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Cannon: sold to highest bidder

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Cannon: sold to highest bidder

ceryxp's Avatar


ceryxp
01.02.2018 , 11:33 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by KnightPierce View Post
Sorry kid but growing up on star wars and how Canon was used as a term is different from how Disney uses it to justify their awful story direction. They want you to take it or leave it, that their version of sw will be the only one. If you believe that you are drinking Kool aid that's not how Canon works.
Um, yeah, that's not how canon works. What you're describing is headcanon. The story can exist in any way you want in your head, but no source material is ever going to draw from it.
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KnightPierce's Avatar


KnightPierce
01.02.2018 , 02:38 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Valceanu View Post
Disney canon is still better then 90% of the EU as is very well exemplified in another thread on these very boards (http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=940958). Also, odds are you are no older then the person you are calling "kid" as if it were impossible for someone who grew up with star wars to like the new movies. Well let me tell you right here and now... You're wrong. I grew up with SW. I had the movie on VHS as a kid and could mute the movie and recite the lines that's how much I loved them. I had the novelization of the movies which I read... But most of the EU I never acquired a taste for aside from the Thrawn books. Most of the post ep.6 EU for me was either poorly written and/or filled with ridiculousness. Sure, id like the old republic era to be canon, the KOTOR games and even SWTOR... but most of the post ep. 6 stuff I'm not sorry to see go at all. Trying to make an argument based of a presumed position of authority does nothing to strengthen your argument. In fact all you manage to do is seem bitter.
Disney canon is not better than the EU by a long shot.

KnightPierce's Avatar


KnightPierce
01.02.2018 , 02:41 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by ceryxp View Post
Um, yeah, that's not how canon works. What you're describing is headcanon. The story can exist in any way you want in your head, but no source material is ever going to draw from it.
No there was a set plot points that lucas handled and even hired a group to help oversee. Things were even classified by fans as most appropriate to the vision of lucas and labeled things closest to his as official and superseding that of others that created content in Star Wars.

just because someone else bought the rights doesnt change the vision of what Lucas made star wars to be.
http://deadline.com/2015/01/george-l...ey-1201354673/

Also even when Actors like Mark H signed on for new trilogy it was when LUCAS owned the rights still. It was only after original cast was under contract that Disney bought the rights and changed what the story would be.

Valceanu's Avatar


Valceanu
01.02.2018 , 03:28 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by KnightPierce View Post
Disney canon is not better than the EU by a long shot.
just cause you say so doesnt make it true... quite simply... you are wrong. See, normally me saying that wouldnt make it true (cause neither of us can say definitively one way or another... we can only speak for ourselves and not in universal truths) but since i applied your logic (or lack thereof) then it means it is so.
"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

KnightPierce's Avatar


KnightPierce
01.02.2018 , 04:15 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Valceanu View Post
just cause you say so doesnt make it true... quite simply... you are wrong. See, normally me saying that wouldnt make it true (cause neither of us can say definitively one way or another... we can only speak for ourselves and not in universal truths) but since i applied your logic (or lack thereof) then it means it is so.
The EU and what George Lucas and his teams built is why Disney bought it for 4 Billion dollars.

Valceanu's Avatar


Valceanu
01.02.2018 , 05:11 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by KnightPierce View Post
The EU and what George Lucas and his teams built is why Disney bought it for 4 Billion dollars.
That was for all the rights, and the EU contributed very little to that. The cinematic universe is where the money is. And how much have they made with the 3 movies out so far? Oh right, they have recouped the investment and are already in the green with some hundreds of millions in profit... So even from a financial standpoint they are doing quite well with the franchise...
"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

CrazyScruffy's Avatar


CrazyScruffy
01.02.2018 , 05:26 PM | #17
George selling the rights to Star Wars, was the best thing to happen to star wars. and you're arguing what "used to be canon", but even mr. Lucas stated many times the EU was not canon. Only what he made was, the rest was an alternate universe. And while the EU had some good content, there was a lot of crap as well.

jarjarloves's Avatar


jarjarloves
01.02.2018 , 06:51 PM | #18
ok so i'm a little confused here.


1. What is Disney's "Agenda"

2. Are you claiming George didn't sell out? Because he gave the liscene away to anyone that was willing to pay for it to make a story game or what ever.

3. you know that George made the EU non canon when he still owned it. He originally said only the movies were canon but fans raged so he came up with the Canon Level system where you had G canon which was the movies, T canon which was TV series, and E canon that was everything int he EU then of course N canon.

But the rule was anything that contradicted the higher level of canon was made Non Canon. So 90% of the EU stuff like Thrawn and so fourth was non canon because it contradicted the Prequels and such.

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DarthDymond's Avatar


DarthDymond
01.02.2018 , 07:27 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by KnightPierce View Post
I grew up with the idea that cannon was about figuring out what Lucas intended for the stories he did not tell. Reading between the lines of what he wrote himself and what he would approve.
Star Wars is, hands down, my favorite fictional universe, I absolutely love the stories, characters, and worlds that have flowed out of Lucas's work over the years and decades.

But Star Wars is not -- and never has been -- some grand, coherent vision the way, for example, Lord of the Rings was. Lucas originally wanted to do an updated remake of the Flash Gordon serials from the 1930s, but he couldn't get the rights. So, instead, he set out to make a movie that was like those sci-fi serials, but needed to put together his own original sci-fi setting for it. What he came up with was a phenomenal (and phenomenally successful) movie. From there, he had a handful of plot points and scenes in mind from earlier drafts that didn't fit in the run-time of that original movie, and then he just started making the rest up as he went along.

Lucas didn't stick "Episode IV" onto the re-release of Star Wars because he had a meticulous plan for three prequels, he did it because it added to the Flash Gordon-esque serial feel he was originally going for. He didn't envision a trilogy with an overarching story of a son redeeming his father and finding his sister, because he didn't even decide to make Darth Vader and Anakin Skywalker be the same guy until after ANH had already been released. The "Clone Wars" was a cool sci-fi sounding name to fill out a line of dialogue with when he wrote it, not a key part of some elaborate backstory. Leia being Luke's sister wasn't something he had planned out from the beginning, it was a way to wrap up the love triangle without leaving one of the fan-favorite characters brokenhearted once he decided not to kill anyone off (and all the actors signed on for the third movie).

My point is, what Lucas "intended" was never a set vision, it changed -- sometimes based simply on merchandising. Midichlorians, sticking rockets onto R2-D2, clone Boba Fett, all of that is pure undiluted Lucas, too, because he was just playing it by ear as he went. Star Wars is a fantastic universe that sprang from Lucas's original work, but any talk of what is or is not true to Lucas's intent or vision. . . there was no overarching vision or intent to be true to, just what the guy liked or didn't like at any given point in time.
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KnightPierce
01.02.2018 , 07:33 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by jarjarloves View Post
ok so i'm a little confused here.


1. What is Disney's "Agenda"

To maker money by pushing out scripts that would be forgettable if it didn't have the Star Wars mark on it and sell toys and tickets to fans that will go no matter the content. While pushing against patriarchy and jedi code and undermining the balance between light and dark by not going to a middle ground but by eliminating both.

2. Are you claiming George didn't sell out? Because he gave the liscene away to anyone that was willing to pay for it to make a story game or what ever.

George Lucas hoped disney would resurrect the cinematic universe because no would want to produce another movie with GL at the head. Even dispite the critical acclaim of Clone Wars which he produced.

3. you know that George made the EU non canon when he still owned it. He originally said only the movies were canon but fans raged so he came up with the Canon Level system where you had G canon which was the movies, T canon which was TV series, and E canon that was everything int he EU then of course N canon.

Elements of canon were in the EU and that was clarified by Lucas and a staff he had hired to oversee the EU. This creative control method is why we used the term Canon with star wars.

But the rule was anything that contradicted the higher level of canon was made Non Canon. So 90% of the EU stuff like Thrawn and so fourth was non canon because it contradicted the Prequels and such.
This statement lets me know you have no idea how canon was discussed pre disney and how Lucas was used as the benchmark.