http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=594294

 

there you go

Edited February 5, 2013 by Danapa

My initial impressions is that we're actually going to get worse come RotHC if this is accurate and I'm reading this right...

 

5% nerf to DR hurts our already long-windup burst, so that hurts us for PvP and PvE.

Increase to GR max damage and but reducing the min damage means the damage will be more variable, but depending on how much the min and max change could just end up being a wash.

Reserve round being gone I assume means reserve power cell is gone, which is another nerf that means I know I will be rarely using plasma grenade because the ammo cost will be too prohibitive usually.

The couple defensive CDs and the shrap satchel slow look like they will bring some nice utility and finally give us some increased suvivability in WZs, which is needed.

 

Overall we got increased survivability and WZ utility, but it cost us DPS, and if you look through the JK changes it's just a long list of damage buffs and increased in focus gain for them... So now I'm worried because it's looking like the changes have us starting to lag behind in the damage department and we still aren't fixed for PvP. I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not optimistic.

Commandos - Gunnery

new ability: advance the line (no idea what it does)

- curious to see what this could possibly result in. Most likely the very top of the Gunnery Tree. Could be a support ability like the Sents Inspiration.

 

new ability: charge net - modifies some stat by 2%

-interesting. maybe some form of damage stat increase, but 2% kinda seems low for that.

 

new ability: decoy abosorbs next incoming direct force or tech attack (lasts 6 sec)

-a defensive ability put into decoy...pretty good.

 

5% dmg nerf on demolition round

-thanks BioAustin, because we really needed another damage nerf

 

Damage on grav round - minimum damage reduced, maximum damage increased (more rng)

-so our GR has a high chance to do less damage, but also a high chance to do more damage, I am game.

 

reserve round is gone

-not sure if this was supposed to be reserve power cell, or it is a new ability. Hopefully it isn't reserve powercell.

 

new one: overclock - Reduces casting time (i think) by 7.5/15% depending on rank

-One thing we do not need is increased cast time. I hope this is wrong and instead increases damage output, as since it is called Overclock, it most likely involves using our generator to increase something.

 

another defensive cd - reflexive shield - abosrobs dmg (6secs)

-Hmmm. So we now how 2 shields...

 

that's it for gunnery, some other abilities are tagged as changed but i can't spot the cahnge (could be just animation or something like that)

-If there are more changes, I am both scared and curious as to what BioAustin has for the future of the Commando. Just need to wait and see.

I'm hoping that the change to Reserve Round is they're taking the cooldown reduction away from the tree rather than just removing the ability altogether, because that ability is pretty crucial for proper ammo management (I more or less use it on cooldown with Full Auto)

 

A 5% nerf to Demo Round is absolutely horrible. I hate you so much bioware and hope everyone involved with class balance dies a slow and unnatural death.

 

Reducing of Cast time talent may be the reason for the nerf to DR damage since a 15% reduction in the cast time of Grav Round would be very very significant when it comes to looking at overall DPS, but then I start seriously worrying about ammo issues.

 

Diversion absorbing one Force/Tech attack is kind of crap.

 

Reflexive Shield absorbing all damage (if we're understanding it right) for 6 seconds is pretty nice though. I like that. If it only absorbs a set amount of damage and the effect only lasts 6 seconds though that's kind of meh.

 

Advance the Line could be VERY good depending on what it is. I know what I hope it is. We'll see if its enough to make up for a nerf to Demo Round (seriously BW die in a fire all of you).

 

The trooper unclassified stuff could be potentially interesting but we need more info.

 

I'm shocked there aren't sorc changes.

 

Focus Sents got a huge nerf if zen no longer gives full stacks of singularity, but otherwise the spec seems to have been hugely redesigned and I'm not sure yet if that's good or bad.

 

Nothing exactly blowing up my skirts BW, and any kind of damage nerf to us at this point should be considered a war crime.

this is reserve round so dont worry http://www.torhead.com/ability/aZUes4K/reserve-round

this is reserve round so dont worry http://www.torhead.com/ability/aZUes4K/reserve-round

 

Well I'm not AS worried now, but it's still a nerf. The loss of the CD reduction on the CC is a mild annoyance but easy to work around. Adding 30 sec to the CD on reserve power cell though is an ammo management nerf. A mild one, but still, it's another nerf to a class that was already barely keeping up...

new one: overclock - Reduces casting time (i think) by 7.5/15% depending on rank

-One thing we do not need is increased cast time. I hope this is wrong and instead increases damage output, as since it is called Overclock, it most likely involves using our generator to increase something.

 

Overclocking is increasing the rate something works at.

 

Making casts channel faster would be logical. Increases damage by getting the casts off in less time.

 

There are issues with casting faster on a limited energy regen range but that's a different matter.

Overclocking is increasing the rate something works at.

 

Making casts channel faster would be logical. Increases damage by getting the casts off in less time.

 

There are issues with casting faster on a limited energy regen range but that's a different matter.

 

My gut tells me it's FA. Not sure why but with the change they made to pulse cannon as well something tells me Overclock is going to be a talent to reduce the channel time of FA. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing. It would give us a bit more mobility, but it seems like alot of these changes are going to have a negative effect on our ammo regen/maintenance as well.

I don't think we should make any judgements of the changes based on datamining. Use it to get a general idea of where changes will likely occur but wait until you can actually try it before deciding if it's a nerf or buff. Edited February 5, 2013 by nbayer

Overclocking is increasing the rate something works at.

 

Making casts channel faster would be logical. Increases damage by getting the casts off in less time.

 

There are issues with casting faster on a limited energy regen range but that's a different matter.

 

This is my concern as well. The DR nerf may be because of the increased damage potential from 15% faster firing grav rounds, but you can only cast so much given the ammo and I worry that in practice the net result will be a big old nerf.

This is my concern as well. The DR nerf may be because of the increased damage potential from 15% faster firing grav rounds, but you can only cast so much given the ammo and I worry that in practice the net result will be a big old nerf.

 

OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)

 

Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)

Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...

Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.

 

BW declares us fixed, because we can be uninterruptible gods for 6 seconds every 3 min with our new CDs, so basically long enough to get off 3 GR and a DR, of course that assumes we don't get stunned or KBed or get lept to in that time... I say this jokingly, but I'm secretly concerned this is what they will actually do...

OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)

 

Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)

Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...

Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.

 

BW declares us fixed, because we can be uninterruptible gods for 6 seconds every 3 min with our new CDs, so basically long enough to get off 3 GR and a DR, of course that assumes we don't get stunned or KBed or get lept to in that time... I say this jokingly, but I'm secretly concerned this is what they will actually do...

 

I feel this is ridiculously optimistic.

Advance the line is our top tier ability, and gives us 6 seconds interrupt immunity on a 3 min CD.

 

I have a feeling that Advance the Line is going to be an ability for all Commandos rather than just for Gunnery Commandos, but, rather than being Immunity/KB interrupt (which is essentially what Tech Override is *supposed* to do; it also doesn't make sense that "Advance the Line" would allow you to stand there and just cast; that's *holding* the line), I think it will most likely be an ability to cast on the move for a given duration (since to *advance* the line, you kinda need to move forward). It's been one of the more oft asked for abilities for Commandos, especially since that's kinda of what the Commando does in one of the trailers (using an Assault Cannon, he slowly walks up while hitting Malgus with a continuous stream of fire). It sounds a bit optimistic, but, just based on the name, that's exactly what it sounds like it'll be.

Yep, just need to wait for more info. Who knows, maybe one of the changes is what all of us troopers wanted: an energy system that is equal to that of the bounty hunter.

I am assuming that these changes are for the expansion correct?

 

(Link won't work for me)

My worries (which start with the person who came up with the new skills has no idea how the class works, has never played it and designed everything off a spreadsheet of ultra secret BW metrics).

 

It seems they are trying to address the issues of PVP survivability with new defensive cool downs, and skills that will shorten cast times. Because they think that the shorter cast times will increase the available damage, they are nerfing the only instant attack that could do any damage (and from how it looks, taking away the only chance of that 5k damage medal from you).

 

Without seeing how these will work together and the other changes in the skill tree, it looks like the changes that are made to try to help the PVP aspect of play are going to have very negative reactions on the PVE side of play, by lowering damage, adding in defensive skills that are not needed and then messing with ammo use and regen just to make things worse.

 

I don't like this at all.

 

And as can be seen from the past PTS tests, once they put it up , the chances of getting anything changed for the better from player input is slim to none.

And where are the changes for the Pyro Merc / Assault Commando?????? Edited February 6, 2013 by firestarter

And where are the changes for the Pyro Merc / Assault Commando??????

 

Back to my cunning plan to steal more from the Gunnery tree with our extra 5 points to make Assault more user friendly.

 

As the current tree stands it would be pushback resistance without giving up 3% crit. Plus the last 2 in +30% crit dmg on FA.

 

Or in PVP, steal stockstrike root and bigger knockback because Assault for commandos gives NO talents to mess with other players worth a dam. That snare is pathetic and useless, it's a 30m ranged class, attacking is never an issue. Defensively it's just crap while anything you're trying to escape from (melee) has far more effective means to keep you there or keep up with you.

My worries (which start with the person who came up with the new skills has no idea how the class works, has never played it and designed everything off a spreadsheet of ultra secret BW metrics).

 

It seems they are trying to address the issues of PVP survivability with new defensive cool downs, and skills that will shorten cast times. Because they think that the shorter cast times will increase the available damage, they are nerfing the only instant attack that could do any damage (and from how it looks, taking away the only chance of that 5k damage medal from you).

 

Without seeing how these will work together and the other changes in the skill tree, it looks like the changes that are made to try to help the PVP aspect of play are going to have very negative reactions on the PVE side of play, by lowering damage, adding in defensive skills that are not needed and then messing with ammo use and regen just to make things worse.

 

I don't like this at all.

 

And as can be seen from the past PTS tests, once they put it up , the chances of getting anything changed for the better from player input is slim to none.

 

Assumedly with gear scaling for level 55 the damage on DR will come up enough to get the 5k medal with ease, even with the 5% base damage nerf. Still doesn't make me happy tho because it seems like the nerf will make our demo round damage stay static at the top end, which means it'll be less while leveling and gearing up. Add to that the changed to GR damage range and I'm very worried that our DPS will go down alot at launch and we'll have to level and gear up just to get back to where we are today while everyone else will be blowing past us or significantly widening the already existing gap.

OR, to prove BW has no clue what gunnery is about...(this is tinfoil hat crazy I admit but would be pretty much worst case scenario)

IMO, either they don't have a clue about Gunnery, they're just yanking our chains with these & the previous changes, or they just don't like Gunnery in PvP (ie, incompetance or malice).

 

Overclock decreases the cast time of DR (beacuse they made it a 1.5 sec cast instead of instant as well as nerf the damage)

Alternatively Overclock decreases the cast time of GR, but they removed muzzle fluting and the datamining missed that, so GR with Overclock will now cast at 1.7 seconds...

If we keep Muzzle Fluting, then an additional cast time reduction would put it (even further) below the GCD timer (15% cast time reduction on top of the 4% alacrity from skills, though you probably wouldn't take the usual alacrity skills since we don't really need them anymore with this change) so we'd either be standing their doing nothing or moving, but neither of those really increases your DPS (unless you move into range of a target). So I don't think it's really going to increase our DPS much for GR/CB, though it would with FA/PC/HoB, which would give us more ammo regen issues mitigating some of the DPS increase (either due to not firing waiting for ammo to regen or using our free attack).

so i saw datamining mentioned somewhere in the thread and i see the linked material has been removed, so i'm going to hold off for now on freaking out.

 

for now, at least.

 

 

 

from the conversation i can guess that 'advance the line' sounds like it would be a gap closer to me. assuming it even is, it still leaves open whether or not it will be an effective way to create space for commandos in pvp.

from the conversation i can guess that 'advance the line' sounds like it would be a gap closer to me. assuming it even is, it still leaves open whether or not it will be an effective way to create space for commandos in pvp.

 

I've been pondering Kitru's speculation on it being something we can use to be able to move and cast and that is something I can see BW doing, with a short duration and long CD, like 6 seconds and 2 min CD for example. Of course I can also see them implimenting it with a snare attached as well, so you can only move at 50% speed and cast or something like that, and that in practice the speed reduction would be enough that you can't use it and still get out of the bad fast enough in PvE, making it useless there and of dubious usefullness in PVP, again due to the snare.

I guess the leaked content is gone, but by reading everyone's responses I kinda got the jist. Can someone answer if they really made DR a castable? Edited February 7, 2013 by HybridCode

I guess the leaked content is gone, but by reading everyone's responses I kinda got the jist. Can someone answer if they really made DR a castable?

 

That wasnt in the datamined changes, no. I think at the moment a lot of us are imagining worst case scenarios - somewhat understandably, given past patches.

Link doesn't work for me