No augments, no datacrons. My main wouldn't copy so I made a new Commando. He was about 3 hours old here.

Honestly, I took surge because I felt alacrity was useless. It seemed to me like the ammo regen would be offset by the lowered cast times, and essentially be working against itself. I do intend to swap surge for alacrity at some point just to check it out for myself.

I only use mortar volley on multiple targets, and with the changes to ammo I felt that using plasma grenade would effectively destroy my ammo regen. That is why I threw electro net in there, as a replacement for plasma grenade. It costs less and is an insta cast. I'm sure electro net does less damage, but I chose to do a little less damage and have a little better ammo regen.

To be fair I didn't try to use plasma grenade, so most of the above is speculation.

Thanks for sharing!

You dont believe in Plasma Grenade or Mortar Volley? Thats were the fun begins

 

Why did you take surge over alacrity without using crit? It seems to work as well but thats kinda strange to me. Surge without crit shouldnt make much sense.

 

Did you have augments and datacrons?

with minimal crit rating (98), i have ~22% crit

alacrity gives me about .8% (once you start stacking really high), while surge gives ~4.5%

i figure 4.5*.22 = .99 > .8, so once alacrity is pretty high, even with the minimal crit rating, you're getting better returns from surge. it's sloppy math, i know, but the point is:

it's very easy to have 20% crit with buffs, skill, mainstat, and no crit rating. about 200 crit rating will yield ~3.5%, so even if you forgo crit, surge still offers a decent return (though not as much as on live of course)

i'm still working on a good stat weight, but i'm thinking accuracy is still the most important, and once you get alacrity up to a certain point, even with minimal crit ratings, it's better to drop some into surge

I tried it today with Surge instead of Alacrity and increased my dps as well. I finally got my main unto the pts and did 2.4k dps with full augmented surge/power gear. Theres room for improvement obviously but i dont think we can reach 2.6k.

I'll try full accuracy build tonight or tomorrow. Desperate times...

We are getting a pretty good amount of alacrity naturally from our stance and the talent points, so I could see how spending more in surge returns similar dps. oaceens stats above show that with all his alacrity he still got most of it from his natural talents.

I also think a small investment in crit (2 mods perhaps) and the damage proc relic could make a single point in alacrity proc talent worth it.

There's probably some good milage to be had by not going 100% surge or alacrity in the gear since the first bit of a stat is going to provide the best returns. So a single surge enhancement if you go all alac or vice versa.

In stock arkanian gear I'm still right at 29% crit buffed. Could definitely drop some of that for power I suppose

i'm using 196 or 238 crit and not bothering to go any higher.

the stock arkanian has like 7 or 800 crit on it and only 400 power iirc.

still trying to figure out how much surge/alacrity/accuracy i should have.

i noticed that accuracy is better than alacrity until you get to 432, then they give the exact same return, so i'm thinking it's best to max out accuracy first, go for alacrity until it's better to go into surge.

right now i'm running this for my commando:

432 accuracy, 144 surge, 144 alacrity

196 crit, rest power

i'm considering dropping one enhancement of accuracy and have close to a 1% miss chance. i would get more return from alacrity, but the misses may screw me over with RNG, so i may want to stay with the capped accuracy.

IF i did that swap though, i valued a change to surge to be worth only .88% while a chance to alacrity would be .97%

dropped the accuracy would give me an extra .91% miss chance, so the difference is not all that huge anyway.

i'm using 196 or 238 crit and not bothering to go any higher.

 

the stock arkanian has like 7 or 800 crit on it and only 400 power iirc.

 

 

still trying to figure out how much surge/alacrity/accuracy i should have.

 

 

i noticed that accuracy is better than alacrity until you get to 432, then they give the exact same return, so i'm thinking it's best to max out accuracy first, go for alacrity until it's better to go into surge.

 

right now i'm running this for my commando:

 

432 accuracy, 144 surge, 144 alacrity

196 crit, rest power

 

 

 

i'm considering dropping one enhancement of accuracy and have close to a 1% miss chance. i would get more return from alacrity, but the misses may screw me over with RNG, so i may want to stay with the capped accuracy.

IF i did that swap though, i valued a change to surge to be worth only .88% while a chance to alacrity would be .97%

dropped the accuracy would give me an extra .91% miss chance, so the difference is not all that huge anyway.

What's your tech bonus damage like? I'm wondering if I equipped the wrong thing cause I had more tech bonus damage in arkanian so that power figure seems awfully low to me. I'll check exact stats later. For some reason forgot to SS.

What's your tech bonus damage like? I'm wondering if I equipped the wrong thing cause I had more tech bonus damage in arkanian so that power figure seems awfully low to me. I'll check exact stats later. For some reason forgot to SS.

i have a bunch of relics and power augments too, but with about 250 crit rating, i'm getting under 1300 bonus damage (tech)

I did some tests on the pts and without running my rotations perfectly by any means, I managed to get around 2400.

http://www.torparse.com/a/146706/9/0/Overview

This is with rakata adrenal and dread guard relics. I went with two points in the alacrity talent instead of double dipping as I do on live, mostly due to the lower crit rate. I didn't fiddle with gear much, maxed out accuracy and removed all alacrity pretty much. had some crit still in there, though not that much either.

I felt that heat was manageable, but you had to pay way more attention to it than before.

Yeah, copied the url from the wrong tab in my browser. That one was for showing a guildie the current lethality parses.

My parse from the pts is: http://www.torparse.com/a/146706/9/0/Overview (and I updated my post with the correct one)

Yeah, copied the url from the wrong tab in my browser. That one was for showing a guildie the current lethality parses.

 

My parse from the pts is: http://www.torparse.com/a/146706/9/0/Overview (and I updated my post with the correct one)

That's an interesting rotation. I'm assuming you used TSO on the Death From Above to maximize heat regen? At what heat number (approximately) do you start throwing in Rapid Shots?

No, TSO get used with fusion missile. It's possible that DFA should be left out completely now, on live I always found putting it in there increased dps, but with the new heat issues it may not be worth it, though it still costs less heat than the two tracer missiles it replaces.

I was trying to be fairly aggressive with rapid shots.basically using them if heat was somewhere around 25-30. Basically if my next ability would put me over 40, I delayed it with a rapid shot. So if railshot or electronet was up, a little higher heat was fine, but heatseeker and unload needed extras care.

Of course, not being used to getting that aggressive with it caused me to screw up a little and have periods of having to use rapid shots exclusively for a few GCD.

No, TSO get used with fusion missile. It's possible that DFA should be left out completely now, on live I always found putting it in there increased dps, but with the new heat issues it may not be worth it, though it still costs less heat than the two tracer missiles it replaces.

 

I was trying to be fairly aggressive with rapid shots.basically using them if heat was somewhere around 25-30. Basically if my next ability would put me over 40, I delayed it with a rapid shot. So if railshot or electronet was up, a little higher heat was fine, but heatseeker and unload needed extras care.

 

Of course, not being used to getting that aggressive with it caused me to screw up a little and have periods of having to use rapid shots exclusively for a few GCD.

Y'know, I've seen debates back and forth about using Fusion Missile. I generally don't use it on live unless there's at least 2 targets, I don't see it was worth it otherwise. And the cast of it is much shorter than DFA, so you get less heat regen by using TSO with FM instead. Using it with DFA instead might help you with those heat issues more than FM would.

Just my two cents.

On live I think it is worth it, since it does hit hard, and heat is less of an issue. But on PTS I agree it's better to use TSO with DFA.

Yesterday I tried parsing on my ship (they've upgraded the dummies there) and it got weird. Heat became a bigger issue, and I wa unable to reproduce the same results as on fleet. Best I could do was around 2340. Not sure if someone else was applying some sort of debuff on the fleet dummy when I parsed there. Something was off for sure.

here are two fights i did back-to-back with the same setup exactly except parse one had 144 surge / 144 alacrity and parse two had 288 surge / 0 alacrity

i don't have a knight buff on my legacy, so don't accept this as a legitimate parse for comparing it to other classes, but comparing surge vs alacrity for gunnery commandos.

it might be difficult to say one way or the other after these two though. i crit a lot on demo round and grav round on the second parse and crit less than half as often as i should have on demo round for the first parse.

the percentages of total DPS seem roughly even except for demo round. it was 1.27% more of the total dps (~8.7% more damage) on the second parse than the first.

maybe someone with better stat skills can run some numbers to see if those discrepancies should count for an extra 100 dps or not, or maybe some other people can post some parse numbers to compare.

anyway, so my ideal setup now:

crit to ~200 rest power

accuracy to ~100/110% rest surge

no alacrity from stats

still not sure how i will augment. everyone in my guild seems convinced on power augments with maybe an accuracy augment or two to max it out, so i'll probably go with that though.

maybe if they change the disparity between increased GCD/cast-time and ammo regen with alacrity, it will be a lot more worth it to take alacrity. 5% seems to be way more than enough for me.

for healing though, i seem to be going for a lot more crit (~350-450) and going exactly even on surge/alacrity

i still have an immense amount of power, and crit is useful for healing's reactive playstyle and of course the alacrity boost of first responder.

oaceen, thanks for posting up the stats. I've been trying to get someone to post those for a while now.

I ran a quick spreadsheet just looking at the effect of the various stats on the DPS of Grav Round alone. Not a full rotation, but I figured it would be representative.

I see the same effect, with maximum DPS using a split of Surge and Alacrity. I see a DPS loss on having any crit rating at all, though. Even just 10 Crit rating. That may not be born out once the difference in coefficients for all abilities are taken into consideration, but looking at the coefficients alone I think it will. Grav Round has a coefficient of 1.75, compared to 1.9 for HIB, and 2.77 for DR. Full Auto is lower, at 1.1, but also has modifier for weapon damage range and HS is only 1, of course. I think the 1.75 of GR is likely pretty representative.

I see the peak at 195 Alacrity, 93 Surge, holding your 432 Accuracy as fixed. Pretty sure you can't hit that exact number using the slots available, but thought I'd put it up as a guide and see how that works out for you.

Thanks again for the stats.

did you have the +15% crit rating to grav round set bonus when you did your test?

also Demo Round and Full Auto have the +30% crit multiplier bonus. does that play into increasing crit rating, or does it overall not really matter?

as for the stat budget, it seems we can use 72 (arkanian), 79 (ultimate), and 32 (advanced augment 28s) in our stat budget to reach our desired stats, but i'm not sure if adding any augments for surge/alacrity would be worth more than simply adding power or aim. as i said in my previous post, i was considering maxing out accuracy then going with all overkill/reflex for the remainder.

anyway, per your request, here are the stats on my mainhand: 492.0-913.0

did you have the +15% crit rating to grav round set bonus when you did your test?

 

also Demo Round and Full Auto have the +30% crit multiplier bonus. does that play into increasing crit rating, or does it overall not really matter?

 

as for the stat budget, it seems we can use 72 (arkanian), 79 (ultimate), and 32 (advanced augment 28s) in our stat budget to reach our desired stats, but i'm not sure if adding any augments for surge/alacrity would be worth more than simply adding power or aim. as i said in my previous post, i was considering maxing out accuracy then going with all overkill/reflex for the remainder.

 

 

anyway, per your request, here are the stats on my mainhand: 492.0-913.0

The effect of the ability specific surge bonus will certainly increase the value of crit for that ability. For the overall gearing it will depend on the ratio of ability usage. For Demo Round, the power coefficient is very high, so it's hard to say offhand if surge bonus is enough to make that trade off worthwhile.

To get a better answer requires that I get my new version of my simulator up and running. So far I have the new GUI working, the new 2.0 stat calculations appear to be working properly, and I've added proper save and load character functionality. That's what I wanted your full stats with weapon range for, to save a reasonable starting 55 character for calculations.

I have the Gunnery and Combat Medic priority lists coded, and ability variables are in for both of those specs as well. I still need to get the actual simulation functions working to call each ability in turn as appropriate, apply appropriate temporary buffs, add and remove procs, and track the rolling DPS through a given fight length. Once I have that part working I can manually adjust values for now and locate the DPS peak for a given set of stats, and then add in a function for properly rolling through a given stat budget to find the optimal point.

Not sure if all of that will be done before 2.0 comes out, but I'm making decent progress.