
He married a Twi'lek, which at the time would have been a scandal. So I wouldn't go so far as to claim that he didn't have any genuine pro-alien sentiments, beyond using them for the Empire. Of course he also murdered said wife, but because he felt the attachment was a weakness.
He murdered her because he couldn't afford such weakness to other sith and because she became an ever growing thorn in his ambitions and designs even if she had no such plans on Malgus. His desires came before his wife, even though he mourned her passing, he no longer had weakness the other sith could exploit and so his rise to power was much easier.

pro-alien sentiment he might of had at one point, but he was in his 60's when he was slain on the emperors space station, when he was Veradun he may of had all those idealistic traits, but being a sith, murdering his wife are all part of the same problem, his idealism always let him down and having such a trait as a sith never helped him. It is more than likely he changed after his wife died, but still his ambitions were always his fiirst priority.

Tsillah's Avatar


Tsillah
07.16.2019 , 06:03 AM | #129
The simple truth is that BioWare has been relying on gimmick writing like this for a while now and it was already getting old. Malgus is one thing cause we already knew that he was knocked off the side at the end of the original fight and this was a clear indication he'd be back at some point. So in this particular case I don't have an issue with it but overall I wish they would stop using this. I see it as lazy, uninspired writing for the most part.

Mass Effect Andromeda was also an example of how they take death so very casually. I mean your main character dies 2 or 3 times and at some point it's like "who cares?". That exactly is the point. Now when I kill a powerful enemy, it means little to me because chances are they'll bring him/her back at some point.

At the same time they also kill off characters in terrible ways, undeserved often. Point in case would be Vaylin who in KotFE was just annoying and one-dimensional, but then in KotET gets an actual personality and just when you think she's a cool character it's over and they confirm that's it for her.

Problem is there that they wasted potential of a character they just started developing and now if they ever do decided to bring her back it'll be against their own words and it'll likely not make much sense either.

I mean, does anyone really believe we've seen the last of Vitiate? I'm not so sure.

When death becomes a gimmick, it becomes meaningless. And when death becomes meaningless, our choices become less meaningful as well because the consequences are changeable.

I really hope they stay away from the usual gimmicks and do some more interesting writing for 6.0. A lot of people say that BioWare was always great at writing good stories but actually they were great at writing good, compelling characters. Used to be. I hope they get better at it again. I have more faith in Austin for that right now than Edmonton anyway.

I think the anger that came when all existing companions were removed at the start of 4.0 tells you that people really got attached to a lot of those companions but the continued demand for companion returns over the years it took to get them back also tells me that new companions didn't make such an impact. But, I have to say that Ossus does make me feel hopeful for 6.0 because there are some characters there already that interest me.

I just hope they focus more on decent/good stories with great characters in them because it's the characters that convince you and bring you in, more than the story itself. When a character dies I want to be sad about it. That doesn't happen much in BioWare games these days... because it's gotten too contrived. So fingers crossed.

I really didn't expect to give this game another chance because the list of things that needed to change just got too long and well, they are actually doing so many things that are on my list that I had to admit I was wrong. But if they make the characters interesting and not just cheap tricks as their main writing tools, that'd really be an amazing thing.
Referral link for some extras: http://www.swtor.com/r/jMVTyB

Celise's Avatar


Celise
07.16.2019 , 07:38 AM | #130
I've never for moment believed that the emperor is dead and from what i could tell, he was flushed out of the commanders head during the hollowing out stage and disappeared, but there was a massive shift in the force strong enough to almost knock a few people off their feet. I always believed that the emperor travelled across the galaxy to the last anchor, his original host body, Tenebrae, and he was forced back into that body and left to slumber for a bit, with a fraction of the power he once possessed.

I mentioned host body because i'm not convinced that the emperor was Tenebrae, but rather a boy who was hollowed out for the emperor. A vessel that the emperor kept and one he imbued special powers to to keep it from aging by binding it to his will with the unfortunate consequence of when he returns to the body he won't sense or feel anything any more.

Iokath tempered my skeptism a bit on the emperors origins and i suspect strongly that he was either originally an Iokath ruler or had a voice in those people and was the one who triggered a massive genocide by machine devices so he could feed off that death. I believe the individual you saw on the chair when Theron was collecting data on weapons tech and the discovery of such dangerous tech, this was either the emperor himself or his voice who triggered things world-wide.

A few coincidences i don't like that also tie into the emperor, the old gods, the abandoned eternal fleet, skytroopers,scorpio and how the star cabal had access to it and any ancient secrets the droid had over the centuries, including iokath. Zildrog originally from Iokath moved to Nathema and Ziost. It all sort of ties into each other that proves there is some link there with the emperor and a potential timeline.

I just can't see how such an old being like the emperor wouldn't have a plan in place in case things went sour. For all his show, the emperor always had a finality to his performances, always a plan within a plan.