I find it very amusing that waiting for a shuttle was considered a feature. Waiting. For. A. Shuttle.

Yeah, until you factor in that both factions used the same shuttles and as a Jedi Knight/Dark Jedi Knight, you were always flagged for PvP. You also moved using the shuttles when going in and out of PvP fights and you were usually flagged when doing so. Much hilarity was had at those spaceports.

It was also a tactical decision to choose which spaceport you used to move your own forces in and out of planets to avoid being ambushed when going into a planet to destroy bases in Player Cities.

It was common for huge fights to just erupt organically due to this "boring ffeature".

Yeah, until you factor in that both factions used the same shuttles and as a Jedi Knight/Dark Jedi Knight, you were always flagged for PvP. You also moved using the shuttles when going in and out of PvP fights and you were usually flagged when doing so. Much hilarity was had at those spaceports.

 

It was also a tactical decision to choose which spaceport you used to move your own forces in and out of planets to avoid being ambushed when going into a planet to destroy bases in Player Cities.

 

It was common for huge fights to just erupt organically due to this "boring ffeature".

Exactly, choosing which Spar-port you deployed your forces from was pivotal. Deploying your pvp group from one of the main Star-ports was suicide. I can't count how many raids we crushed when groups was dumb enough to use the main Star-ports.

Would love to see SWG come back I miss all the things I could do in it that you can't even dream of doing in this game which because they rushed it is a heap of junk! ):< which makes me angry because I expect much better then this from Biowere and EA (well maybe NOT EA in their resent rip people off years). I want to love this game I really do and trust me its not from lack of trying its from all the BS that keeps getting pulled and the Morons that play it that are to scared to think and so run around trolling and griefing people to get their own way, when what they really need is a smack around the ear!

If SWG came back online I'd drop my sub here and resub with SWG in a heartbeat!

Here is a hint: since that game has absolutely nothing to do with this game, posting about it on this board is OFF TOPIC. So yeah, the existing thread is on the OFF TOPIC board:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=716882

You mean there are other forums than General? :eek:

/sarcasm

it'll be a survival MMO sandbox game, with zombies and players could build and manage cities.

Yeah. Thats what hes been hinting at. So out of touch.

Seriously, SWG was the best ever. And if you thought that the 10 minute waits for shuttles were awesome, you didn't mentioned the other fantastic things like this that the devs put in!

For example, one of the things I love about player housing was the bills. They'd come in, you'd have to spend 30, 40, 50 minutes a week sorting mail, paying bills, and getting the bills sent out. The BEST part was when you ran out of stamps. Because then you got to go to the galactic post office. And the devs really loved having social experiences, so there was only one post office for the entire galaxy, and never more than 2 clerks. You were guaranteed a 20-45 minute wait to buy stamps. SO MUCH awesome socializing! Plus to make socializing even MORE common, you could only buy 10 stamps at a time, which would only last about one week. Awesome!

And they added awesome things like this for stuff outside of housing! Like if you had a space ship and did starfighter battles. Well, you'd have to get that vehicle registered with the department of intergalactic motor vehicles. Every 3 months you'd have to re-register your space ship, which meant 1-3 HOURS waiting at the DMV.

It. Was. AWESOME.

EVERYONE on my server loved the intergalactic DMV. Because you were GUARANTEED a long wait. So much socializing! Plus if you don't think PvP happened at the intergalactic DMV, you're out of your gourd! Super cool.

Man, SWG was perfect. We need more of this stuff in SWTOR and every other MMO!

Oh, I forgot to mention how after every space battle you'd have to go see someone about repairs to your ship. It was super awesome, you'd go into a space ship body shop. Then you'd be told to wait in a waiting room. It was a tiny room with a gross-looking pot of coffee and often another person in there with a baby, and that baby would cry every 2-3 minutes. It was super loud, super annoying, and even more super awesome.

Exactly, choosing which Spar-port you deployed your forces from was pivotal. Deploying your pvp group from one of the main Star-ports was suicide. I can't count how many raids we crushed when groups was dumb enough to use the main Star-ports.

Sorry folks, but waiting for shuttles is not a feature. Its a forced restriction you see as a feature. Its totally fine if you see it this way. That said, it doesn't work for the rest of us.

I remember this one of the main reasons I quit FFXI. Waiting for transportation is borderline stupid. Its a video game about a fictional universe that can't even update their own technology. Its not real life.

Sorry folks, but waiting for shuttles is not a feature. Its a forced restriction you see as a feature. Its totally fine if you see it this way. That said, it doesn't work for the rest of us.

 

I remember this one of the main reasons I quit FFXI. Waiting for transportation is borderline stupid. Its a video game about a fictional universe that can't even update their own technology. Its not real life.

See though; MMOs used to be more than just about playing another game. Communities used to matter and all those tiny annoyances actually caused interaction. Maybe that only appeals to a niche, but thats what old school MMOers were before the mass consumption WOW generation came.

dear god please let it not be eqnext.

.

dear god please let it not be eqnext.

 

.

He said not EQ Next, but then he's also hinted its not scifi so... might as well be EQ Next

See though; MMOs used to be more than just about playing another game. Communities used to matter and all those tiny annoyances actually caused interaction. Maybe that only appeals to a niche, but thats what old school MMOers were before the mass consumption WOW generation came.

I understand what you are saying. Outside my guild though I don't use MMOs to socialize.

I don't want to stand in a fake bar waiting for a buff from a dancer or waiting for a shuttle. I am probably why all you "old school MMO players" (which I am myself) hate the way the new MMOs are designed.

But that's my point. I want to play a game. Its not a social engine...for me at least.

See though; MMOs used to be more than just about playing another game. Communities used to matter and all those tiny annoyances actually caused interaction. Maybe that only appeals to a niche, but thats what old school MMOers were before the mass consumption WOW generation came.

The audience has changed.

There are still "old schoolers" around (like me), but we are very much a minority segment of the player base that plays MMOs these days. Even a lot of old schoolers have become anti-social Mac-attack fast food MMO junkies these days..... courtesy of years of console game play IMO.

See though; MMOs used to be more than just about playing another game. Communities used to matter and all those tiny annoyances actually caused interaction. Maybe that only appeals to a niche, but thats what old school MMOers were before the mass consumption WOW generation came.

Communities still matter to people...just not all people. Forced interaction isn't a good thing and will, in fact, turn people off. As an old school MMOer myself, there was nothing good about anything that was forced.

This and other MMO's are truly just games. They are played for enjoyment. Spending 10 minutes of your (often limited) play time standing around doing nothing is not fun and fun is why we play these games.

The only interaction I remember from the long wait times of SWG coupled with the lack of any form of transport outside of running at the beginning...not to mention corpse runs...was non stop complaining in chat.

The audience has changed.

 

There are still "old schoolers" around (like me), but we are very much a minority segment of the player base that plays MMOs these days. Even a lot of old schoolers have become anti-social Mac-attack fast food MMO junkies these days..... courtesy of years of console game play IMO.

That's all very true, but I am just saying that it wasn't as bad as it may seem. There probably is a market out there for the niche but whoever would go for it would have to make sure they don't go with too big of a budget. It would be even more beneficial if you allowed it to be almost as an aside from games like this one, rather than head on compete with it.

Communities still matter to people...just not all people. Forced interaction isn't a good thing and will, in fact, turn people off. As an old school MMOer myself, there was nothing good about anything that was forced.

 

This and other MMO's are truly just games. They are played for enjoyment. Spending 10 minutes of your (often limited) play time standing around doing nothing is not fun and fun is why we play these games.

 

The only interaction I remember from the long wait times of SWG coupled with the lack of any form of transport outside of running at the beginning...not to mention corpse runs...was non stop complaining in chat.

At any given time of the day you can log onto fleet and see the same people driving in circles waiting for whatever "to pop". Sometimes they are even making fun of those annoying game mechanics from EQ or SWG that forced you to sometimes wait up to 30 minutes for a boat/shuttle... while they spend hours driving in circles.

Irony is a foreign concept to MMO players.

[...] fun [...] forced interdependency,

You see what you wrote there?

You see what you wrote there?

 

You're so clever. Too bad you're not clever enough to comprehend that fun is 100% subjective.

Learn to troll, muppet.

See though; MMOs used to be more than just about playing another game. Communities used to matter and all those tiny annoyances actually caused interaction. Maybe that only appeals to a niche, but thats what old school MMOers were before the mass consumption WOW generation came.

I know that's what they "used to be", but that's a reason I didn't "use to play them." Like many people here, I came for Kotor 3. Unlike many people who wanted Kotor3, I accepted the fact that I'm getting "Kotor3-lite wMP support" and I have tried out the mp parts, and I have fun, but to be honest, MP is (to me) just another mini-game like the PVE space game (which I occasionally find relaxing to play). I'm not looking for *more* friends, playing computer games is what I do when I want to take a break from other people.

Also, I don't want to be on constant voice chat (I hate wearing headphones, and it interferes with my ability to play loud background music) and the text-chat system in this game sucks. I'm a horrible typist, I type slowly, and I don't like using sloppy grammar, so I find it almost impossible to talk *to* people, and I'm usually too busy paying attention to what's going on (i.e., playing the game) to read all the stuff other people are "saying" (especially since it all runs together).

tl;dr -- we know what MMOs used to be and didn't like them, that's why developers changed them

At any given time of the day you can log onto fleet and see the same people driving in circles waiting for whatever "to pop". Sometimes they are even making fun of those annoying game mechanics from EQ or SWG that forced you to sometimes wait up to 30 minutes for a boat/shuttle... while they spend hours driving in circles.

 

Irony is a foreign concept to MMO players.

Nice Straw Man. How do you know they are the same people? What I see on fleet are people moving from point A to point B, often with a goal of getting to a vendor/quest giver/GTN terminal/whatever. Those few who just "hang out" in fleet are paying (or not) to play their game so who are we to judge their hanging out in a virtual world doing nothing?

Sorry folks, but waiting for shuttles is not a feature. Its a forced restriction you see as a feature. Its totally fine if you see it this way. That said, it doesn't work for the rest of us.

 

I remember this one of the main reasons I quit FFXI. Waiting for transportation is borderline stupid. Its a video game about a fictional universe that can't even update their own technology. Its not real life.

The main Dev specifically said they implemented that feature for the sole purpose of fostering social interaction. And you what, it worked! That's where the merchant classes and crafting classes would go to advertise their services, Doctors would be set up outside the Starports selling and administering buffs (They were one of the 2 classes out of 30 that could administer buffs) Multiple dueling matches took place there since as well. You weren't there just picking your nose. It was a social hub, which worked as a tool to bring the community together.

Communities still matter to people...just not all people. Forced interaction isn't a good thing and will, in fact, turn people off. As an old school MMOer myself, there was nothing good about anything that was forced.

 

This and other MMO's are truly just games. They are played for enjoyment. Spending 10 minutes of your (often limited) play time standing around doing nothing is not fun and fun is why we play these games.

 

The only interaction I remember from the long wait times of SWG coupled with the lack of any form of transport outside of running at the beginning...not to mention corpse runs...was non stop complaining in chat.

Actually forced interaction is a good thing. In real life, we meet most of our acquaintances in School and Work that's because we're forced to be there. This mechanie allowed players to build a familiarity with one another since you encountered them more frequently. That's why today's gamers are so distant and antagonistic towards other players, because these games lack the social building mechanics to build strong communities.

Here's another reason why socializing was so important in SWG, and why they instituted the mechanics to foster it. PVP was focused around player implemented military bases that you could acquire with credits or rep points. The way the top guilds distinguished themselves was to implement multiple bases in their player cities. The only catch was 2 hours out of the day your bases were vulnerable to enemy attack, and if they destroyed it, all of that time you spent acquiring the bases went right down the drain and signified that your guild was to weak to defend it's home, which would prevent other players from joining your guild.

Now in in-order to protect your bases your NEEDED the assistance of other guilds. Not one guild could defend their base once multiple guilds banded together (Which happened frequently) to attack your installation. So if you were the average SWTOR player you see in general chat or in Warzones, talking down about other guilds, saying how this guild and that guild sucked, and how bad this player was, you weren't getting ANY assistance from that guild when the enemies were raiding your player city.

So the stronger your social network was, the more assistance you could call when 100+ players were raiding your city and taking down your precious bases. So if you were a guild that thought you were better than everyone else, then your city wouldn't last a weekend, that's because you needed the assistance of outside guilds to ensure your city lived to see another day. And you know where most of these alliances were formed? In Starports and Cantinas. Places you were forced to be from time to time.