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The Gear Grind


Lattervane's Avatar


Lattervane
12.30.2017 , 06:09 PM | #1
I'm a returning player. I mainly only pvp and do the occassional flashpoint.

To the Devs - your end game gear progression system is the biggest convoluted mess I've ever seen. What in heck are ya'll smoking at the office that made you think this crap up?

Not only does it take forever to acquire anything beyond tier 1, trying to figure out how many components, command tokens, at which vendor for which specific piece of gear is mind blowing.

There's alot to be said for simplicity. You guys need to figure that out.

countdemons's Avatar


countdemons
12.30.2017 , 06:18 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by Lattervane View Post
I'm a returning player. I mainly only pvp and do the occassional flashpoint.

To the Devs - your end game gear progression system is the biggest convoluted mess I've ever seen. What in heck are ya'll smoking at the office that made you think this crap up?

Not only does it take forever to acquire anything beyond tier 1, trying to figure out how many components, command tokens, at which vendor for which specific piece of gear is mind blowing.

There's alot to be said for simplicity. You guys need to figure that out.
Returning player also. Its simple. 13 pagan rituals, sacrifice your 1st born and pray to RNG gods.

But yeah, now spend less time pvp'ing and more time trying to work out the algorithm to to see if the RNG gods allow me to get gear for my char.

I feel you're pain but hey. They spent 4.0 ruining pve, so now its 5.0's turn to ruin pvp
Dragonslayer, Gate Crasher
TOFN - TRE
Harbinger
KoTFE - Death of end game raiding http://www.swtor.com/r/xTdy9B

Evolixe's Avatar


Evolixe
12.30.2017 , 06:41 PM | #3
Then to think that this system was meant to simplify things. Lmfao.
Evolixe | Exilove
Disciples of Babylon - Darth Malgus
Shadow/Sin Discord Server

Rafiknoll's Avatar


Rafiknoll
12.30.2017 , 06:41 PM | #4
It is actually quite simple:

In one room, for each class, there is a set of 4 vendors (1 per tier) which will sell you gear for (230,236,242,248) for the respective gear token + few command tokens. The exception is tier 1 (230) which requires only command tokens without a gear token.

In the 2nd room, for each class, there is a set of vendors (1 per tier) which serve as "converters", they will sell you the gear tokens, for any piece of gear of the same slot and 1 tier LOWER + some hundreds of unassembled components.
230 purple gear (not blue or green) can be converted to 236 tokens (which buys legendary gear).
236 (legendary only) can be converted to 242 tokens (which buys legendary gear).
242 (legendary only) can be converted to 248 tokens (which buys legendary gear) which is currently top rating.
For example, to get a token for a tier 4 glove, the "cost" is a tier 3 glove (242) + some unassembled components. The glove which you sell can have its inner mods stripped out if you want them, even the empty "shell" is enough for the vendor.

Beside all that there are the loot crates, which can grant you the gear directly (tier of the gear depends on their tier of the box which depends on your command rank, which goes up like normal leveling up to 300, in 300 you keep getting cxp, and for each time your cxp bar is full you get a tier 4 crate and the cxp bar resets, but does not lvl you up to 301. Crates also always involve some command tokens, and if you got a non-cosmetic gear piece (=gear with stats, not empty shells) that you don't need you can disintegrate them to get unassembled components.

*Other ways to get unassembled components is basically any non-solo content, and especially PVP weeklies. In fact, these ways are far dominant than disintegrating gear, and the gear, even if unneeded, better be saved to buy the gear tokens, because remember, the cost for a token is unassembled components + a weaker version of the same piece of gear. That means, that if for example, you have 246 gloves (which are not legendary), but open a crate with 242 gloves (which are legendary), you might wanna keep the 242 gloves because they are convertible to 248 (with the unassembled component vendor), while the 246 are not.
*Raid bosses drop gear tokens directly (same token for same boss, so you can target those you want), so it can help you skip the use of unassembled components if you get them.

So it is more complicated than it used to be, but is not confusing or hard to understand when you write it all in one place, and these days all PC games get more and more complicated because simple gets boring (compare the assassin's creed 1st game to the last, or mass effect [but keep Andromeda out of it :P], or any other game series, complicated is good as long as the human mind can still wrap around it.

P.S: The annoying bit is that some tank BiS enhancements can only be achieved as super-rare drops from tier 3 and 4 crates, so rare that in fact I discovered their existence just recently, and hope that in the future there will be other ways to get them. Beside them, all BiS gear can be acquired by not so long work, even if you have 0 luck with your crates.

Evolixe's Avatar


Evolixe
12.30.2017 , 06:45 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Rafiknoll View Post
It is actually quite simple:
*continues to write a novel-size post*
Errrr.. what?

When explaining gear to someone it should be like:

Component A, source vendor here
Component B, source OPS here
Component C, source crafting here
Component D, source currency XYZ

If it requires more explaining than that it's not a simple system.
As a new or late returning player.. the current system is a maze for which you need a foreign dictionary to unravel.
Evolixe | Exilove
Disciples of Babylon - Darth Malgus
Shadow/Sin Discord Server

countdemons's Avatar


countdemons
12.30.2017 , 07:00 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Evolixe View Post
Errrr.. what?

When explaining gear to someone it should be like:

Component A, source vendor here
Component B, source OPS here
Component C, source crafting here
Component D, source currency XYZ

If it requires more explaining than that it's not a simple system.
As a new or late returning player.. the current system is a maze for which you need a foreign dictionary to unravel.
I agree. Each post of someone trying to explain it to me requires around 6 hours of reading. The irony is that they start with, its simple.

Having cleared almost all NiM content with timed runs, I got bored with no content for years, so took time off to play WoW. Came back to 3 ops bosses in like 2 years....

Aside from the no content joke, the gearing system is absurd. It has put me off wanting to play the game as its meant to be fun and enjoyable. Shouldn't have to study harder to work out how to gear than for my degree.

I laugh when I see the devs say this gearing carry on is "controversial". It means they know they ****ed up.

Gearing should go back to how it was in 2.0 for the dread ops.
Dragonslayer, Gate Crasher
TOFN - TRE
Harbinger
KoTFE - Death of end game raiding http://www.swtor.com/r/xTdy9B

Rafiknoll's Avatar


Rafiknoll
12.30.2017 , 07:03 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by Evolixe View Post
If it requires more explaining than that it's not a simple system.
As a new or late returning player.. the current system is a maze for which you need a foreign dictionary to unravel.
I didn't say it is the simplest system possible, but while 1+1=2 is simpler than 2*512=1024, that doesn't make the latter complicated.
What BioWare did fail in doing, is getting the info accessible easily. It was accessible and quite explained in patch notes of 5.0, if I recall correctly, or at least I know for certain it was never complicated for me when it was introduced (and it didn't see many changes since), but maybe thats my 146 IQ speaking
I wrote a scroll to have all info required in there if you think short sentences are necessary for simplicity, lets try:

*************************************************
CT = command tokens
UC = unassembled components
Tokens are specific for each slot and each tier [Ex: Tier 3 Implant token]

Gear:
Vendor location: supplies section of fleet, 2nd room.
Cost per piece: Token (of respective rating) + CT. [Tier 1 requires only CT]
Alternative source: Lucky RNG in command crates.

Token:
Vendor location: supplies section of fleet, 1st room.
Cost per piece: gear of previous tier + UC
Alternative source: ops bosses.

CT:
Source: Command crates.

UC
Source: all no-solo content (especially weekly missions), and disintigrating Gear from Command crates.

Command crates:
Source: leveling up with CXP.

*************************************************

Is that simple enough? It was for my 8yo brother who doesn't play this game (but so was my last post, so... )
EDIT: Whatever degree you are studying, I sure hope it involves more than reading and understanding an "article" of 99 words with a lot of in-references and explaining colors, so you will do. Understanding the above is not more complicated than understanding how ancient hypergate or Odessen proving grounds work.

Just note that I will probably respond to whatever you say only tomorrow .

Aaroneus's Avatar


Aaroneus
12.30.2017 , 07:14 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Evolixe View Post
Errrr.. what?

When explaining gear to someone it should be like:

Component A, source vendor here
Component B, source OPS here
Component C, source crafting here
Component D, source currency XYZ

If it requires more explaining than that it's not a simple system.
As a new or late returning player.. the current system is a maze for which you need a foreign dictionary to unravel.
you just did explain it in 4 lines, point form. it really is that simple.

Evolixe's Avatar


Evolixe
12.30.2017 , 07:16 PM | #9
No, because you failed to include the part where you first have to get to command level 300 before you get any of the good stuff.

Look at it from the perspective of a completely new player. You don't know what command levels are.
You don't know what command crates are. You don't know what command points or unassembled comms are or where they come from. You don't know what a token is, where to hand it in or how that upgrading system is structured..

Hell, most people don't even know they can use their companion to sell off useless items to create bagspace while out and about.

As a core part of the game this information should either be obvious or handed to you as you go. But it isnt.
If it wasn't for the fact that they appear in your inventory I bet many new players wouldn't even notice command crates are a thing until someone told em.
Evolixe | Exilove
Disciples of Babylon - Darth Malgus
Shadow/Sin Discord Server

Evolixe's Avatar


Evolixe
12.30.2017 , 07:20 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Aaroneus View Post
you just did explain it in 4 lines, point form. it really is that simple.
Sure, if you already know the system. If you don't know jack it doesn't make any sense at all.

I remember from my early days in WoW I would not socket gems in items because I didn't understand the concept of gemming. Little did I know..

The information wasn't obvious. If it isn't obvious people will skip or miss it.
Not intentionally, but they just don't know any better.
Evolixe | Exilove
Disciples of Babylon - Darth Malgus
Shadow/Sin Discord Server