Jump to content

Dreadtooth - Why should we Bioware?


Recommended Posts

We are a hardcore raiding guild ( X-Raided ) who have downed Dreadtooth on 4 stacks, but not easily and nor is "farm" status anywhere near BUT not do to our incompetence, let me list the reasons why.....

1. Sector X population - with such a high number of people in an instance we have 2 maybe out of 16 who don't have lag

2. Griefing - constant constant constant random flow of people who grief our group with a pull that gives us the debuff causing us to wait yet again for the debuffs to drop for a pull

3. P.A.T. - Do to the positioning it is ideal to have Dreadtooth in we find it necessary to allow Dreadtooth to pat to few key locations before a pull

4. Aggro - The aggro table on dreadtooth gets lost tons, not talking about during "Sonic" either where he is supposed to drop aggro, talking about on pull....we wait for 10-15 secs even to let tank build aggro and pffft, somehow pull aggro off tank and wipe raid. This also happens alot during fight outside of "sonic" ability, even though we have multiple tanks ready to taunt back it does not work because he takes 3-5 secs to respond to taunt (long enough to wipe the raid)

OK Bioware if you would like to come with me on our raid night dedicated to this horrible WB you would see that dealing with these listed problems means we get 1-2 pulls in a hour.....is that what you intended? We started having fun at first simply because it was new, but now the fun is gone. At the end of our raid night for Dreadtooth everyone pretty much is in a bad mood from dealing with all the problems around this fight, the sense of accomplishment is diminished by the state of your area therefore lowering our need to accomplish it......

So BioWare I ask you.....Dreadtooth - Why should we even try?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Heaven forbid they make a HARD boss for people.

"The ability to use the forums doesn't make you intelligent"

 

I (and most other gamers) LOVE a "hard" boss encounter. No where in Fish's post does he once complain about the encounter being too "hard." Does he? The issues he does bring up are all relevant and to people who have actually attempted this boss on a regular basis would probably agree with. I think it is especially humorous to read your comment... then read your stupid little quote in your sig. I guess attempting to belittle someone's LEGITIMATE issue with a game mechanic without even reading the post is what you would pass as "intelligence"?

 

Now that that is out of the way, I would like to add this: another blatantly obvious issue with this world boss lies in the fact that there is only once instance of Section X at most (even at peak) times. Yeah, when 1.5 dropped there was 7 maybe 8, and that's probably how many instances there should be. With one instance lets say a progressive-oriented guild, like X-Raided, wants to attempt a 5-stack pull. We apply the essences to him and put him at 5 stacks. Now, other guilds/groups i'm sure want to do the encounter on less stacks. Guess what? They can't because with one instance he's stuck at 5 stacks until I assume after the weekly reset or he gets downed at 5 stacks. So the entire server has to sit around with thumbs up their asses and wait for the reset to even try it on less stacks. Lower the population cap for each instance so more groups can get some pulls in.

 

We've had groups together to do 3-stack pulls on more than one occasion who repeatedly wipe due to worthless aggro tables and griefing by other players. Not to mention you have the 5-10 minute wait in between pulls for the pat this fool walks on and getting hit with a 5-minute debuff because some random player pulls him next to your raid group. So, you get a group of 16+ people together to sit around and get one worthless pull in and then wait around and do nothing until he pats back or your debuff drops off.

 

This world boss has been nothing but a source of wasted time and frustration. A few minor changes could turn it back into an enjoyable encounter, and I hope something is done. The concept is good, the execution is terrible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The problem for me is that i see the boss as a small step up from Nightmare Pilgrim, but still easier then TFB HM or NIM EC. The loot table as well is nothing but black hole (at least what has been reported), and a possible mask for the 1st 4 stacks that is needed to kill the boss with 5+ stacks. At 5+ stacks it does drop a crystal but who knows what it is for...

 

I feel that they took a step backwards with world bosses, and made it to be more like primal destroyer allowing anyone and everyone that wants to do it to get the chance to.

 

On a side note maybe the crystal that drops at 5+ stacks will be used against a future operation boss to counter some mechanic... if that is the case then there is actually some reason to waste time on this boss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

He should be in an instance, 100% no question about that. Having random people around section X pull him on your group and screwing around with you while you fight him is complete crap. I'm all down for bosses being hard but they should be hard because you have to consider in factors like Gank Squads coming out to play.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I actually prefer this as I like Bosses being unpredictable and require some level of adaptation in the middle of the fight beyond practiced and well-known mechanics, then again I love pvp too. Maybe try the pull asap instead of waiting for the best location and have the tank run the boss to a wall while the dps deals with mobs?

 

I've only tanked him at 3 stacks, but the only time I saw an aggro loss was at the beginning and maybe we were lucky it didnt wipe anyone. I am sorry if I am incorrect and the aggro drop at 4 stacks and higher is way too much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The only reasons to do Dreadtooth (DT) are: the title ("Drouk Hunter"), the mask and possibly the amulet if that is ever confirmed to drop off him.*

 

*Seriously, does 5+ stack DT drop the amulet or not???

 

P.S: This is one of those threads that makes me happy to be on Jung Ma. Section X peak pop hasn't broken 60 since the first 48 hours of 1.5: makes doing DT seamless.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just tanked him @ 2 stacks today and it was my first time tanking him. We never lost aggro once. I can't say what you are doing wrong, but when he channels the scream the other tank just spams the taunt so as soon as the channel is over the other tank has aggro. Just keep doing that until he is dead. Of course this was on 2 stacks so more stacks may make it easier for aggro loss.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

make it a instance with a level of difficulty feature you can manually set before entering. we had a end boss like this years ago in eq2. ( btw there was no story mode it was hard, harder. near impossible and ***)

 

any type of non instance world boss with today's player base is nothing more than a train wreak waiting to happen. several threads on these forums have already proven this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think my point has been lost. We have downed him on 4 stacks. You cannot be random on pulls with high stacks, some finesse is important so "pull quicker" or "pull in whatever spot" does not work. I am trying to point out the poor design to this fight and the griefing in which steals the fun. Some simple fixes as in (for instance) lower population cap per instance in Sector X, remove his pat behind wall and make pat only in arena worth fighting him in, possible rework of debuff that allows people to grief you so much, just to name a few. The point is to make this fun and worth while (to every server, not just low population ones) there needs to be some changes...in terms of progressive pulls (1-2 stack pull is easy/fine and presents no problems). To be able to "farm" a progress with this boss in current conditions is nearly impossible and lack luster in fun department. I guess I am looking for constructive responses from people attempting these progressions and having same issues as a guild. I would politely ask that insults/trolls be kept at minimum as it will only taint the post geared towards positive response/outcome. As far as the aggro issue I can agree with some of the previous post, it is probably a group issue over BW issue, except in terms of the lag meaning lag can make it hard for correct abilities to be going off at correct times hence screwing with aggro table...i.e. aggro dump does not go off do to lag so double clicked or taunt does not go off etc. etc.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

We are a hardcore raiding guild ( X-Raided ) who have downed Dreadtooth on 4 stacks, but not easily and nor is "farm" status anywhere near BUT not do to our incompetence, let me list the reasons why.....

1. Sector X population - with such a high number of people in an instance we have 2 maybe out of 16 who don't have lag

2. Griefing - constant constant constant random flow of people who grief our group with a pull that gives us the debuff causing us to wait yet again for the debuffs to drop for a pull

3. P.A.T. - Do to the positioning it is ideal to have Dreadtooth in we find it necessary to allow Dreadtooth to pat to few key locations before a pull

4. Aggro - The aggro table on dreadtooth gets lost tons, not talking about during "Sonic" either where he is supposed to drop aggro, talking about on pull....we wait for 10-15 secs even to let tank build aggro and pffft, somehow pull aggro off tank and wipe raid. This also happens alot during fight outside of "sonic" ability, even though we have multiple tanks ready to taunt back it does not work because he takes 3-5 secs to respond to taunt (long enough to wipe the raid)

OK Bioware if you would like to come with me on our raid night dedicated to this horrible WB you would see that dealing with these listed problems means we get 1-2 pulls in a hour.....is that what you intended? We started having fun at first simply because it was new, but now the fun is gone. At the end of our raid night for Dreadtooth everyone pretty much is in a bad mood from dealing with all the problems around this fight, the sense of accomplishment is diminished by the state of your area therefore lowering our need to accomplish it......

So BioWare I ask you.....Dreadtooth - Why should we even try?

 

Well, #4 sounds like you just have jugg tanks or something. The other two types won't lose aggro very frequently. Jugg tanks probably need another threat buff. One thing they can do, though is get an on-use power relic and pop it at the beginning of the fight, then on cooldown anytime they're main-tanking (and yes, I know that's not ideal).

 

Edit: what I'm saying is threat loss isn't really a problematic boss mechanic. It's a problematic class mechanic.

Edited by Larry_Dallas
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have no problem farming mechanics to learn "HARD" fight, its the conditions in which to farm in that are unacceptable, please read post before responding with pointless comments.....

 

Those conditions are intended and that's additional mechanics if you think about it. It's a World Boss for a reason, you are MEANT to be griefed, and yes you are MEANT to have some environmental lag. Also Your #4 reason is completely up to your group, if you don't want boss to go here and thee give tank some time to generate threat.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In reference to aggro, like I have said, it could be other issues in group, but lag does factor in a major role. And the "meant" to be lag is just a crazy statement.

In reference to Jugg Aggro tables....well thats a just whole other thread I think, poor Jugg Tanks could def use some love from the devs with their tables.

As far as griefing....sure some comp with another group is good, but ONE person hanging out to pull boss and grief with debuff is not acceptable WB mechanic, its not even PVP related.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's an aggro drop if Sonic Paralysis finishes its cast with the tank stunned. If you don't resist Sonic Paralysis and don't have your CC break up, a second tank spams his taunt button to pick up the boss as soon as Sonic Paralysis is over.

 

This works. All other threat issues can be attributed to DPS not holding back and controlling themselves. I've tanked Dreadtooth at multiple stack levels many times, and threat is completely controllable.

Edited by DarthBuckets
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, #4 sounds like you just have jugg tanks or something. The other two types won't lose aggro very frequently. Jugg tanks probably need another threat buff. One thing they can do, though is get an on-use power relic and pop it at the beginning of the fight, then on cooldown anytime they're main-tanking (and yes, I know that's not ideal).

 

Edit: what I'm saying is threat loss isn't really a problematic boss mechanic. It's a problematic class mechanic.

 

the fact that a year after launch Jugg and guard tanks STILL don't produce eneugh damage to keep threat is dischourageing to say the least

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just got done watching MOX on our server wipe to DT for hours on 5 stack. They had a 24 man raid w/ some outside healers assisting and still wiped to the insane dmg. Seems like bioware might have overtuned this encounter a bit. Really not worth all the wiping for old tier of gear.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just got done watching MOX on our server wipe to DT for hours on 5 stack. They had a 24 man raid w/ some outside healers assisting and still wiped to the insane dmg. Seems like bioware might have overtuned this encounter a bit. Really not worth all the wiping for old tier of gear.

 

5 Stack isn't designed for 24 People in Augmented Dread Guard, let alone Campaign. That's why so many people hoped the Mask had some sort of shield effect, but it's not been shown to reduce damage at all. It looks like there's a hidden mechanic for 5+ stacks. I've heard it's been done by having 48 people tackle it, but that means only 1 group gets credit for the kill, how can that be working as intended:confused::confused::confused::confused:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just got done watching MOX on our server wipe to DT for hours on 5 stack. They had a 24 man raid w/ some outside healers assisting and still wiped to the insane dmg. Seems like bioware might have overtuned this encounter a bit. Really not worth all the wiping for old tier of gear.

 

Damage is indeed OD, still doable, mistakes can't happen or you fall behind and healers can't heal after 50%. Majority of the time you have to have a perfect pre 50% phase or you die shortly after to screech.

 

The combined factors of move out of the spikes, screech, and lag makes the after 50% phase terrible.

 

Fight is very doable, we got to 22% of three different occasions. Trick is staying alive after 50% and healing through screech/ not dying during dps down phase due to lag. I at times on a gaming computer would drop to 10 FPS and would cringe when I saw screech.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

the fact that a year after launch Jugg and guard tanks STILL don't produce eneugh damage to keep threat is dischourageing to say the least

 

Mine and other Jugg tanks have zero threat issues in EC HM, TFB HM and NiM EC, I have only done 3 stack of Dreadtooth and no problems there either. I will say Jugg Tanking is not the easy mode the other 2 provides, you have to work at it and be competent to perform vs the other two leave some room for marginal error/lessor skill (I have 50s in all 3 and do all raiding with them all so I think I have a good grip on their strengths/weaknesses). And IMO Hybrid Spec is the better route to take for Jugg tanking (overall better mitigation and agro holding). But this isn't the topic to debate this in.

 

Sorry OP to interrupt original topic. I do agree some changes should be considered to this Worldboss. My vote is for instanced area for boss but thats not going to happen, I think its ridiculous to have a PVP scenario infesting a PVE one (this coming from a PVE server I choose because I am not a PVP fan/person) If I wanted to deal with the pitfalls of World PVP I would have joined a PVP server and expect that but it should not be a forced matter for those that choose not to.

 

That and the debuff mechanic is buggy as balls without the intervention of griefers!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...