Jump to content

HK-51 Quest & its PVP requirement.


WarbNull

Recommended Posts

I'm not even going to try to respond to the PvP advocates and others saying it's no big deal. They refuse to acknowledge that many people who chose a PvE server chose so they don't ever have to PvP. I chose a PvE server because I hate PvP. Up to this point, I was able to enjoy the game without having to engage in PvP. EAWare created new content that nearly everyone is interested in with the HK-51 companion. It doesn't matter if it is optional content or not, it is desired content by a majority of the playerbase. Because I choose to not participate in PvP (I refuse to even flag), this content is unattainable for me. Since the content that I wanted to access is essentially gated away from me, I vote with my dollars. Account cancelled. I'm sure there'll be a flood of knuckle-draggers will come in now and tell me how childish it is to cancel over such a trivial thing however, if the developers choose to add content that I don't enjoy, why should I reward them with my subscription money? What others fail to understand is that if enough people decide to vote with their dollars such as I did, then this hurts the game as a whole.

 

One final question; for those who are claiming that this is the PvP content they've been begging for, is it really that enjoyable for you to engage in PvP with players who don't want to fight back?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 888
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

The responses here are pretty much absurd.

 

1. PVPers calling the PVE folks crybabies because they don't want to go into a PVP area to get a PVE companion.

2. PVPers comparing the fact that they have to go through PVE content to get the same item, so it's only fair.

3. PVE folks pointing out that griefing will very likely happen, and the PVP folks 100% admitting that they will be the ones to do it.

4. PVPers saying that because someone doesn't PVP, then they don't belong in an MMO.

5. PVPers complaining that all the new content is for PVE and they only change things for that.

 

These comments are just baffling to me. My responses:

 

1. HK-51 is a PVE companion (as has been pointed out several times). So, PVE folks shouldn't have to go into a PVP area to get a part, even if it is for just a minute or two. And yes, PVPers, if you want a PVE companion, then you should have to do some PVE content to get it.

 

2. And complaining that you're forced to PVE too much as it is? Really? That's where the content comes from. That's where the stories and the characters and the classes come from. You want to just randomly kill each other without any of that in a game? Go play a FPS.

 

3. There are different types of servers for folks who have different play styles. If people are on a PVP server, then they have no room to complain about having to go to a PVP area, since all areas are PVP areas. However, for those on a PVE server, that was a choice. It means that we don't want to PVP when we're just trying to get some questing finished; and if we want to PVP we can hop in a warzone or flag ourselves. Not to mention that several of you have already said you're planning to camp the vendor and actively stop people from getting the item. Which for those of us that have limited time to play the game as it is, so we would want to get in and get the item and move on with the quest, now we can't. Because you want to be a jerk. What you're saying is that you want to stop people from having fun. In a game. That's how you get your rocks off. Possibly because you are bullied in your real life, so you try to take it out on other people in a game. Congrats, you're awesome.

 

4. MMO does not mean PVP. There are plenty of things to do with other people in this game outside of PVP. Heroics, grouping for fun, Operations, etc. But that doesn't count for you guys for some reason, because it's not PVP, so it's not really MMO content, right? People play a MMO for many reasons. One of those reasons is to just be in a world where other people are also doing the same thing, and to see those other people on the screen. Maybe chat a bit with folks who are also playing. Not just to go fight with/against other players.

 

5. How many changes have been made to classes as a result of PVPers complaining about how OP one class is vs. another class. So, the devs change abilities, specifically for PVP crybabies. And those changes often have negative impacts in PVE. But no, no one EVER listens to you PVPers. It's just PVE all the time...

 

Bottom line is, if you want to PVP, play on a PVP server or queue for a warzone. PVE players shouldn't be forced to PVP if they don't want to. Even if it is for just a brief period of time to get one part to continue with more PVE content.

 

Signed

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is false logic. You don't pay for "your" game, you pay for BioWare's game.

 

BioWare's game does, in point of fact, contain PvP quests. If you are suggesting that this HK-51 quest is a PvP quest because it contains the possibility of PvP, then fine, I'm not even going to argue that point anymore. It's not particularly important what kind of quest this is. BioWare has PvP quests in it's game, and you pay for that game. Not "your" game; their game.

 

Just because you joined a PvE server doesn't mean there will be zero PvP quests on your server. BioWare did not promise you that. It just means that these quests will be completely optional. The HK-51 quest is completely optional. There are optional raid quests, optional Heroic quests, and yes, even optional PvP quests in ToR. If you don't like that, then it's a problem with your outlook, not with the game itself.

 

There is content for PvEers in ToR. That is not the same statement as "All content is for PvEers in ToR." Some content is for PvPers, too, even on PvE servers.

 

edit: It's interesting that you say BioWare should have taken different playstyles into account. If they move the vendor to a PvE area, they are essentially telling PvPers, "Sorry, this quest wasn't designed for you." Of course you don't seem particularly concerned about PvPers, as you would seem to be perfectly happy if the quest had been designed only with PvE components.

 

Again, I will repeat. Let's stop with all this hypocrisy and double standards.

 

-Macheath.

 

You're the one guilty of False Logic. HK can not, in any way, shape, or form, be considered a PvP quest, since you can't use companions in War Zones.

 

Therefore, this is a purely PvE based reward, and should contain PvE content to acquire.

 

A PvP only player has no use for HK, and as such, is not required to partake in PvE Content to acquire something they will never use.

 

If they engage in PvE content, and thus do have a use for HK, then they aren't a pure PvP player, and have no right to complain.

 

I play on a PvE server because I absolutely loathe getting ganked. I don't want to deal with it, I don't find it fun..... in fact, it causes my blood pressure to spike and veins to pop out on my forehead. I would rather unsubscribe then deal with being forced into a world PvP situation again.

 

I managed to complete the quest by switching to the new unpopulated instance when it spawned yesterday on Harbinger.... but not until I died 5-6 times trying to get to the vendor. (And no, you can't spawn flop your way there, because you can only revive at the droid)

 

I don't understand the World PVP attitude. Why someone would find pleasure in tormenting other players for hours on end. It's sadistic, cruel, and shows that you are a sociopath. Seek professional help.

 

And Bioware.... move the vendor. Seriously, there have been a number of stupid moves in this game, but you do not comprehend your PvE playerbase at all if you don't understand that this is a betrayal of our most basic trust. We roll PvE for a reason, and you need to respect that, or you will lose us. If we can't count on you not to force us into these situations, we will not subscribe to your game. Period. End of Story.

 

So fix it, or start bleeding subs.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm getting sick of the forced pvp myself ,this the 3rd time i've had to go into Outlaws Den if i wanted to do a quest.

 

First was a companion quest on my smuggler ,there is a cave on the imp side i had to get to so either i want through the imp bases or the free pvp zone.

Second was the rakgoul event quest for the pet ,which i never did cause of the pvp zone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why are people complaining about this? Pvpers have to do pve to get HK-51, and pvers have to do pvp to get it as well. All is fair.

 

HK-51 is completely unnecessary. You don't use companions in FPs or Ops, and you already have 5 if you want to grind dailies.

 

One correction you can use companions in Flashpoints. Only in operations you can't. So the statement you do'n't use companions in Flashpoints is incorrect.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think i have posted on a similar thread. I agree no forced PvP for a compaion. I didn't like the PvP run (I am notmally up for PvP but think expertise has made a joke to PvP, my gear is worth less than recruit PvP gear and the only way to get better PvP gear is to be cannon fodder in PvP matches till I get the better gear) I bascially did it a 2 am so no one else was around. All this meant was I had to stay up late one weekend, not a hardship but why force that on anyone.

 

As for the scanner I spent less that 10 minutes on each location. Then again I grouped and helped others.

Edited by Izorii
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why are people complaining about this? Pvpers have to do pve to get HK-51, and pvers have to do pvp to get it as well. All is fair.

 

HK-51 is completely unnecessary. You don't use companions in FPs or Ops, and you already have 5 if you want to grind dailies.

 

You don't use your compainions in warzones or outlaws den either.. and anyone who uses their comp for other PvP based combat are just baddies,,,

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no issue with the PvP requirement. However I do have a big issue with being forced to do a hard mode flashpoint. Your forcing me to group with a bunch of snobs, who play this white knuckled and expect me to have the best gear possible. I dont like to do those intense hard or nightmare mode things, not my thing...I prefer PvP and warzones by far.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no issue with the PvP requirement. However I do have a big issue with being forced to do a hard mode flashpoint. Your forcing me to group with a bunch of snobs, who play this white knuckled and expect me to have the best gear possible. I dont like to do those intense hard or nightmare mode things, not my thing...I prefer PvP and warzones by far.

 

And this here is the problem and why I have little sympathy with the OP. Many of the PVE players are unhappy to visit outlaws den but they are nore than happy that we are forced into a HM to complete the quest, they say so in this thread and defend their arguement around spurious claims that this is a PVE companion.

 

HK-51 is a companion like any other. Companions are mainly used to solo content. Yes they can be used to short run a flashpoint and open world PvP but their main usage is in soloing and running missions.

 

BW could have instituted a phased version of the HM to allow people not wanting to group PVE from completing the quest, they haven't well OK then I won't be doing the quest yet. Similarly they have decided to place part of the quest chain in the Outlaws Den, If you don't want to go there then wait a few weeks for the fuss to die down and do it then.

 

If you want to be taken seriously then support both sides not just your own preference.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm not a pvp'er so I was dreading this step. When i got to it, I stopped outside the Den to prepare myself for the worse. I saw someone else go in so I just ran in after him, followed him to the little Jawa npc, and bought my 2 items. I saw a couple enemy players, but for the most part, they were doing the same thing as me. Once done, I just ported out to the homebase cantina, waited 5 mintes for my pvp flag to shut off, and went on my merry way. It really was nothing like I was anticipating.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Disclaimer: I have PvPed in many different games; I am not anti-PvP.

 

It tends to happen when people hand over money to be entertained. The options you describe are:

 

1) This requires active PvP players because frankly a group of PvEers aren't going to cut it if there's a professional ganking squad in the area. In practice, I can't think of any situation where a bunch of fed-up 'carebears' actually did win against a group harrassing them. It just feeds the fire.

 

There is a story in this thread (#583 page 59, as of this writing) that talks about just this. I will quote, because it was a very beautiful story.

 

11/15, 10pm, Outlaws Den.

 

I’m not a PvPer...

 

You see, the Imps had camped near the entrance to Outlaws Den and had literally taken over the area. No pubs could get in, even in coordinated groups. But the Pub players had had enough and were gathering in full force. After a few messages in chat, we met at the outpost and started to make our way to the Den as a group. And… it was an awesome sight. Our little rag tag army of Pubs, all with different speeders and gear, were cruising in like an invasion. I had a huge grin on my face despite reminding myself that as a PVE player this was not what I had signed up for.

 

The music, the atmosphere, the noise from the speeders, hell, everything amped up the anticipation of the impending battle. Speilberg couldn’t have orchestrated a more drama! :D And suddenly, there they were. The the enemy. Similar in size to our group, they were ready for our onslaught. They had made their preparations. We stopped and gathered a short distance away and made our own final adjustments.

 

Then suddenly, like a scene right out of Brave Heart, we charged! The fight was epic. The combatants ran forward and clashed head on. I was hitting everything in sight, but focused on their healers as planned. We held our own, and sure enough, after a bit of ebb and flow, we got the better of them. In a last desperate act, they turned tail and ran! And we chased them down until there was nothing left but clean Tatooine sand.

 

2) This is rather akin to a launch queue - please play at a time not of your choosing. That is pretty much classic coercion.

This will work perfectly for some players (who can play at multiple times). This will not work for others.

 

EVERY suggestion is like this. None of the suggestions works for everyone. But everyone CAN find a way of doing this that does work for him or her. Except, maybe, not on the first day. And maybe people will feel bad searching for ways that work.

 

What you are missing is that the mindset of the player that signs up for the game is allowed to vary. There is no rule that states 'you must be prepared to PvP'.

 

There is no rule that says you must prepare to raise a char of the opposite faction to level 15.

There is no rule that says you must run FPs.

There is no rule that says you must have a character Level 50.

There is no rule that says you must have 125k creds to spend.

 

All these are requirements for HK-51. Some of these feel more coercive than others. It's interesting.

 

As for coercion in the mindset itself, well, if you study the psychology of online gaming, there are several archetypes for whom completing all content is very important. That's just a fact of life.

 

This game is much easier on OCD people than, say, Warcraft ever was. One word: Thunderfury :-)

 

It would be interesting to see what developers do in the future, and whether they comment on this.

 

I know that there is much more player interaction around HK missions than any other piece of content, really. Which I like. But some of that interaction is ugly, like extortion.

 

Today, a guild member asked my jugg (in WH) to escort him and his wife to the Outlaw's Den. We arrived there and I announced, simply, that we are forming a group. We got together six people and went. There were three folk who tried to AOE the vendor. They died to us; my char was the only one with PvP gear among friends and foes, I think. The whole thing took about 5 min, and was reasonably fun. One of us died too, we ressed him.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People have different styles of playing and bioware should have taken that into account.

 

Just because some of you enjoying pvp gives you no right to tell others to suck it and do it.

 

I am recommending people to NOT do it. Not all content is for everyone.

 

Actually, a lot of people whine in WZs (for various reasons). I tell them the same thing. If the experience is not meaningful for you - leave. It's a big galaxy, with much to do, many places to go, many folk to meet, etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why are people complaining about this? Pvpers have to do pve to get HK-51, and pvers have to do pvp to get it as well. All is fair.

 

HK-51 is completely unnecessary. You don't use companions in FPs or Ops, and you already have 5 if you want to grind dailies.

 

Actually, one of my guildies used his Khem Val to tank the HM Foundry to get his HK. I've soloed HM BT using just Lokin. (Just to prove I could)

 

Dailies are PvE content, so HK is a PvE reward, and should require PvE content.

 

And to those complaining about who you run PvE content with... your argument makes no sense.... make a group with your guild, you have complete control of the situation.

 

It is the lack of control that makes world PvP incredibly frustrating and anxiety producing for me. I Played WoW on a PvP Server..... I was a scarab lord, with a thunderfury.... yeah... I'm one of those OCD people someone else mentioned. I had a giant neon sign on my head, because every ganker on the server wanted the bragging rights. I still hold a grudge against that *********** Rogue from RopeTown.

 

I don't dislike PvP. My Sniper has valor 70, and I'm 3 pieces shy of full War Hero. But in a WZ, the environment is controlled, and I have chosen to engage in a fight with even numbers.

 

It's the lack of control. It's being forced into a combat situation without my express consent..... It's a violation of my free will.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's the lack of control. It's being forced into a combat situation without my express consent..... It's a violation of my free will.

 

What?

 

You agreed to participate by the EULA to what happens in the game. You freely "chose" to login. TBH, if you can only PvP in WZ then you are not much of a PvPer.

 

Besides if you actually read this thread you will see that this is not as big a deal as all of you are QQing about it.

 

Again there are plenty of ways to get the component from the vendor without engaging in PvP.

 

Patience and self control ...

 

Free will and games? ------> :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no issue with the PvP requirement. However I do have a big issue with being forced to do a hard mode flashpoint. Your forcing me to group with a bunch of snobs, who play this white knuckled and expect me to have the best gear possible. I dont like to do those intense hard or nightmare mode things, not my thing...I prefer PvP and warzones by far.

 

I went in with my PvP-geared stealth Op, none of us had a clue what we were doing (I've been gone for a couple of months so forgot the area) and we breezed through it. Revan was pathetically easy. Not everyone that does HMs is a snob. What you prefer is irrelevant, the quest was designed to touch on multiple aspects of the game.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have to say that I loved this quest. It was fun going through areas and not knowing what to expect.

 

I'm not a big fan of HK but It was a new thing to do and I did not read any hints or guides before hand.

 

As I stood with my group outside the outlaws den I almost didn't want to as I am not a PvPer, however I made the first few steps and got flagged, not know what we needed to do we started to use our scanners, we did see a few "red" names running around but they seemed to leave us alone, only one person came over and started on one of the other group members but 2 people took him out.

 

When we got to the vendor a bunch of people were standing around and again no one was attacking each other so I ported out and turned off my flag.

 

I do have a few friends that like to PvP and it isn't as much fun when you are against someone who does not want to as they will most likely stand and let you kill them so they leave you alone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What?

 

You agreed to participate by the EULA to what happens in the game. You freely "chose" to login. TBH, if you can only PvP in WZ then you are not much of a PvPer.

 

Besides if you actually read this thread you will see that this is not as big a deal as all of you are QQing about it.

 

Again there are plenty of ways to get the component from the vendor without engaging in PvP.

 

Patience and self control ...

 

Free will and games? ------> :D

 

I understand the point you are trying to make but unless you are on a pvp server you do get to chose to enage in pvp if you wish. And I would be the first to tell you I am a horrible pvp player since I never do it. lol.

Edited by ScarletBlaze
Link to comment
Share on other sites

One correction you can use companions in Flashpoints. Only in operations you can't. So the statement you do'n't use companions in Flashpoints is incorrect.

 

Yes I know you can use comps in FPs, but nobody ever does because they are trash compared to a player. The only time you would use a comp in a FP is when you're doing some lower level FP for whatever reason, and those don't matter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I understand the point you are trying to make but unless you are on a pvp server you do get to chose to enage in pvp if you wish. And I would be the first to tell you I am a horrible pvp player since I never do it. lol.

 

I was more outraged by that posters missunderstanding of what free will entails.

 

I play mainly on PvE Servers. I mainly Solo. I am not entirely pleased that I will have to run an OP and risk some PvP. But, such is life. If I want the companion those are the critia that I have to abide by to obtain said companinon. The price of an HK droid is a little PvP and an OP (in addition to some jumping puzzles ( how I loath those ... Lol) ).

 

That poster failed to realize that his "choice" was bound by what he agreed to in the EULA.

 

It was extreem to say it was a violation of his free will. I would say if his free will is so easily violated then he doesn't diserve his "free will". :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites


×
×
  • Create New...