I have been playing healing commando on Lvl 50 PVP for some time now and I confess I dont find it fun. I cant speak for damage commando, but I simply fail to see what is there exciting about healing as commando.

Sages seem to have loads of fun. They can slip away from enemies with force speed and they can put bubbles on everyone around them while keeping on the run. That alone seems worth the price of admission.

Scoundrel also seems to be having fun. They can put a heal over time effect on everyone around them, they can stealth to crowd control reinforcements that didnt join the fight yet (with a sedative effect of half damage done for 10 sec after it breaks) and even disappear in mid fight to escape. Wow, not bad at all.

What can I actually do that is cool as commando? Am I missing something here? Because quite frankly, I dont really see any advantage.

Lets see, I can lob a grenade that heals several people at once. That is fun. But Sages can do that too, only they create a circle on the ground and then they can forget about it. Everyone who needs a heal steps into the circle. Those who dont need a heal dont go to the circle. How is my commando healing grenade any better? I have to manually aim and shoot the grenade again each 6 secs. Sages and scoundrels just use their area of effect heal and forget, they can focus on other things, like running away of the enemy and heal themselves when out of range. I cannot do that, I gotta stay close to lob the next healing grenade.

I can place a trauma probe that heals slowly over time. That sounded like cool, but I can only place it in one target, usually me. Scoundrels can place a heal over time on everyone, no limits.

I can I raise a damage barrier that reduces incoming damage by 25% AND makes me immune to interrupts. That is probably the best feature my commando has, very unique. Still, I can get crowd controlled for the duration. And is it really such a great idea to stop moving for several cast heals in a row? Seems like I become an obvious target for everyone nearby. I usually die with a full resolve bar after raising the damage barrier. Casting one heal, run away and casting again from a different position, maybe forcing ranged enemies to lose their line of sight to me, seems like much more intelligent tactic than raising a barrier and heal away several times in a row hoping I wont get killed on the ensuing onslaught of focus fire and stuns that will follow. Couldnt I get a skill that heals me a considerable ammount when I get stunned? That should make them think twice before dumping all their crowd control on me.

Woah, I can shoot people to heal them! That seems cool, but if I am shooting at allies to heal them, I am not shooting at enemies and then my trauma probe isnt triggering as often as it should. How is it I have two mechanics that work against each other? And the healing green beam is kinda obvious, no? Wont take long for the opponent to notice there is a healer nearby. The beam even spares him the bother of looking for the healer, just follow the beam. And by the way, shooting at enemies is key to survive, because I need the trauma probe to trigger extra heals on me, but at the same time, that often breaks crowd control from people trying to help me because I am mashing the shoot button like an idiot. I also have to shoot the beam to "charge up" my healing. Do developers realize how boring that is? Other classes dont have to mash a button before battle start to make sure they will be at their peak of skill. They can do fun stuff like chatting with people or typing emotes while I have to keep an eye on the "charge" and make sure by the time warzone starts it will be ready.

I have a push back that sends enemies flying. But Sages can do that too, nothing special in that. Not that the pushing back really helps that much, because the marauders and juggernauts are instantly jumping back at me. I can toss a cryo grenade to stun them when they return, but forget about running away like scoundrels do. Scoundrels can stun more often, they get a speed buff to get away more easly and they can get into cover before the stunned guy recovers, so they cannot jump back at them. The scoundrel can even toss a slow down effect on the attacker while running away to get into cover, so they earn even more time to do whatever they want. A lot of times, the sith changes target and attacks someone else, because the scoundrel will probably dissapear when they reach him again.

I can insta-cast any ability on a cooldown. I use that to insta-cast my crowd control (mezz) and that is probably the most surprising, effective defense I have. People rarely expects that, probably because it is a long cooldown and they dont see it often. Of course they can break the crowd control and then I have wasted two cooldowns instead of one. Scoundrels can crowd control instantly not one, but 3 enemies at once. And they dont have to bother blowing up a separate cooldown ability first.

So what is there so unique and fun in commando healing that justifies me playing this class in PVP? In all honesty, I think I will take the chance of the next extra 5 levels in the expansion to switch to a new class and gear up again. In my server there are very few commandos in PVP, even less of them doing healing, and the few of us are always below other heal classes in the scoreboards unless we have much better gear or the enemy team forgot to focus fire on us as priority target for an easy, fast kill, like all the veteran players seem to be doing. I am sure a lot of you are having a blast as commando healer and pulling huge numbers but then please explain to me what am I missing here.

I wondering and the same and my hope are towards 1.7.

Of course I can pull screenshot with 1000 hps or with 850k healing but that prooves nothing but easy match.

Currently commando healers are only good when guarded by a good tank. Apparently allmighty heavy frakking tough armor is not working properly.

I've never hit 800k healing on a commando, nor have I seen anyone else do it. :/

A few commando / merc healers have broke 1 million healing on harbinger but obviously its a rare thing. While I do think they need some positive adjustments, they can still make a significant impact on a match.

Good insight into the Rep healers, for which I play all three and having recently taken my Commando out of storage for another run and even with full War Hero kit and a basic understanding of the toons mechanics, I simply find the Commando a really challenging toon to play well at lvl50 compared to my other toons.

Especially if my friends aren't online and I PuG or once the Imp's dps mobs spot me and my team mates are unable to support their support healer. So I find that my current tactic is to allow the attacker/s to get it over quickly (2 good dps toons can do this in approx 3-4 seconds) so that I can get back as quick as I can to support the team as best I can... As there is no advantage to my team having me running around trying to oppose the attack as I am no use to my team as a support role doing that.

So, at best, when I have a good tank on my back and one or two good dps to look after, I seem to be able to function as a reasonable support / heal toon.

However, I must admit that for some reason, I still enjoy holding onto the idea of the Commando as a viable PvP toon, despite all the hastle I seem to go through with the Commando in lvl 50 WZ at the moment. Maybe I just like the punishment some of those Imp toons can dish out whilst I try to figure out better ways to support my team mates.

Lets see, I can lob a grenade that heals several people at once. That is fun. But Sages can do that too, only they create a circle on the ground and then they can forget about it. Everyone who needs a heal steps into the circle. Those who dont need a heal dont go to the circle. How is my commando healing grenade any better?

Because your AoE cannot be interrupted, and doesn't encourage your team to group up for smashes and other AoE damage. The circle of life becomes a circle of death very quickly in PvP. Plus, yours can be done on the move.

Scoundrels do have it better with a targeted AoE HoT however.

I can I raise a damage barrier that reduces incoming damage by 25% AND makes me immune to interrupts. That is probably the best feature my commando has, very unique. Still, I can get crowd controlled for the duration.

Save reactive shield for when you have a full resolve bar, and become an unstoppable healing god for 12s. It doesn't happen often, but when it does, it is quite fun. Something to relish while you wait for the spawn door to tick down.

But yes, commandos need a lot of love in the areas of utility and escape, or MUCH better survivability, to be at all fun to bring into a PvP WZ again. Mine has retired from PvP in favor of my 50 sage and other lowbie toons.

The only thing my commando healer needs is the ability to put Taurma Probe on more than 1 person. I would think up to 4 people would be good. Yourself and 3 others.

A small HoT added to our group heal would also be nice. It could heal 3 ticks the same as AMP.

Change the animation for the Hammer Hot heal. That green beam is ridiculous. It's like saying kill the healer one one side of this and then kill the thing on the other side.

Escaping isn't really a problem for me as a Commando and I can survive a hell of a beating most of the time.

"That green beam is ridiculous. It's like saying kill the healer on one side of this and then kill the thing on the other side."

Lol... yeah, every time I light up the park with that rather spectacular green come to my party laser beam, I can't help but think that I have just sent out a huge invite!

But on the other hand, it is a very effective taunt in PvP if your trying to draw the crowd's attention away from your tank and dps so that you get to spend some up close and personal time with a few of the other team that are sure to bounce your way Also lets you know pretty quick how switched on the other team is as well...

So in reality, I tend not to use the Green Beam a lot if I am a fair distance from my team members that I am healing and prefer to jump onto Hammer Shot to keep stacking my Combat Support Cell to get the 10 seconds of Supercharged Cell fun.

A shame the Green Party Beam is not invisible to the other team... that would work for me.

A shame the Green Party Beam is not invisible to the other team... that would work for me.

it's way too simple of a solution for them to implement though.

The only thing my commando healer needs is the ability to put Taurma Probe on more than 1 person. I would think up to 4 people would be good. Yourself and 3 others.

Really? The benefits of Trauma Probe are negligible, especially when mdps is criting for 5-6K dmg. I'm skeptical that it contributes anything meaningful to survivability in PvP. I've watched my health bar when using the talented Hammer Shot proc to Trauma Probe to self-heal on the move, and it's barely noticeable. Certainly not worth the talent points, and definitely not a substitute for a real mobile self-heal.

I've just finished leveling an Op to 50. Even in recruit gear the utility my Op brings to the table in 50 PvP is miles ahead of my now-shelved fully-geared Commando. There are so many examples where my Op was able to be a game-changer despite having scarcely 14K hp. I can even solo-guard a node, which my geared Commando can't do reliably. PvP'ing as Commando in any spec is just painful. The only time it's remotely enjoyable is when the other team ignores you or when your own teammates constantly peel for you. And open world PvP is punishment every time, but totally fun on my Op. The difference is like night and day.

Until Commando/Merc is fixed players should get an advisory the first time they visit their Advanced Class Trainer that the Commando/Merc option is a PvE-only AC. The difference between Commando/Merc and ever other AC is the only real structural class imbalance in my opinion - everything else is just stat-adjustment by comparison. The only disparity that comes close is Sorc/Sages, but force speed + the bubble + more forgiving resource management still puts Sorc/Sages in any spec miles ahead of Commando/Mercs in PvP.

It is not that I want commandos to be balanced and competitive in healing. That would be far too much to ask. I just wish they had some kind of powerful mechanic like the other classes have. Something that makes them fun, and by fun I mean powerful in the right situation. Being able to put heals over time on everyone, like scoundrels do, is highly powerful if you have a big groups of allies around you. Being able to bubble everyone is also powerful, specially if it can stun people that breaks the bubble on close combat. But what incentive is there to play commando healer? Area heals on the run? That is it? Good luck at people that actually needs the heal staying together. Besides, dont scoundrels do basically the same with their top skill?

As weak as trauma probe is, being able to put it on many people would at least add up to something like the heals over time of the scoudrel.

I just wish they had some kind of powerful mechanic like the other classes have. Something that makes them fun, and by fun I mean powerful in the right situation.

I always think it is fun when their top DPS can't kill you. It is fun to see them try and try and try, then just move on to somebody else cause they cant kill you.

i think one thing commandos do that others don't is the inc healing buff from kolto residue

it's a good way that commandos support other healers

i just wish it were fleshed out a lot more.

like if kolto residue hit all targets (or up to 8) within the AOE instead of just the 4 that are healed.

maybe if armor screen also gave the target a +3 or 5% bonus to inc healing and/or if trauma probe did the same

although i think, as a separate suggestion, to help benefit commando's role of a good single-target healer, i think a +5 or 10% bonus to hammershot healing to the recipient of of trauma probe would be nice as an alternative to the inc healing bonus. it could even be tied to frontline medic and would then provide separate intended benefits for PVP and PVE (and solo play)

Lol... yeah, every time I light up the park with that rather spectacular green come to my party laser beam, I can't help but think that I have just sent out a huge invite!

.

Yeah I asked for this over a year ago lol....

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=66166

Don't think BW cares. It makes me second guess using it in pvp because of it's ability to compeltely give away where you are. Especially if you are using los around a pillar or something. Can cast heals to keep people up than you are desperate to put out some heals without using ammo and suddenly you got a hoard of dps coming around the corner at you after you turn your green spot light on. Hate it.

Not sure why they can't just tone it down. Like the med scan the scoundrels have... it has an effect you can see but it is not so freakin pronounced lol.

Anyway, to the OP. I have played all three now as healers and you are right. There is just something missing from the Commando. It feels like it is very close. The uninteruptable aspect is nice but gimmicky and need full resolve to have it be truly awesome. The instant heal is sweet but on a huge CD. Kolto bomb I actually love as it's a nice way to top off a group and the snare is pretty effective also. Personally if they killed the green beam of death and reduced bacta infusion to 15 seconds.... maybe make it cost 1 ammo and have it on a 10-12 sec CD would be ok with me. And yes, have the trauma probe be applicable to 4 people and get rid of the self heal aspect with hammer shot would be good with me.

Overall, I like Commando healing but it does seem to just slightly lack oompf compared to sage and scoundrel.

You make some good points and Commandos in PVP are EXTREMELY frustrating to play and they need some love. However there are some things that we CAN do well: Diversions, delays, and bait.

I can't tell you how many times I have run into or near a pack of imps..start throwing around GBD (green beam of death) and then poping shield and stims.. Then running away while using kolto bombs and bacta infusion. Almost every time 3-4 imps will drop what they are doing and chase you. Even with that many you can survive for a little bit (if you know what you are doing) giving your team some much needed time to cap a node or finish off their healers. Imps can't resist and often you can bait them away.

Using shield, stims, adrenalin rush, kolto bombs, and self heal... We have the potential to survive longer than any other healer under duress. However if we are healing ourselves, we are not healing the team... But it also means that the imps are not attacking our team mates when they are swarming us. If you are helping to guard a node you can delay quite well with the skills we have untill help arrives. I don't put up a lot of big numbers on the board but I have learned to become better at surviving attacks and delaying death so as to draw off, delay, and bait imps. Along with healig my goal is always to tie up as many imps as I can as long as I can. While it isn't always fun, and certainly not glamorous... It can still help your team win.

Hutt ball- follow the ball carrier with GBD... Either you will help keep them alive or imps will attack you instead.

Voidstar- lure imps near pits away from the bombs and sometimes you can freeze them and then knock them off

Alderman & Danova- play off nodes just a bit if attacking and lure imps out away. When defending stay moble with KB and BI heals. Use shield, stims, addenalin rush, CCs, knockback, and KB slow effect to delay untill help arrives.

Hyper gate- more of the same.

Bottom line it YES it is a very difficult class and procs nerd rages frequently, but it is not useless and we just need to be creative with the skills that we do have, which are more useful than you might initially think.

You make some good points and Commandos in PVP are EXTREMELY frustrating to play and they need some love. However there are some things that we CAN do well: Diversions, delays, and bait.

 

I can't tell you how many times I have run into or near a pack of imps..start throwing around GBD (green beam of death) and then poping shield and stims.. Then running away while using kolto bombs and bacta infusion. Almost every time 3-4 imps will drop what they are doing and chase you. Even with that many you can survive for a little bit (if you know what you are doing) giving your team some much needed time to cap a node or finish off their healers. Imps can't resist and often you can bait them away.

 

Using shield, stims, adrenalin rush, kolto bombs, and self heal... We have the potential to survive longer than any other healer under duress. However if we are healing ourselves, we are not healing the team... But it also means that the imps are not attacking our team mates when they are swarming us. If you are helping to guard a node you can delay quite well with the skills we have untill help arrives. I don't put up a lot of big numbers on the board but I have learned to become better at surviving attacks and delaying death so as to draw off, delay, and bait imps. Along with healig my goal is always to tie up as many imps as I can as long as I can. While it isn't always fun, and certainly not glamorous... It can still help your team win.

 

Hutt ball- follow the ball carrier with GBD... Either you will help keep them alive or imps will attack you instead.

Voidstar- lure imps near pits away from the bombs and sometimes you can freeze them and then knock them off

Alderman & Danova- play off nodes just a bit if attacking and lure imps out away. When defending stay moble with KB and BI heals. Use shield, stims, addenalin rush, CCs, knockback, and KB slow effect to delay untill help arrives.

Hyper gate- more of the same.

 

Bottom line it YES it is a very difficult class and procs nerd rages frequently, but it is not useless and we just need to be creative with the skills that we do have, which are more useful than you might initially think.

Quite true, and this is pretty much how I feel now that I've played the class for a year. You will never do the numbers of the others because all your healing is raw; that is, you have almost no inflation on your numbers. The Sage's bubbles and the Smuggler's rolling HoTs all help them generate big numbers. The number you see at the end of a match for Commando is pretty much point-for-point how much they did individually. And I've seen Commandos do millions. I've done mil-matches. The HPS is usually low because we don't have that inflation. But it's not as though the class is obsolete.

It could use some help, though. I am admittedly growing tired of waiting to see if Bioware has actually taken it to heart or has simply been shrugging these conversations off. My subscription says I believe the first, but as we close on a year without any meaningful changes to the class on the live servers, the cynical part of me is getting pretty hard to ignore.

Obviously commando have lack of love from BW, because it made it as a PVE class.

When we talk about PVP, there are 2 kinds of PVP - normal wz and ranked wz.

On normal ones its possible to make a good healing. Of course u are often a desired target, u may be interrupted, being focused, but u can do good heal. Before 1.2 I heard that some commandos did 1 mil healing, since then - not.

For example, this is my peronal record http://i.imgur.com/fvuy4.jpg

But it was incredibly hard to achieve. If I were scound or sage, this number would be higher.

If we talk about ranked wz, commando has nothing to do there. At all. U get focused at once, all ur casts are unterrupted, commando cant escape from combat. In other words, u feel all the shortcomings of this class.

Top pvp guilds will never take commando healer to rwz, because it cant compete with scoundrel and sage.

Revitalizing commando healing will require significant changes in the whole mechanics. Putting trauma probe on several people is not enough, commando need more survivability, possibility to escape combat, need features taken since 1.2 etc.

I really hope that one day this class will be revitalized and will be adopted to pvp, and I hope that this day will come soon.

If we talk about ranked wz, commando has nothing to do there. At all. U get focused at once, all ur casts are unterrupted, commando cant escape from combat. In other words, u feel all the shortcomings of this class.

Top pvp guilds will never take commando healer to rwz, because it cant compete with scoundrel and sage.

 

Revitalizing commando healing will require significant changes in the whole mechanics. Putting trauma probe on several people is not enough, commando need more survivability, possibility to escape combat, need features taken since 1.2 etc.

Well I agree CM need some love (not a whole new re-working but a couple minor changes.) CM's can do RWZ, It requires more skill than the other classes to do so, but CM can do well in RWZ.

Obviously commando have lack of love from BW, because it made it as a PVE class.

When we talk about PVP, there are 2 kinds of PVP - normal wz and ranked wz.

On normal ones its possible to make a good healing. Of course u are often a desired target, u may be interrupted, being focused, but u can do good heal. Before 1.2 I heard that some commandos did 1 mil healing, since then - not.

For example, this is my peronal record http://i.imgur.com/fvuy4.jpg

But it was incredibly hard to achieve. If I were scound or sage, this number would be higher.

While I agree its easier to reach big numbers on Sage and Scoundrel (because of inflation), it's not impossible. Like this 1.1mil match I got in ranked a month ago which is my personal best. I've had a few others right around the one-mil mark, but there is also probably truth in arguing that million+ matches occur more frequently on Sage/Scoundrel than Commando.

If we talk about ranked wz, commando has nothing to do there. At all. U get focused at once, all ur casts are unterrupted, commando cant escape from combat. In other words, u feel all the shortcomings of this class.

Top pvp guilds will never take commando healer to rwz, because it cant compete with scoundrel and sage.

 

Revitalizing commando healing will require significant changes in the whole mechanics. Putting trauma probe on several people is not enough, commando need more survivability, possibility to escape combat, need features taken since 1.2 etc.

I really hope that one day this class will be revitalized and will be adopted to pvp, and I hope that this day will come soon.

DPS Commandos 100% suffer from everything you've explained. Healers are also vulnerable to much the same things, but in ranked I'd sure hope that your team makes and effort to help you. And if your guild or friends won't take a Combat Medic into ranked, then maybe your circle of friends aren't all that like-minded after all.

For 1.7 and beyond, this is what I hope for Commando (and I don't see it as an overhaul):

- Cut the cooldown on Tech Override by at least a minute, possibly down to only 20 or 30 seconds.

- Do something with Adrenaline Rush. Give it a speed buff or something which justifies its three minute cooldown.

- Full Auto should either be immune to interrupts like Master Strike or it should be made immune through specialization (Curtain of Fire is a very good candidate).

- Make it so the house of cards that is a Gunnery Commando doesn't fall down every time Grav Round gets interrupted. Give them alternative (but slower) means of building their procs so they can take interruptions in stride without having their entire tree cave in on them.

- Review the AC's control, especially when keeping melees at range (roots, leap immunity). Failing at this, give the class an escape mechanic.

- Give the class something that makes them an asset to the team. A team-wide buff would be great (ie. immunity to leaps for teammates in a moderate radius for 10 seconds).

- For Combat Medic relax some of the ammo nerfs in 1.2. Some, not all. Trauma Probe could use some value too, right now it is too expensive for its worth. And if the class is intended to be the single-target specialist, make sure it does it better than anyone else or has some interesting benefits. Failing that, make group healing easier.

Well I agree CM need some love (not a whole new re-working but a couple minor changes.) CM's can do RWZ, It requires more skill than the other classes to do so, but CM can do well in RWZ.

I'm playing on pvp server Tomb of freedom nadd. There are most skilled pvp guilds that are among the best in the game.

Yes, commando can do well, when he is not bothered. But on TOFN, on RWZ noone will let commando do anything.

I'm playing on pvp server Tomb of freedom nadd. There are most skilled pvp guilds that are among the best in the game.

Yes, commando can do well, when he is not bothered. But on TOFN, on RWZ noone will let commando do anything.

I am not trying to sound like a jerk, but maybe those guilds need a better tank....

CM's bring to the table what no other healing class can, survivability. All the top (and I mean top) tear guilds on my server have amazing CM's that run ranked, and do very well at it. Like I said earlier though, the lvl of skill demanded of those CM is way above what a sage/scoundrel would need.

I am not trying to sound like a jerk, but maybe those guilds need a better tank....

 

 

CM's bring to the table what no other healing class can, survivability. All the top (and I mean top) tear guilds on my server have amazing CM's that run ranked, and do very well at it. Like I said earlier though, the lvl of skill demanded of those CM is way above what a sage/scoundrel would need.

How's ur server called?

What's ur server called?

Jedi Covenant which is a PVE server, but the top end guilds are on par with PVP servers.