Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

The Wall Decorations: Don't Limit The Hook Type

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Public Test Server
The Wall Decorations: Don't Limit The Hook Type

DuchessKristania's Avatar


DuchessKristania
07.09.2018 , 10:22 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by JediBoadicea View Post
But even having not actually been able to test them, I can speak from experience that there are already far too many decos that are walls (or just long and rectangular) that fit only on Larges or Mediums when they could very easily fit on Mediums or Narrows without fully covering the hook... so please don't limit the new ones in this fashion! The Zakuulan Wall Tech Panel and countless Large-hook-only decos (that can never be placed against anything else because they're stuck in the middle of the dumb hook) attest to how frustrating and limiting this is.

.[/I][/B]
Actually, the Zakuulan tech walls can be put up against stuff. I have them all the way to the walls on my Nar Shaddaa strongholds. Anyway, your point stands, they need to be less limited.
#SaveSWTOR

♥Death Should Never Silence Love♥

JediBoadicea's Avatar


JediBoadicea
07.10.2018 , 01:26 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by DuchessKristania View Post
Actually, the Zakuulan tech walls can be put up against stuff. I have them all the way to the walls on my Nar Shaddaa strongholds. Anyway, your point stands, they need to be less limited.
Indeed they can, I was referring to the Large-hook-only decos like the weapon racks and the Droid Engineer's Workbench and the many others that can't be pushed even to the outside edge of their own hook because of their central placement and the limited axes (some of the very cool decos even from the most recent Mandalorian deco pack suffer from this too). But the Zakuulan Wall Tech panel is still an example of the frustration of limited hook options, because those could certainly fit on a Narrow but their being restricted to a Medium means their versatility is more limited, especially as you're more likely to find Narrows flush against walls or doorways than you are Mediums (if say you are trying to block doors or create alternate walling). The Tribal Floor Partition is another painful example of the same.

End of the day that's definitely all minutiae, though, while the central issue, as you noted, remains. Particularly with decos like these new Martial ones whose express purpose is to let us create obstacles courses (never mind the creative uses they'll have for decorators), the ability to maximize the deco-to-space ratio and to combine decos to create interesting obstructions is going to be really important, and all of that will be needlessly limited if some thought isn't given to making sure that the decos are assigned to the smallest hook (and up) on which they'll fit.

That's another rule that should be true for all decos: a deco should be assigned to the smallest hook on which it could safely fit and all hook sizes above that one.

Ylliarus's Avatar


Ylliarus
07.10.2018 , 03:26 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by JediBoadicea View Post
(Editing the beginning of this post as I finally caved and copied over a bunch of crafters and spent the whole bloody evening crafting so I could buy and test the new Martial decos. That being said, just because I caved and blew all those hours doesn't mean others should have to, and I'm sure you could get a lot more people testing these new decos out if you made them temporarily free to purchase on the PTS.)

But even having not actually been able to test them (though as per my above edit I should be able to hands-on test them soon), I can speak from experience that there are already far too many decos that are walls (or just long and rectangular) that fit only on Larges or Mediums when they could very easily fit on Mediums or Narrows without fully covering the hook... so please don't limit the new ones in this fashion! The Zakuulan Wall Tech Panel and countless Large-hook-only decos (that can never be placed against anything else because they're stuck in the middle of the dumb hook) attest to how frustrating and limiting this is.

If you really want us to get full and creative functionality out of these decos, for both PVP and otherwise, please have someone take the time to get in there and place each deco, and assess whether or not it could actually be assigned to a smaller hook. This really isn't all that much time, guys. Like... an hour? Two at most? Three when you tack on changing the item properties? And it would make an enormous amount of difference. Maybe I'm wrong on the time estimates but even if it's longer it's worth it. A wall decoration limited to a Large hook can not be placed against anything else, so you are stuck with... a standalone wall. You can't make a corner. Or a wall with a crate next to it. Or two walls at any sort of angle with each other. You're also immediately forcing people to leave a huge amount of unused space in the zone all around the deco on the Large hook.

While we're at it, most (though notably not all) of the problems like the above could be seriously mitigated by increasing the X/Y axes, as people have mentioned in this thread and in countless others. 20 degrees is absolutely not enough, and I strongly suspect that no one on the strongholds team actively decorates or this should have become glaringly obvious. (Sorry, yes, I'm a little salty, but we've been asking for this for ages and so many things about decos and strongholds have been needlessly frustrating for far too long now.) Any number of computer/technical/weapon-rack decos stuck on Large-hooks-only cannot be placed flush against walls or against anything else and this is more frustrating than I can properly articulate.
Giving a boost to your words because they are 100% true and correct, especially the last paragraph. Instead of -20 and 20 it should be at least -50 to 50 if not more. Perhaps it's the game engine that doesn't allow it, but if not, then I seriously recommend the range for hook placements is increased.
The Twi'lek Crusader
It is time for the Twi'lek species to receive new appearance customization options, because they have been neglected since launch.
If you agree with this... do please click on my referral link!

JediBoadicea's Avatar


JediBoadicea
07.11.2018 , 12:14 AM | #14
Ok, I finally finished copying all those characters and grinding up all those prefabs, and was able to buy all the new Martial decos and test them out. Below are my suggestions for changes to the hook sizes. The truth is that this was much better than I was expecting, so please excuse some of my salt in the earlier post in this thread (I've just been so traumatized by so many decos in the past that were given deeply frustrating hook assignments).

Nothing was too egregious with these Martial decos, but I think there is definitely opportunity for making these more versatile than they currently are, particularly with an eye to making them useful tools in building PVP obstacles. As such, all of my suggested changes below are not so much corrections to poorly applied hooks but rather suggestions for ways you could allow decos to go over a hook size in one dimension provided they don't overlap it in all dimensions.

This wouldn't be an issue at all if floor spaces were completely carpeted in hooks, but they're not; hooks are always frustratingly spaced out and staggered, and so limited x/y axes combined with limited hook assignments make it impossible to put some decos flush with each other without some revisions being made. Those are the revisions I suggest below.

I also called out a few decos as being particularly great and crying out for smaller versions (see the text in blue).

**

Desert Settlement Wall - No change in hook size needed on this one. However, just because this is a great deco and creative decorators could do so much with this in the Tatooine SH especially, I would love to see a "Small" version of this that could fit on a Large or Medium hook.

Dromund Kaas Boulder - No change in hook size needed, as it looks like it might run the risk of completely covering a Narrow hook.

Fabrication Droid (Martial) - No change in hook size needed.

Fortified Barrier - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. I know that the wall itself is longer than a Medium hook, but it is still narrower and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there. Allowing it to go on a Medium (presuming that is possible) would make a big difference in versatility.

Gormak Barricade - No change in hook size needed.

Imperial Barricade - No change in hook size needed.

Imperial Scaffold - No change in hook size needed.

Imperial Wall - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. The wall itself is longer than a Medium hook, but as best I am able to calculate at its middle point it is still narrower than a Medium and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there.

Kaas City Wall - Please make this fit on both a Centerpiece (as it currently does) and a Large. The wall itself is longer than a Large hook, but it is still narrower than a Large and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Large hook if placed there.

Large Training Area - Obviously no change in hook size is possible here. But placing it did make clear a lot of other issues with the hook layout while this deco is in use, which I will post in the main feedback thread.

Makeshift Scaffold - No change in hook size needed.

Military Barricade - No change in hook size needed.

Rebellion Barricade - No change in hook size needed.

Reinforced Barrier - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. The wall itself is longer than a Medium hook, but it is still narrower and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there.

Reinforced Wall - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. The wall itself is longer than a Medium hook, but it is still narrower and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there.

Republic Barricade - No change in hook size needed.

Republic Wall - Please make this fit on both a Centerpiece (as it currently does) and a Large. The wall itself is longer than a Large hook, but it is still narrower than a Large and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Large hook if placed there.

Security Fence - Please please ABSOLUTELY make this fit on a Medium as well as the Large it currently fits. This particular deco is crying out to have four placed square to make a cage and yet in almost any hook layout in any stronghold this would be impossible as Larges are never 4-by. This deco is narrow enough that you could even let it go on a hook as small as a Narrow and it we'd still be able to pick it up afterward.

Settlement Barrier - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. The wall itself is longer than a Medium hook, but it is still narrower and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there. In fact, this deco is so narrow that it could also go as small as a Narrow hook.

Sith Statue Wall - Oh goodness is this a great deco. Please do make this fit on a Medium as well as the Large it currently is limited too. As with all the others I've suggested a change for, while it is longer than a Medium it is more than narrow enough to fit on one and still be something we can pick up. Like the Desert Settlement wall, I would love to see a "Small" version of this deco that could fit on hooks as small as a Narrow, because this would make amazing "art" placed flush against a wall, or with the versatility of a Narrow hook could be used to completely "panel over" an existing wall to make an entirely new facade.

Starship Wall - Please make this fit on both a Centerpiece (as it currently does) and a Large. The wall itself is longer than a Large hook, but it is still narrower than a Large and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Large hook if placed there.

Stone Wall - Please make this fit on both a Centerpiece (as it currently does) and a Large. The wall itself is longer than a Large hook, but it is still narrower than a Large and thus would still be able to be picked up from a Large hook if placed there. Though this one isn't quite as striking as the Sith Statue Wall or the Desert Settlement wall, it's still unique enough among stronghold assets that it would be nice to see a "Small" version of this one too that could fit on Mediums or even Narrows. This would be great for blocking off areas in Yavin, or creating a maze on that Yavin plaza.

Tree: Fallen Alderaan Log - Please make this fit on both a Large (as it currently does) and a Medium. It is more than narrow enough to still be able to be picked up from a Medium hook if placed there.

Tree: Fallen Dromund Kaas Log - No change in hook size needed.

Voss Boulder - No change in hook size needed.

Ylliarus's Avatar


Ylliarus
07.11.2018 , 02:32 AM | #15
I still think that all the wall pieces should be made available to all hook types from medium narrow up higher. I just really want to be able to place these decorations everywhere, so that I'm not limited in what I can potentially wall off and what not. It would be a mastodontic loss if the wall decorations weren't made available to all hook types, the smallest being medium narrow.

So please, Bioware, make even the biggest walls such as the Dromund Kaas one available for medium narrow.
The Twi'lek Crusader
It is time for the Twi'lek species to receive new appearance customization options, because they have been neglected since launch.
If you agree with this... do please click on my referral link!

AscendingSky's Avatar


AscendingSky
07.11.2018 , 03:09 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Ylliarus View Post
I still think that all the wall pieces should be made available to all hook types from medium narrow up higher. I just really want to be able to place these decorations everywhere, so that I'm not limited in what I can potentially wall off and what not. It would be a mastodontic loss if the wall decorations weren't made available to all hook types, the smallest being medium narrow.

So please, Bioware, make even the biggest walls such as the Dromund Kaas one available for medium narrow.
I agree, at least for the most part. If a Medium Narrow hook will completely vanish beneath the deco once placed and make it heard to pick up again, then it's reasonable to not allow it to be placed there. But all of those walls, even the biggest ones, seem to be able to be placed on a Medium hook with at least a little bit of the hook showing past the sides. So they should all be set to go on Medium hooks, as well as Medium Narrow hooks for those especially slim decos that don't cover the whole hook even if they're super long. This will make the walls actually USEFUL as opposed to another source of frustration. It would be great to be able to create corrals for animal mount decos, line walkways, subdivide current rooms, etc. through the use of wall decos.

Other similar decorations (such as the Zakuulan Tech Wall deco) should also be set to using Medium Narrow hooks whenever possible.
#FixConquest
"RNG is EXCITING!!!!!!" -- Ben Irving, Former SWTOR Lead Producer
Vote With Your Wallet - Boycott Cartel Packs!

Ylliarus's Avatar


Ylliarus
07.11.2018 , 07:16 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by AscendingSky View Post
I agree, at least for the most part. If a Medium Narrow hook will completely vanish beneath the deco once placed and make it heard to pick up again, then it's reasonable to not allow it to be placed there. But all of those walls, even the biggest ones, seem to be able to be placed on a Medium hook with at least a little bit of the hook showing past the sides. So they should all be set to go on Medium hooks, as well as Medium Narrow hooks for those especially slim decos that don't cover the whole hook even if they're super long. This will make the walls actually USEFUL as opposed to another source of frustration. It would be great to be able to create corrals for animal mount decos, line walkways, subdivide current rooms, etc. through the use of wall decos.

Other similar decorations (such as the Zakuulan Tech Wall deco) should also be set to using Medium Narrow hooks whenever possible.
I will agree to the hook vanishing part, perhaps not all pieces are fit for medium narrow, but at least medium then. Since we donīt have free placement of objects like in ESO, it would at least be heavily appreciated if the pieces became useful for the hooks we do have. And limiting the big ones only to centerpieces or large will be a major loss of usefulness for the wall decorations.
The Twi'lek Crusader
It is time for the Twi'lek species to receive new appearance customization options, because they have been neglected since launch.
If you agree with this... do please click on my referral link!

Ylliarus's Avatar


Ylliarus
07.17.2018 , 08:01 AM | #18
I sincerely hope that this thread won't be overlooked because I have been talking with other players from for example the RP community and they view the new wall pieces as an amazing addition that will be a huge flop however if they remain limited to their current hook types. So please Bioware, make all the new wall pieces, even the biggest ones, available to at least medium of not even medium narrow, please!
The Twi'lek Crusader
It is time for the Twi'lek species to receive new appearance customization options, because they have been neglected since launch.
If you agree with this... do please click on my referral link!

DuchessKristania's Avatar


DuchessKristania
07.17.2018 , 09:50 PM | #19
I agree completely with the idea of these decos fitting on any kind of hook as long as the hook doesn't vanish entirely. The wall decos could be so so versatile if them open them up to other hooks. It would also be kind of amazing if the wall decos had hooks on them as well. I don't know if it's really possible, but it would be cool.

I think it would also be amazing if they could include some roof, ceiling, and square floor decos so that decorators could literally build their own homes. Giving us the ability to construct our own buildings would take the stronghold element of this game to the next level.
#SaveSWTOR

♥Death Should Never Silence Love♥

Ylliarus's Avatar


Ylliarus
07.18.2018 , 08:22 AM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by DuchessKristania View Post
I think it would also be amazing if they could include some roof, ceiling, and square floor decos so that decorators could literally build their own homes. Giving us the ability to construct our own buildings would take the stronghold element of this game to the next level.
Damn that would be amazing. I completely agree, having wall sections and such be able to be put onto walls and roofs would be epic. It would give us so much more freedom and diversity in creating our strongholds!
The Twi'lek Crusader
It is time for the Twi'lek species to receive new appearance customization options, because they have been neglected since launch.
If you agree with this... do please click on my referral link!