i'm a sith warrior, and i hear we have the most ability's to keybind to play right (and i get on fine) i have the number keys 1-= and then q,w,e,r,t,y. and then page up,page down, home, end, delete, and insert. i use the arrow keys to move and the space bar to target, with the 0 on the number pad now as jump.

 

if i can find a comfortable way to play with so many button presses i'm sure others can

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CeHXinzZi70

 

Put that on 1080HD. Look at how many keybinds I use. Look at how many of those spells and cooldowns I use. Then you won't be afraid any more, and I do my rotation pretty decently I like to think.

That's 26 individual keybindings that I need be cognizant of and somehow work into a rotation just to take out silver mob. I can only imagine it gets even worse at higher levels.

 

I think "convoluted" is the word I'm looking for.

 

Spells? Oh you must be a wizard or a necromancer with those spells. In this game I have abilities.

Level 40 Jedi Guardian. I play with 40 different ability buttons all within 1 inch of my hand. That's not counting movement and jumping keys.

 

Personally I love having so many abilities. Combat is circumstantial and never the same.

 

Less abilities = rotation

Rotation = Boring

 

 

Yes you do; you get to the next mob more quickly, and the next quest more quickly, and the next level more quickly, and the next character more quickly. You clearly didn't do very well at addition in school.

 

And if you had a game license that caused the game to wipe from your hard drive in a month, so you would never see all the content if you didn't shave every second you could, I'd see your point. As it is, I don't. You get through every fight faster in order to.... what? Wait longer for them to release more content when you have nothing to do?

 

Every second you cut from a fight now, is a second longer you'll have nothing to do waiting for the next expansion. This, by you, is efficiency?

 

In any event, "best" is always, by definition, relative to the other players. Therefore, it doesn't matter how "inefficient" the interface is; since everyone else is operating under the SAME inefficiency, you can still show you're the "best" by being faster than them. So, again, I don't see the problem.

 

Frankly, given the above, if you want the game stripped down to three keys you can frantically tap like a rat with its brain hooked up to a tasp, in order to be "efficient", this tells me that you're NOT competing very effectively with other players, who CAN manage the "complex" interface and know which abilities need to be keybound and which don't, and you want the game simplified, rather than learning to compete properly. In other words, you want it dumbed down to the level where you can be "efficient" not because of your skill and ability to make quick decisions from multiple choices in context, but because you've written a macro that plays the game for you, allowing you to enjoy spending 15.00/month to spend as little time as possible playing the game.

 

Hint: If you spend the same per month no matter how much you play -- and you do -- it's more "efficient" to get maximum playtime per dollar. If you play one hour a month, you're paying 15.00/hour. If you play 10 hours/month, you're paying 1.50 an hour. Which is more efficient, remembering that this is *entertainment*, not *obligation*? It's not a chore where you HAVE to complete ten quests, and the quicker you get them done, the quicker you can move on to something actually fun. If playing the game isn't fun in itself, you're wasting EVERY minute you play, whether you kill ten mobs in that minute, or one, or five.

 

I'm currently assigned an amazingly tedious and persnickety source control editing task. (And I'm on lunch break, so I can waste time posting this while I nom yummy microwaved styrofoam. Mmmm. Carcinogenic.) I can invest a few hours learning an automation API to finish it more quickly, or many, many, more hours tediously doing each one by hand. Obviously, learning the API is a much better use of my time. But, here's the thing. I *hate* editing source control files. It's a JOB. It's something horrible I do in order to do more interesting things. If I was paying someone to LET me edit these files, if my primary entertainment was to do this editing, the last thing I'd want is to sit back and watch some script do it for me. It would make no sense. In a JOB, I get awarded for efficiency in many ways, including being able to get back to tasks I actually enjoy. In a game, "efficiency" only matters if there's a competitive element or an award for beating a time or what-not, and that doesn't exist here. (To the extent there is a competitive element, see above -- you're ALL playing basketball on your knees, and YOU'RE the one whining that it's too hard and you need to stand... because the other players, on their knees, are kicking your ***. And if they're NOT kicking your ***, I fail to comprehend your complaint. Doesn't it make you uber-cool-super-good, if you can win even when you're on your knees? Doesn't it show off how much better you really are, that, under a handicap, you can adapt and triumph?)

 

Now, you can argue you want to get through the fights quickly because you find the OTHER parts of the game more fun, and the fights are an obstacle you deal with to get to what you consider "the good parts". However, I strongly suspect you spend even less time on non-combat portions of the game (crafting, the story, roleplaying) than you do on fighting. Am I wrong?

 

Basically, it sounds like you absolutely and totally hate the game and want it over with as soon as possible... so I can't figure out why you're paying to play it. But, hey, you're much more "efficient" than me and your ability to pretend that you're a magic knight in outer space is MUCH better than mine, so, what do I know?

 

(As a PS, just a personal aside, a little friendly word of advice... there's a few things in life where, the SLOWER you get them done, the more respect you get. Just sayin'.)

Every skill doesn't need to be hotkeyed. The ones I rarely use I just click.

 

I'm currently using 1-5, Q,W,E,R,T and 7 of the buttons on the razer naga I just got. Frankly I only need that many for pvp as pve targets stand still.

And if you had a game license that caused the game to wipe from your hard drive in a month, so you would never see all the content if you didn't shave every second you could, I'd see your point. As it is, I don't. You get through every fight faster in order to.... what? Wait longer for them to release more content when you have nothing to do?

 

Every second you cut from a fight now, is a second longer you'll have nothing to do waiting for the next expansion. This, by you, is efficiency?

You just don't get it, do you? I am not viewing art, or taking in the scenery. I am playing a game, and it is competitive and task-oriented and objective based. That is how _I_ enjoy playing the game. If you don't, that's your prerogative. I get through every fight as fast as I can because playing to the highest skill level that I can is why I enjoy gaming. If I was in it for the ride, I'd watch a movie.

 

In any event, "best" is always, by definition, relative to the other players. Therefore, it doesn't matter how "inefficient" the interface is; since everyone else is operating under the SAME inefficiency, you can still show you're the "best" by being faster than them. So, again, I don't see the problem.

Ever heard the saying, "be the best you you can be"? It isn't always about other players. Ultimately, that everyone is on equal footing is a fallacious argument in this setting; we aren't. People who have lesser keyboards and lesser mice are significantly disadvantaged in a game like this, to a much larger degree than in a game where macros are available and abilities not so bloated. Now, you could say the same thing about requiring a high performance pc and that sort of thing, but that would be a bit disingenuous - one provides better graphics, the other does not provide better gameplay. As always, the UI should be a silent partner, aiming to reduce the amount the player notices how he inputs.

 

Frankly, given the above, if you want the game stripped down to three keys you can frantically tap like a rat with its brain hooked up to a tasp, in order to be "efficient", this tells me that you're NOT competing very effectively with other players, who CAN manage the "complex" interface and know which abilities need to be keybound and which don't, and you want the game simplified, rather than learning to compete properly. In other words, you want it dumbed down to the level where you can be "efficient" not because of your skill and ability to make quick decisions from multiple choices in context, but because you've written a macro that plays the game for you, allowing you to enjoy spending 15.00/month to spend as little time as possible playing the game.

I don't want the game to be stripped down to three keys. Again, your argument is reducto ad absurdum. There is a middle ground, and there needs to be room for significant growth in a game that has just been released. We should be in the point of the game, right now, where we have the least abilities we will ever have in the lifespan of the game. Complexity for the sake of it is not fun.

 

Hint: If you spend the same per month no matter how much you play -- and you do -- it's more "efficient" to get maximum playtime per dollar. If you play one hour a month, you're paying 15.00/hour. If you play 10 hours/month, you're paying 1.50 an hour. Which is more efficient, remembering that this is *entertainment*, not *obligation*? It's not a chore where you HAVE to complete ten quests, and the quicker you get them done, the quicker you can move on to something actually fun. If playing the game isn't fun in itself, you're wasting EVERY minute you play, whether you kill ten mobs in that minute, or one, or five.

You are assuming that there is some sort of maximum limit to the content you can do in a given amount of time. If that were the case, Bioware would have failed at their mission. There are always other characters and other things to do. Efficiency and effectiveness IS my entertainment; needless complexity and needless time sinks are my obligation. Do you enjoy driving 10 minutes across the world to do one quest? Because I hate that, and I hate wasting time in general. If I find a better way to do something, a faster, more efficient way, I garner enjoyment from that fact. I _LOVE_ finding a shortcut that probably wasn't intended by jumping off a cliff to save me walking around it. That is how I enjoy playing games.

 

I'm currently assigned an amazingly tedious and persnickety source control editing task. (And I'm on lunch break, so I can waste time posting this while I nom yummy microwaved styrofoam. Mmmm. Carcinogenic.) I can invest a few hours learning an automation API to finish it more quickly, or many, many, more hours tediously doing each one by hand. Obviously, learning the API is a much better use of my time. But, here's the thing. I *hate* editing source control files. It's a JOB. It's something horrible I do in order to do more interesting things. If I was paying someone to LET me edit these files, if my primary entertainment was to do this editing, the last thing I'd want is to sit back and watch some script do it for me. It would make no sense. In a JOB, I get awarded for efficiency in many ways, including being able to get back to tasks I actually enjoy. In a game, "efficiency" only matters if there's a competitive element or an award for beating a time or what-not, and that doesn't exist here. (To the extent there is a competitive element, see above -- you're ALL playing basketball on your knees, and YOU'RE the one whining that it's too hard and you need to stand... because the other players, on their knees, are kicking your ***. And if they're NOT kicking your ***, I fail to comprehend your complaint. Doesn't it make you uber-cool-super-good, if you can win even when you're on your knees? Doesn't it show off how much better you really are, that, under a handicap, you can adapt and triumph?)

What you are seemingly failing to understand is that other people enjoy different things to you. I will always, ALWAYS perform to the best of my ability; it is what I do. Easing off, putting less effort in, just because it is harder or more tedious is not why I play the game. That doesn't mean that I don't have opinions that it is needlessly complex or tedious.

 

Now, you can argue you want to get through the fights quickly because you find the OTHER parts of the game more fun, and the fights are an obstacle you deal with to get to what you consider "the good parts". However, I strongly suspect you spend even less time on non-combat portions of the game (crafting, the story, roleplaying) than you do on fighting. Am I wrong?

Yes, you are wrong. Because, like I have said above, I enjoy being the most efficient and effective that I can be, and that envolves having money, and items. I don't do fights quickly because they are obstacles; I do fights quickly because that is how I enjoy doing them. There are always, always more fights, and you always, always have more to gain by doing more of them, whether it is experience, legacy experience, or even just **** that drops. There is no benefit _TO ME_ to doing fights more slowly, because I don't enjoy that play style.

 

Basically, it sounds like you absolutely and totally hate the game and want it over with as soon as possible... so I can't figure out why you're paying to play it. But, hey, you're much more "efficient" than me and your ability to pretend that you're a magic knight in outer space is MUCH better than mine, so, what do I know?

You're wrong, and that is the standard fallacious argument that is used by every single Bioware groupie on these forums, against any critique of the game brought up in any forum. That I want the game to improve shows not that I hate the game, but that I love it. If I hated the game, I would stop playing it. I love it enough that I want to see it get better. I probably like it more than you do.

 

(As a PS, just a personal aside, a little friendly word of advice... there's a few things in life where, the SLOWER you get them done, the more respect you get. Just sayin'.)

Yep, there are. Gaming isn't one of them. Thanks for the completely irrelevant advice though, I suppose you chuckled to yourself as you thought up that completely unfunny quip.

If you don't want to keyboard-turn, use 1-6, r,t,f,g,h,b,v,c,x, and shift, ctrl and alt variations of all those keys. Oh, and if you have a third-party app, you can rebind capslock to work like one of those keys, which is nice too. Edited January 13, 2012 by PanzerKing

That is 30 required hotkeys to do my job as efficiently as I _SHOULD_ be able to. GUIs should not inhibit gameplay; they should be invisible and allow the player to interact with the game as comfortably as they can.

 

Having to click even one of those abilities costs me at the least time, and at the worst a whole lot of damage.

 

Skill should not come from having to navigate a keyboard to find a keybind; it should come from making the appropriate choices at the appropriate times.

 

I stopped reading the thread here. This is exactly the problem.

 

I don't think it's good game design to have people limiting the skills they use merely because they have run out of keybinds.