That's my article - many thanks for the bump/repost over here.

 

Let me know what you guys think about it - I want to do a follow up piece eventually when SGRs actually start getting implemented so would be good to get feedback.

 

<3

5chars

Thanks for writing this article!

All fine and well, but to be honest, the same-sex marriages in Skyrim were done rather badly. You had like three lines in exchange with your spouse to be, then off to marriage. No mention of gender whatsoever, so to me it seemed like they used the now infamous "gender switch", or had no gender coded in the first place. It wasn't my game anyway though, so I might be a little biased here.

 

They are all like that, regardless of gender, they are all PC-sexual, some followers are integral to the story of a questline like Aela, some are random named npc no.89 from x town, the only follower in the game(Haven't played Dragonborn DLC yet) that is a properly developed character with actual story is Serana and she isn't an option for either gender.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

Yet here we have EA and BW who love to tell everyone how great they are for supporting the gay community and how they are such great fans of same gender content and do everything they can to make sure everyone knows they are great supporters of the LGBT community yet they can't manage to actually get the content into the game.

 

"Show, don't tell", "actions speak louder than words".... wait, bad examples - they've nailed the "don't just talk about it" part, but forgot to actually show anything.

 

Maybe their motto is "believe it when you see it"?

Hello all!

 

This is my first post here, or rather anywhere in these forums.

 

I've been following this topic for a long while. And there is quite a bit of reading to be done just to catch up after being gone a few days without reading this thread. It makes even me, an avid reader of just about anything with the written(or typed) word, start feeling TL;DR about it. Which is a good thing for this issue I would like to think.

 

I'm 30 years old, half-white, and straight (So that makes me almost the demographic that most companies look for, right?). And I really would love to have the option to actually roleplay a same gender romance to my heart's content. I have a Male trooper that may not quite be as straight as his dialogue options make him be, I don't really know yet, since I didn't get the option to flirt and see where that went. And don't get me started on my Fat Twi'lek male smuggler. He actually would be flirting with everything that moves, whether it is on two legs, or more, hairy, hairless, or mechanical. Sometimes it's all about the flirt.

 

I'm glad that such a community exists, and is very active and passionate about what should be a basic civil right, and what should be included in a game that is made by a company who has been seen in the past to be very LGBT friendly.

 

That being said, I do hope to someday in game have a (or is an an? IF I say the letters, its an, if I say the words, its a. Hmm...) SGR as a male trooper with a character not unlike how I mysteriously ended up with Mr. Alenko in ME3. "Bro's to the end!" And then suddenly, in a slightly intimate moment, I find out that he likes my Commander Shepard. "It just feels right, doesn't it?" Well, yeah, after romancing an alien woman, and Miranda....yes, yes it does.

 

And for the few characters that I have that are women, having the option to have a(n) SGR would be nice as well. I guess I just dislike the limitations forced upon me in games that have the roleplaying aspect to them, be they online or single player. When I play as a character whom I don't name after myself, I don't mind whatever gender romance they have, as long as it is a nice story (or side story, as it were).

 

Well, now that I'm done posting, I'm going to continue lurking. Just thought I would show my support for this, and perhaps to ask, "Can we please have a little more clarity on this issue please?" Even mumbling into a microphone and posting it on youtube would be a step up!

 

That is awesome! You are the kind of straight guy that I like, and I truly wish more were like you

That's my article - many thanks for the bump/repost over here.

 

Let me know what you guys think about it - I want to do a follow up piece eventually when SGRs actually start getting implemented so would be good to get feedback.

 

It's a great article! I love it, and the more attention this gets, the better.

 

Although you say "There are almost 400 posts in the thread about SGRs on the official SWTOR forum, " Do you mean this topic? If so, this thread has over 4,000 posts and it's only the seventh incarnation. I may be mistaken, it wouldn't be the first time.

Yeah, I had just come back from outside and did realized my numbers wrong.

 

Doup and I figured out the math and it's closer to 30000 posts and counting. Over 2000 pages. No word.

 

I'm not going to give up. It's frustrating right now, to be sure. Especially since we have to be very cautious.

 

Remember this: Nothing will change unless we make it change.

 

We can do this guys!

 

As I was reminded earlier:

 

Keep the magazines interested, keep GLAAD involved. Remind them that we haven't heard an answer from anyone, including them. There are good reasons to be optimistic, hold onto them. The only way to get an answer is to gradually ramp up pressure on them, and that is the hard part.

 

I remind you that we are not being burning flamebrands here, we are reasoned and not overreaching. With each overreach by them, our case gets stronger.

 

Also, BW-Austin recently said that they were giving their employees lighter hours for the holidays. It's still going to be a bit, but we'll get an answer. Just keep going guys and do not give up. If we continue working together as a community, we'll not only get our answer, but we'll be able to hold BW accountable for treating us so poorly.

 

Oh and start saving all your posts.

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

Forgot to add:

 

That was a very well written blog! I got it bookmarked just in case.

 

If anyone hasn't already, please write to GLAAD. Yes, I sound like a broken record, but I cannot stress enough that we have to continue to be pro-active.

 

Also, if anyone is feel braver than I, please bump Uluain's thread. It's not fun, but it will create more visiblity. The more people see this, the more likely they are going to write to GLAAD. Which in turn means we'll get that much closer to an answer.

 

These are the people I have written to date:

 

 

• 1up.com
  
• Kotaku.com
  
• forbes.com
  
• Huffington Post
  
• The Gawker
  
• The Consumerist
  
• Destructoid.com
  
• Gaygamer.net
  
• GLAAD
  

 

I removed Dan Savage's information. From the sounds of it, he probably wouldn't be sympathetic.

 

Guys, we can't let what the rest of the internet thinks of this game get to us. Their opinion isn't the point. Again, the only way to get them to care is if we make them care. This is more than just about little ol' us; this is about the hypocritical nature of the game industry. You cannot use a minority to create good PR while ignoring a substantial part of that minority. That is one of the large areas where I draw the line.

 

Let's keep this up! Besides, we've got nothing left to lose, except our subs. Voting with our wallets isn't going to do anything from the looks of it. Writing to news sites is the only get this done from what I can see. It's been evident that BW-Austin really doesn't give a hoot if people quit. They would care if this whole thing causes them to come out of the silence closet.

 

I used that turn of phrase of deliberately. Ironic, isn't it?

 

You guys are my inspiration for all of this. There has been some wonderful players I've met in here that don't deserve this crap.

 

**hugs**

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

There's a new thread in General Discussion asking for suggestions on what to put into the game next: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=571682

Yeah, I had just come back from outside and did realized my numbers wrong.

 

Doup and I figured out the math and it's closer to 30000 posts and counting. Over 2000 pages. No word.

 

I'm not going to give up. It's frustrating right now, to be sure. Especially since we have to be very cautious.

 

/whistle... that much, eh?

 

I expect they were banking on a different reaction, but that just refreshed my stubbornness. Right then, once more unto the breach of faith.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Palar

Out of curiosity, have you guys also been campaigning for same gender flirts with quest NPCs or have you just being asking for same gender romances with companion? I'd really love same gender romances with companion, and if that's all BioWare wants to add I'll take it, but I'd also really like to be able to flirt with same gender quest NPCs. I've held off rolling both a Smuggler and an Imperial Agent as I've heard they're pretty flirt heavy classes and I'd like an answer to this before deciding whether or not to roll them.

-snip-

These are the people I have written to date:

 

• 1up.com
  
• Kotaku.com
  
• forbes.com
  
• Huffington Post
  
• The Gawker
  
• The Consumerist
  
• Destructoid.com
  
• Gaygamer.net
  
• GLAAD
  

-snip-

 

Could always try IGN too. While not LGBT-focused, they seem interested in sexuality/gender as it relates to PC/Video games, judging by a recent article that addresses the issues female gamers face.

 

I know, I know, not exactly the same, not very similar, but eh... they are a pretty major gaming news site, so contacting them might not hurt, plus they give contact information to the big hats, so you could end up in a dialogue with someone who can make things happen.

Out of curiosity, have you guys also been campaigning for same gender flirts with quest NPCs or have you just being asking for same gender romances with companion? I'd really love same gender romances with companion, and if that's all BioWare wants to add I'll take it, but I'd also really like to be able to flirt with same gender quest NPCs. I've held off rolling both a Smuggler and an Imperial Agent as I've heard they're pretty flirt heavy classes and I'd like an answer to this before deciding whether or not to roll them.

 

There's was thread dedicated to that, but it seems to be missing.

 

It probably got locked and redirected here at some point.

 

Personally, I'd love same gender flirts as well. My main is a female sniper and didn't get a lot of flirts at all outside of Vector (the love interest for lady toons.) That conversation has come up before though.

 

The male Smuggler is very very flirt heavy and caused a few players to abandon those characters. It was so bad that it caused some of the male gay members of the community to feel really angry. I don't blame them. It's not just lack of same gender companion romances, but also same gender flirts too.

 

 

Edit: Nevermind. I have an awesome husband. Doup is the man!

 

http://games.ign.com/email.html

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

-snip-

http://games.ign.com/email.html

 

There's also the IGN contact page. It might be one for corporate contacts, but eh... one never knows. Seeing how I am going to be unable to post in a few days due to canceling subscription, it might be best if someone else contacts them first.

I got my mail sent off. As always, you guys will be informed as soon as I have any response. I need everyone to start writing where ever and when ever they can.

 

I know it's obnoxious, but I really don't care. I don't care what other people think of this whole thing, I only care about the content that was promised to us. The LGBTQ community has a history of standing up and making people care.

 

We can do it again.

 

I'll be writing up a follow up letter to GLAAD this weekend. It'll be polite for sure, since they are really trying to help us.

 

Not like I can do much else at the moment. I've got another wisdom tooth extraction in the morning. Joy.

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

Out of curiosity, have you guys also been campaigning for same gender flirts with quest NPCs or have you just being asking for same gender romances with companion? I'd really love same gender romances with companion, and if that's all BioWare wants to add I'll take it, but I'd also really like to be able to flirt with same gender quest NPCs. I've held off rolling both a Smuggler and an Imperial Agent as I've heard they're pretty flirt heavy classes and I'd like an answer to this before deciding whether or not to roll them.

 

It's been asked a few times in here - never got clarified, shockingly. Just another thing they should have answered months ago.

 

I know it's obnoxious, but I really don't care. I don't care what other people think of this whole thing, I only care about the content that was promised to us. The LGBTQ community has a history of standing up and making people care.

 

Given that this ... charming person got a response, with that attitude, maybe obnoxious is what we need to be. Norr only knows that a year of patience got us diddly, after all. (edit - just not as obnoxious as the 1st anno Screenshot thread)

 

I'll be writing up a follow up letter to GLAAD this weekend. It'll be polite for sure, since they are really trying to help us.

 

Not like I can do much else at the moment. I've got another wisdom tooth extraction in the morning. Joy.

 

Arrghh... my sympathies.

Edited December 14, 2012 by Palar

Edit: Not talking about this here. I've sent a bunch of PMs though.

 

I'll just leave this here and let you guys decide. Make sure you scan this thread.

 

I'm pretty pissed off now.

 

They've got to be kidding, right?

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

There's was thread dedicated to that, but it seems to be missing.

 

It probably got locked and redirected here at some point.

 

Personally, I'd love same gender flirts as well. My main is a female sniper and didn't get a lot of flirts at all outside of Vector (the love interest for lady toons.) That conversation has come up before though.

 

The male Smuggler is very very flirt heavy and caused a few players to abandon those characters. It was so bad that it caused some of the male gay members of the community to feel really angry. I don't blame them. It's not just lack of same gender companion romances, but also same gender flirts too.

 

 

Edit: Nevermind. I have an awesome husband. Doup is the man!

 

http://games.ign.com/email.html

 

Ya, that was a thread by Ulain. I think it's just buried in the suggestion box.

Ya, that was a thread by Uluain. I think it's just buried in the suggestion box.

 

It's older than Hades, but I found it:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=114485&highlight=gender&page=7

 

We might get in trouble for necro'ing such an old thread, but there is a precedence. If anyone is feeling froggy, they could try to necro this and/or start a new topic. That was it for same gender flirting when I looked. Amusingly enough, it was in the Story and Lore thread.

 

Oh and thanks for the well wishes! It's gonna be a long weekend with my teeth. At least I should be healed by Yule.

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

I'm firing off another mail to Joveth Gonzales as well as Allison Berryman. I would suggest everyone do the same.

 

It might not help, but I've got a few choice words regarding this thread and how it's being handled.

 

Yep, that follow up letter to GLAAD is going to be written tomorrow night.

 

This is so damned stupid, I'm running out of words.

 

I told you BioWare...I'm a housewife with a lot of free time and nothing to lose.

 

Edit: Wow, I'm on my second document on my computer for my saved posts. At this rate, I'll hit page 3 by the weekend.

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

Thinking about it... "Hi, still haven't got a response from last time... clearly, that's an oversight and not you dodging the issue yet again" - still working on some polite wording.

I'll send you the PM that I wrote to them. I was pretty polite given the circumstances.

 

Edit: Remember, these guys have bosses to report to. If we don't get an answer, don't shoot the messenger. It just means we're gonna have to get louder and possibly start writing to more people directly.

 

Sent my remarks directly to Mr. Gonzales' email as well.

 

edit: Don't bother; it got bounced back to me.

 

Edit #2: While trying to find a direct contact for Jeff Hickman, I ran across yet another news site we can share this with.

 

http://www.rpgsite.net/contact

 

They did an interview with Jeff Hickman on August 23rd. They seem to care about this game, so I figure it's worth a shot.

 

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

I just sent this off. I also sent this to Darth Hater as well.

 

Almost forgot to pass along contact info!

 

support@darthhater.com

 

I hit up http://www.swtorstrategies.com/contact as too.

 

Told ya I was going to start emailing everyone.

 

To the writing staff of rpg staff,

 

My name is Real Name. I'm 33 years old and I live in Real Locale. I'm an avid gamer and advocate for equal rights. I'm coming to you with a concern regarding Electronic Arts/BioWare and their claimed inclusion of the LGBTQ community. Forgive that this is more in the form of a question rather than an article.

 

I am a member of the that community for the game Star Wars: The Old Republic. I helped coordinate and write a FAQ for the thread called, "Same Gender Relationship Clarifications" , in the Story and Lore section of the ToR forums. I go by the forum handle Natashina.

 

Last September a promise was made by Stephen Reid, former Senior Online Communication Manager, stating that same gender romances were coming in The Old Republic. This was statement was used by the moderators at the The Old Republic forums until late September of this year.

 

Due to the design constraints of a fully voiced MMO of this scale and size, many choices had to be made as to the launch and post-launch feature set. Same gender romances with companion characters in Star Wars: The Old Republic will be a post-launch feature. Because The Old Republic is an MMO, the game will live on through content expansions which allow us to include content and features that could not be included at launch, including the addition of more companion characters who will have additional romance options.

 

Here's the link to the current incarnation of this thread: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=476215

 

The FAQ the posters and myself created has tons of quotes and links to back up not only BioWare/EA's stance on same gender romance content in this game, but also in general.

 

If you are curious, here is the link. http://www.swtor.com/community/showp...postcount=2368

 

This thread started on January 17th, looking for more clarity on the content that was promised. This has gone through several incarnations over the year, usually locked at about 100 pages. Currently, the latest incarnation is up to 399 pages. (sidenote: this was earlier)

 

Over the months, the LGBT ToR community has tried every polite, respectful and patient way to try to get further information regarding a possible time frame.

 

Up until about two months ago, any and all other threads with this topic got closed and redirected to this back part of the forums. There is now one other thread about this topic in the General Forums.

 

The next official update was in March at BioWare's ToR Guild Summit on March 6th, made by Daniel Erickson.

 

This is an interesting one because it sort of lit up, and we didn't honestly -- if we should give an update on it every single time -- We've always said the same thing with it, which is that it's coming, and it's coming with story updates. And we totally understand when people hear "soon", um, maybe I should have put the TM next to it that, "writer Soon"? The writers have a much, much larger lead time than you would expect, and we wanna do any of this stuff right. We heard suggestions, and we do read the stuff, and let's talk a little about the stuff we were not willing to do. We were not willing to go in and just change all the dialogue to work for the other gender. That is not writing. That is not good storytelling.

 

Also from Mr. Erickson at the Guild Summit:

 

When we do this, we wanna do it right, we wanna do it with the characters that make sense, that we always knew that we wanted to do it for those, so you guys know and we've talked about it before, it ended up being a budget and scheduling issue. There are romance arcs that we wanted to do that didn't make it in the game, we knew which characters (I'm not gonna tell you)... [some audience joking about characters] So the short answer is, it's never changed, it's still coming, it's coming when full story comes, and when is full story coming? This year. So we are still on track.

 

That was over eight months ago. Since then, both of those gentlemen have left the company. BioWare has had no official word since and the silence is rather deafening. They have never come onto the forum boards and said anything directly to the players. They also have not made a public announcement since then. Mr. Erickson's quote was never officially transcribed to the ToR forums. I got the transcript from the site Darth Hater instead.

 

After the founders of BioWare left as well as Mr. Reid and Mr. Erickson, we've been trying to found out if the content is still coming into the game. We've tried the following:

 

*Private Messages to Moderators and Developers on the forum boards.

*Twitter and Facebook.

*Email and Snail mail.

*"Ask the Devs" and other such developer "Q&As"

*The Livestream cast, with over 25% of the questions related to same gender romance content and not a single question addressed.

 

All with no results.

 

Also, on September 7th, the PvP developer named Gabe Amatangelo made very brief off-hand comment on a video about SGRs:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...93G-SrI#t=649s

 

Hall Hood, current lead writer for ToR, made the following Tweet that evening.

 

"Hall Hood @hallhood (1 of 2) To all the folks who have been expressing interest in SGRs, here is the official word from Gabe Amatangelo..."

 

It was deleted within hours of it being put up. Members of the forums including myself managed to get that copied before it got deleted. I was going to put it into the SGR FAQ for further information regarding the subject.

 

Frankly, many of us are at our wits end. We've seen many articles as of late with EA talking about their pride in including the LGBT gaming community and providing content for them. Yet for The Old Republic, there has been nothing but complete silence.

 

Here's the article in question: http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-10-15-Publishers-LGBT-Equality-is-Civil-Rights-Issue-of-our-Time

 

The correction notice at the bottom came about after the players wrote in to the editor.

 

The last time a moderator even came out and spoke to the thread was on September 7th, the same day as Mr. Amatangelo's comment.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showp...postcount=1164

 

 

As hard as this is to believe, things have gotten worse. <insert new yellow text here with some comments of mine>

 

BioWare and Electronic Arts have espoused at length about their pride in presenting LGBTQ content. Yet for our little community, there has been nothing but stone cold silence. If BW/EA likes to talk about how much they love to include LGBT content in games, but will not say a word about this in their MMO, then they are just using that community for good PR.

 

I'm coming to the folks at this site, so perhaps you could bring this to light and this community can get some solid and public answers.

 

Thank you very much for your time,

 

Real Name

Real Locale

 

 

You guys can use all or part of that as you wish. I'm not going to stop. Like I said before, when all of this started:

 

Ah, my Sith passion fuels me!

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

Bwhahahaha!

 

 

I told you BW, I've got a lot of free time on my hands. Nothing to lose and then this happens.

 

Guys, we got a hit from http://www.swtorstrategies.com/ They are going to be writing about this.

 

And who says I don't give good Yule gifts.

 

 

First letter response:

 

We have thought about doing a story on it, but it has been mention a few times that this is now on the back burner, since half of the staff got canned.

 

We all know that isn't true, so I sent him these follow ups:

 

They have not come and told the SGR community any of this at all. Not at all since March and not publicly. It is no where on the website at all. No videos talk about it, other than one from a PvP developer that said he thinks it coming.

 

We keep getting the same copy and paste answer from the moderators. If this is BioWare's answer is there any way to have them say this directly to the press and/or player base?

 

I got a different answer from gamesindustry.biz. This is what BioWare told them:

 

"We too have gotten a lot of questions about this and should be able to issue an answer soon. We had to be able to confirm things and we’re getting closer to that point. As soon as we have final confirmation that is happening, we’ll let you know to give you a heads up."

 

Which answer is true?

 

There is still a very wide spread interest in this. There has been over 2000 pages and over 30,000 posts about this subject. Myself and others have contacted GLAAD. They are apparently investigating this matter and I'd really like this brought to full light.

 

Thanks again for your time,

 

Real Name

 

This is the second follow up I did:

 

I just did a search on Google and nowhere on it did it say SGRs had been scrapped for any reason. Does the writing staff on your team know something that myself and the players do not?

 

If that is true, then please show me the source of that information. If that isn't true, then I'll request again for you and your staff to write an article about this matter.

 

Thanks again and I'll let you get back to work.

 

And I got this reply:

 

I have mailed it to Lisa. She will see if she can dig something up. I'm pretty sure they answered questions about it on one of the meet and greet ( cantina tour ) things. I can't remember though. I have to admit that it's not one of those things I have taken much note about.

 

Lisa will do a story on it though. Stay tuned.

 

 

 

Lisa is their other senior editor.

 

Our efforts are starting to pay off guys! At least this way the media can either help give us an answer or blow the lid off this whole thing.

 

We've officially gotten the press to care. Once this article hits, you bet I'm going to make sure every and any website will have this linked. That's why I was so persistent. I didn't care about what the net thinks of us and I think it's working now.

 

That's why I've said all along to never ever give up. That's the power of being pro-active. Let's keep it going guys!

 

 

They were asking if anyone has a direct screenshot of the deleted Tweet. I'm writing to some of our fallen comrades to see if they have one. Did anyone else here get that lucky?

 

As of right now, we're still writing back and forth. I'll keep you guys updated!

Edited December 14, 2012 by natashina

I completely forgot about those events - I guess they do make a good smoke-screen to point at and say they answered something... especially since

After each event, we’ll be publishing a meet & greet summary blog so that those of you that aren’t able to attend will be caught up with any relevant information.

 

has never eventuated for any of them. I found a loose recap for one of them on Darth Hater, but that's all.