Time to merge the US servers... again. Primetime window getting smaller and smaller.

As always... with WoW.. the question is.. how long will the "shiny" last? If it follows pattern over the last 15 years..... they will be back to pre-expac numbers within 6 months, and then continue to decline from there... until the next expac.

Personally, I think WoW has the best expacs in the industry, and has for years ... and in the old days of more persistent and committed players... that would build upon itself with each expac (like it did with their first few expacs). But those days are gone and even WoW suffers very large attrition after players have played through an expac... which even for WoW takes around 3-6 months.

Which indicates that they have a solid core of about 3.5-4M entrenched and loyal players (because these are typically the day 1 buyers of an expac in an MMO). Based on older sub numbers (back when sub numbers were actually regularly published) they had a recurring player base of about 6 million .. and that is a world wide number... not just North America, and would see peaks of about 10M for a few months after an expac released. The last objective data on WoW indicated that about 40% of their sub base is North America based. They have always has a large following in Asia, and a strong core in EU.

They are doing well over there... in spite of the age of the game... but it's nothing to hero-worship or compare with other MMOs... simply because WoW is unique in that regard in the field of MMOs. They are essentially their own market.

Like some other players in the MMO genre.. I am sick of orcs, elfves, smurfs, and humans that run like they have a stick up their backside.... so I'm not going back to WoW... even though I have a wealth of accumulated resources I left behind.

For me, I spent so much time playing SWTOR that I have lots of old expansions to catch up on and play through. The same could have been said if I had done this in reverse - if I had been playing WoW all this time and come to play SWTOR, I would have a bunch of content to play through that was new to me. However, by comparison, it's a whole lot less content per expansion and wouldn't even take me half the time to play through and find myself with nothing left to do in SWTOR.

I'm nowhere near that feeling in WoW. I played WoW from Burning Crusade to Cataclysm and then left to come to play SWTOR. The amount of improvement in WoW in that time is really amazing, and additions like the transmog system (that includes weapons!) and their sharper focus on story and lore in the last couple of expansions, coupled with beautiful in-game cutscenes and supporting videos along side upgrades to the graphics have got me enjoying WoW so much more than I ever did when I played it before.

As a side note, any of you who are Saurfang fans should watch this cinematic for a taste of the story quality we're enjoying currently:
Cinematic: Old Soldier

Again, all of this is just my personal preference. There are plenty of people who dislike WoW for one reason or another, and I was among those people until I went back this year. But as someone who has spent tens of thousands of dollars on SWTOR because that was my complete personal preference for the last 6 1/2 years, I've been really loving WoW in ways I never have before... and haven't looked back.

Will that wear off? Maybe... but there was another Developer Q&A on Twitch today talking about more upcoming content, more new races in the next few months, and more content than I've seen in SWTOR in years. I'm not even remotely concerned about becoming bored of WoW because I've had years of training here and the pace is wildly better over there. Yeah, not concerned at all.

EDITED TO ADD:
But... upright orcs! If you have enough accumulated resources, you could purchase the mount with the Auction House on it. It's only 5 million gold!

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can you please stop with these posts

Server population has dropped, its not just about pugs, lost a lot of players because there wasn't any new content in ages. There should have never been 2 US servers from the start it was a stupid idea, why make 2 us east coast servers?

Make one gosh darn server or as it is now merge again or release new content to bring people back, either way with this level of population and said population going down more and more its not looking good. Do something to bring people back or merge simple as that.

I couldn't get into WoW and my wife doesn't like the "flow" of abilities. We tried FFXIV, but it's too anime even though it plays pretty well. So, now we play ESO 6 or 7 nights a week and raid here 1 night a week until our raid team dies out.

Merging the remaining NA servers should probably happen. Never should have been 2 to begin with. That decision was just another in a long line of bad choices. HOwever, it does say they had no plans to do anything to try to grow the game. It will last as long as they want a SW MMO. When EA no longer wants to say they have a SW MMO< it will go away. If BF hadn't fallen flat, SWTOR might be gone by now, but SWTOR is all EA has for a SW game that is "successful" in the PC game market.

One of those will work. The other was tried and failed.

People wanted merges.
They got them. 17 servers down to 5.
That fix was very short-lived.

So now people are asking for merges again. Even 5 down to 1 won't change anything.
This game won't be saved with any more merges.

Only a steady stream of content will help, and that won't happen now that the dev team got gutted to build Anthem.
We will get content when we get content, and in no particular time frame, and those who can't wait will continue to leave, and those who see that a lot of people left will follow them out the door, leaving behind the die-hards.

Maybe enough die-hards will be left to keep the game running. Maybe not.

Heh... yeah... I still browse their forum from time to time to see what is the current drama. But I'm not drawn to go back... even though I know there is a truck ton of content I have never seen that would keep me busy for quite a while. We do have a guild presence in WoW.. but it's pretty tepid.. and there was no great wow factor coming back from those that do play there (fun for sure was the common response, but not dazzling in any way... which is probably rooted in these players being real die-hard WoW players.

Now.. hilarious beyond belief...... you know all those SWTOR is Dying, must merge servers, etc etc. we see around here...... well...... it's really no different over there either https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/...7668518?page=1 I guess that is what we get from years of players becoming more nomadic and moving around from one MMO to another......... they homogenize the forum memes and cultural artifacts over time such that "if you've read one, you've read them all" triggers.

(Wall of txt, sorry)

I agree with a lot of what you said, I’m just trying to explain their point of view as well and trying to balance the discussion a bit more before it becomes too militant and out of control.

Sometimes, people’s wants or needs can come across as not caring about other people or being selfish, it’s human nature to usually put your own needs before others. I get that and as I’ve gotten older I always try and put myself in the other person’s position.

This situation about pvp pops and some people wanting mergers to fix it can look selfish. But it works both ways. Opposition to the idea of merger for your own wants or needs at the expense of those people who need mergers can also be seen as not caring. (I’m not saying that’s what’s happening here, just trying to put some context)

This is why mergers are always contentious and dividing. It’s why things get heated and passions overflow and often become one sided vs the other and become militant and extreme. At that point, people stop listening to the other side or compromise ideas or other ways to address the situation, I think we can all agree on that point.

I’m actually glad you brought up other options or ways to try and tackle the pvp pop sistuation. I actually tried to bring up low cost server transfers a few months ago and got shouted down and told we didn’t need them because the game was healthy and there was no problems “for those people”, I was even told to quit the game because “obviously” Bioware doesn’t care about me or the minority.

I actually think low cost server transfers would help some of this situation, at least in the short-mid term. It’s not a golden bullet to the problem. Pvp pops are just a symptom of the problem, which is the declining population. Only Bioware can fix that and we should all be trying to get them too instead of everyone always personally attacking people’s ideas or needs or wants. Certain people in this community spend too much time trolling or bullying other people. Then good ideas or threads get drowned out or highjacked. (I think we all know who they are). But we are all partly to blame because we accept this bullying and don’t step in or just mass ignore the bullies.

I’m not actually advocating for server mergers at this point in time. But I do think they will happen in the future when population decline starts to affect other parts of the game more. Pvpers are usually the canaries in the mine before that happens and it always worries me when they start asking for mergers because it usually means things can quickly deteriorate. That was the point I was trying to make.

Mergers are traumatic for everyone, even pvpers because most of them also play other parts of the game. ie, have spent money on Stong Holds or RP too. I would say most pvpers play more than just pvp, I’m probably a rare exception. Any merge will affect them the same way as it affects those who don’t Pvp.

The game is declining, it’s not dead, it’s not terminal, but it is old and those remaining need to look after it in its twighlight years. We should try coming together as a community and support everyone (which is hard when it’s not your part of the game). Only when we stand as one and really voice our displeasure or rally behind an issue, do Bioware sit up and listen. If we don’t and let important things get side tracked or forget about them, Bioware ignore it and the issue festers till it’s too late, people leave or we all fight each other instead of Bioware, who are to blame to start with,

I would like to see people put themselves in other players positions and come up with constructive ideas on how to fix issues in this game and if compromises are needed, then recognise that and find ways to have the lowest amount of negative impact. Life is about compromise. It’s how we come together and make those compromises work that can benefit everyone, that define us.

I believe we should be discussing and ultimately getting behind these ideas to help improve the situation for some of our players. But to also improve the game as a whole, which helps everyone in the long run.

Currently there are two things in this game that are affecting its quality and enjoyment. They affect everyone, not just one type of player. We should all be advocating Bioware fix them before they do anything else.
1. Bugs permeate ever part of the game. Some more than others.
2. Dysnc is not only isolated to pvp, it has made it way into all parts of the game and “is” getting worse in pvp, which means it will probably get worse in the whole game.

Last thing, if / when mergers are getting close to being needed for the games continuation as we know it (not some solo only game), we should start thinking of ways to reduce the traumatism of them. There are lots of things Bioware can do or change to ease that pain. All of the things that were suggested before were mostly ignored by Bioware because we drowned out those good suggestions with bickering. Which meant the last merge was more traumatic than it needed to be.
I would suggest we have those ideas and any new ones ready for the future. Mergers will happen eventually. If we are prepared for that and have an Arsenal of ideas to put to Bioware, maybe we can make it the less painful for everyone.

And to everyone please remember, every player counts. No part of the game is more important than another and we should respect that

It’s an old argument that’s been proven false so many times because if it was true, why have we ended up with the amount of servers we have with less people than we had this time last year.

I just ignore people who use it as an excuse. It shows little understanding of the game ps decline or they just haven’t played swtor long enough.