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The Importance of Player Feedback with the New Free-to-Play Option

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
The Importance of Player Feedback with the New Free-to-Play Option
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HammersteinSW's Avatar


HammersteinSW
12.07.2012 , 03:14 PM | #251
Don't try to BS the players with stuff like this.

You didn't listen to the beta players when they said the game had problems. You didn't listen to the beta players when you removed a ton of armor and customization options. You didn't listen to the players after launch day when they demanded more endgame and we never see any dev engage in a meaningful debate with the playerbase beyond "Can I marry a Wookie" stuff.

F2p is your last chance at success but given your history in the "player to dev" discourse I see no reason to believe that you will suddenly listen to our wishes.

RikHar's Avatar


RikHar
12.07.2012 , 03:34 PM | #252
Quote: Originally Posted by HammersteinSW View Post
Don't try to BS the players with stuff like this.

You didn't listen to the beta players when they said the game had problems. You didn't listen to the beta players when you removed a ton of armor and customization options. You didn't listen to the players after launch day when they demanded more endgame and we never see any dev engage in a meaningful debate with the playerbase beyond "Can I marry a Wookie" stuff.

F2p is your last chance at success but given your history in the "player to dev" discourse I see no reason to believe that you will suddenly listen to our wishes.

It's what I've been saying.

CKNORTH's Avatar


CKNORTH
12.07.2012 , 03:42 PM | #253
Quote: Originally Posted by HammersteinSW View Post
Don't try to BS the players with stuff like this.

You didn't listen to the beta players when they said the game had problems. You didn't listen to the beta players when you removed a ton of armor and customization options. You didn't listen to the players after launch day when they demanded more endgame and we never see any dev engage in a meaningful debate with the playerbase beyond "Can I marry a Wookie" stuff.

F2p is your last chance at success but given your history in the "player to dev" discourse I see no reason to believe that you will suddenly listen to our wishes.
Maybe there numbers weren't the 50 million player base they had projected and are wondering why after the initial spike of store sales it wasn't as ongoing as they thought so there using free player feed back from there subbed community to keep them fresh with ideas on how to "improve" the game, cough' (sales) ?

Edit: Fact is I have friends who played this game during beta and won't come back because they simply don't like free to play.... I think the restrictions hurt more then helped, people got frustrated, best thing they could do would be have preferred or even free to play. Play with everything up to patch 1.4 after that introduce unlocks for advanced features.
Pre-Order Knight of the Republic

Deewe's Avatar


Deewe
12.07.2012 , 04:42 PM | #254
Just a footnote:
.......You might want to proceed with doing follow-ups after writing the blog, actually stepping in an addressing some of the players concerns.

That's how you'll start showing that player feedback is indeed important for you guys.

danpen's Avatar


danpen
12.07.2012 , 05:38 PM | #255
Quote: Originally Posted by Deewe View Post
Just a footnote:
.......You might want to proceed with doing follow-ups after writing the blog, actually stepping in an addressing some of the players concerns.

That's how you'll start showing that player feedback is indeed important for you guys.
You'll need to know the feedback from people like me and the others
I am looking for people who need more help in the forums and i will be there to help you make it better ok.

dougan's Avatar


dougan
12.07.2012 , 11:18 PM | #256
I don't think anyone expects a restriction-less f2p model, they would be stupid to. The problem is that the restrictions are rather excessive. The best example, to me, is the fact that players can't "equip" titles unless they pay to unlock the ability to do so. Sure, I can level up and achieve the necessary milestones to unlock them, but once I unlock them, I can't use them without paying.

Another example is the restrictions on equipping artifact gear. Not only are they restricting the methods to get the gear, they are restricting the ability to equip it at all. If you limit the number of WZs free players can participate in, why then make the rewards effectively nil unless they pay? And not just pay, pay 1200 CCs! That's a $15 dollar investment for one character! That's very excessive. The restrictions are in place, they can only do 5 WZs per week, so they're going to be getting the gear extremely slowly unless they pay. If that isn't enough incentive for them to buy CCs, you think making them pay AGAIN in order to EQUIP the gear will? F2p models are based around creating incentives for people to buy your currency, not disappoint players into not playing at all...which IS what this model does. I have witnessed it firsthand with several members of my old guild. They were willing to come back for the 5 WZs, but immediately lost interest when they found out they couldn't even work toward the gear.

My number one complaint with this free to play model is the fact that our so-called "complimentary Cartel Coins" are anything but. If free players were granted the CC they were led to believe they earned, they would spend them on things like artifact gear unlocking and warzone weekly resets. That would, in turn, keep them logging into the game, and isn't that the goal here?

The bottom line is that the current free-to-play model is discouraging level-capped players from returning to the game, not encouraging it. Returning players are coming back to a game that doesn't feel appreciative of the time that they originally put into it. Simply awarding them the CC they earned would fix this, but I'm sure it's too late for that...I would estimate that there are several players who resubbed this month simply to get thier "complimentary CC" whom that would upset.

There is little reason to play for free at 50 currently. The game isn't fun enough (relative to other games that people could/are play/ing) to not let players earn their in-game rewards.

Sorry that this post is rather disorganized.
Dougan

EcrirTwyLar's Avatar


EcrirTwyLar
12.08.2012 , 12:21 AM | #257
1. Fix the bug where npc's are unable to turn off their light sabers.
2. Develop more playable species (Like Bothans!) and place them in the C-Store.
3. Put more custom weapons and armor in the C-Store. Especially some gear that has a little more subtle classic Star Wars look.

Devish's Avatar


Devish
12.08.2012 , 03:10 AM | #258
Ok for one it sounds like many many people are knew to the concept of free to play games.For one no mmo thats f2p and that is worth playing is truely free to play, the company needs to make money in some shape or form. I personaly have played far to many f2p mmos out there to list. When it comes to a cash shop, ie cartel coins, what happends is usualy one of two things.
1) The cash shop turns the game to a pay to win game.Anyone who has money to spend will have an unbalancing edge over those who cant afford to spend much and end game needed items crazy expensive.
2) The cash shop allows non subscribers to unlock things that normaly they would not have access and for temporary items.

Now with that said Swtor for the most part is the second example so far. Everquest, DC universe, Dungeons and dragons online and Lord of the Rings Online (just to name a few) follow a very similar model (which I like). But to have to pay for access to titles, able to hide your helmet, and little things like that is rather dumb. I understand the "auction house" limit and even amount of quick bars but some of the other features are pointless and will and have discouraged people from even trying the game out. I've played on and off since beta and the changes are very nice but could be better. In fact many of the changes should of been there at launch.
Also the flashpoint limit should be changed to allow all players unlimited access to normal flash points but you perhaps you have to unlock hard mode with either sub or cartel points.That way even free to play players can enjoy the game alittle more and if they realy want to do hard mode then they can pay if they want that access. Same thing goes with warzones and ops but just limit which areas are available to everyone for free and pay/sub to unlock other areas.

But realy though Devs just look at some other f2p games and learn from them. Dungeons and Dragons Online and Lord of the Rings online have some realy good ideas that you guys should consider. Those games are f2p just get someone to make an account and explore their game! Award cartel points for compleating all quests on a planet even if its a small amount like 50 cartel coins, for compleating your main story, for reaching key stone levels, finding all lores on a planet, all datacrons on a planet, even 10 cartel coins for each thing accomplished is better then nothing. Then the f2p model would work so much better and make people want to play and pay for more features. Those are awesome features from DDO and lotro that make those games popular.

I am sure that if this game takes off again and improves more races will happen, more zones, ect but as long as improvements are gained far to slow and buggs left unchecked then this will never happen. But again from what i've seen so far alot of these changes are nice you guys just need to work out the kinks.

Ithaniel's Avatar


Ithaniel
12.08.2012 , 03:19 AM | #259
Started to play from CBT, then was gone for some time returned 3 mouth ago. And I tell you guys, that you don't care about players opinion. And you cant even fix the bugs that you keep implementing with each update. And on the notice, almost all MMO's that gone Free to Play start to deteriorate over time.

I understated that Free to Play is your last resort to attract new players and get more profit out of this game, since you don't want to work over it to really improve it. But all this new, free to play, players is simply a "scourge" to the game. The Flash Points and War Zones are impossible to play now, since there is tons of "Newbies" that run around with no idea what to do or how to do it and with no desire to learn or understand. I aware that if you are new to the game, it may be a bit frustrating. But come on, dos it takes to graduate University to understand where is your skills and how they work? Or to listen to the War Zone objectives? Or do not rush in every Elite and Champion in the Flash Point? Or understand that if you a Marauder, you don't need every medium class armor, with cunning attributes? And this "lost in theirs own realty" people is seriously annoying and reduce the joy from the game greatly. I am patient person and of course I speak for myself, but this sentiments grow stronger with each day among experienced players.

So, I believe your main concern should be about subscribers well being, as they are the one who "pay" your salaries. But since you want to show off SWOTR to those who don't want to pay for "cat in the bag". I believe you should forbid Free to Play players to enter War Zones and Flash Points AT ALL. Let them run around aimlessly and taste the game on start worlds and Coruscant/Dromund Kaas. And if they want to go and see War Zones or Flash Points. let them become, at the very least a Preferred Players, with a limit of 1-2 visits per mouth and NO ability to "Need" items. And if they want more, then they should pay.
Or you have another solution, make the game completely Free to Play, and then you wont have any issues to worry about with F2P or subscribe players.
"I will deliver you bad luck"

rokhaiil's Avatar


rokhaiil
12.08.2012 , 08:56 AM | #260
But are these upgrades coming out in the 1.6? Or not yet?