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Vanilla content too easy


IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
01.02.2018 , 05:41 PM | #101
TUXs has made all the arguments I would have (and a few more besides), so I'll just chime in with this.

The leveling content is "mandatory" content - approximately everyone has to play it; so it's difficulty must be set to the lowest common denominator. And most of it is "open world" content, which means it can't be synced at the mob level to the player - the rakghoul tunnel solution is a grotty hack that causes all sorts of weirdness, and means you can't group up with players not your level. (They appear to almost instantaneously replace the "pilot" mob with an on-level mob, but it is "immune" to any hits until the replacement phases in, and of course they drop the rest of the pack from the ceiling, climb out of the ground, etc. And they tend to put a stun/knockback on the first attack each mob does to help conceal this. I hate tanking outside the heroic area, and I'm not thrilled with tanking in the heroic area, because of this).

The Knights content can be adjusted in difficulty because it's almost all of it instanced, so they can customize it per player.

I started sometime in the late 2.x timeframe (? level cap was 55 at the time), and I was new to the play style. The last time I had any concerns about my level for solo-ish content was trying to do some of the heroics on Pub Taris. After that, while I don't think I started any further planet enough overlevel that I was able to flat ignore the mobs, the combats were still pretty tedious, and pretty quickly I had overleveled the planets enough that I was getting essentially no treasure because there was no "challenge" (in the game design sense - I could not be hurt). The only truly difficult part of any class story I've ever had was the Knight's finale on Belsavis, and that because the "correct" strategy was to actually listen to the briefing for once and leave your allies and your enemies fighting, or you'd be overwhelmed by silly OP NPCs, in complete contravention of everything you'd been taught up to then. (This per several guides I googled up in frustration. If I hadn't had found those guides, I would have ragequite and missed quite a lot of enjoyment). The actual endgame story bosses were pretty easy when I got to them and their target range of L45-50 or so, and me in my L55 and not inefficiently geared. And once the level cap went to 60, the problem gets worse.

The game is undoubtedly easier than it was at launch, but that's not because of the 4.x changes, or at least not those alone.

And, just as a PS, gratuitously insulting other people's play style isn't a good way to make friends. TUXs and I have had some epic arguments, but I have never deliberately insulted his play style, and he's never insulted mine. If you want people to listen to your argument, all y'all might want to think about that.
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Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
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LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
01.02.2018 , 10:28 PM | #102
Its a wise point....the class stories are the gateway to the game, and at different times in the past problems with difficulty (certain overpowered mobs, inconsistency, etc) has led to likely negative reception by potential players.

A setting for difficulty (with the default set as it is now) would keep things as they are but add easy and hard modes for folks that prefer that sort of thing.

RagnarAugustus's Avatar


RagnarAugustus
01.03.2018 , 01:14 PM | #103
Quote: Originally Posted by _Tarkus_ View Post
Will I be able to use all abilities then? I think some of them require a certain weapon or 2 equipped. The game is so easy at the moment I can't learn abilities, how and when to use them effectively.
Then equip an empty weapon shell from the cartel market or GTN. You make make this as difficult as you want or as easy as you want.

TUXs's Avatar


TUXs
01.03.2018 , 01:50 PM | #104
Quote: Originally Posted by IanArgent View Post
TUXs has made all the arguments I would have (and a few more besides), so I'll just chime in with this.

The leveling content is "mandatory" content - approximately everyone has to play it; so it's difficulty must be set to the lowest common denominator. And most of it is "open world" content, which means it can't be synced at the mob level to the player - the rakghoul tunnel solution is a grotty hack that causes all sorts of weirdness, and means you can't group up with players not your level. (They appear to almost instantaneously replace the "pilot" mob with an on-level mob, but it is "immune" to any hits until the replacement phases in, and of course they drop the rest of the pack from the ceiling, climb out of the ground, etc. And they tend to put a stun/knockback on the first attack each mob does to help conceal this. I hate tanking outside the heroic area, and I'm not thrilled with tanking in the heroic area, because of this).

The Knights content can be adjusted in difficulty because it's almost all of it instanced, so they can customize it per player.

I started sometime in the late 2.x timeframe (? level cap was 55 at the time), and I was new to the play style. The last time I had any concerns about my level for solo-ish content was trying to do some of the heroics on Pub Taris. After that, while I don't think I started any further planet enough overlevel that I was able to flat ignore the mobs, the combats were still pretty tedious, and pretty quickly I had overleveled the planets enough that I was getting essentially no treasure because there was no "challenge" (in the game design sense - I could not be hurt). The only truly difficult part of any class story I've ever had was the Knight's finale on Belsavis, and that because the "correct" strategy was to actually listen to the briefing for once and leave your allies and your enemies fighting, or you'd be overwhelmed by silly OP NPCs, in complete contravention of everything you'd been taught up to then. (This per several guides I googled up in frustration. If I hadn't had found those guides, I would have ragequite and missed quite a lot of enjoyment). The actual endgame story bosses were pretty easy when I got to them and their target range of L45-50 or so, and me in my L55 and not inefficiently geared. And once the level cap went to 60, the problem gets worse.

The game is undoubtedly easier than it was at launch, but that's not because of the 4.x changes, or at least not those alone.

And, just as a PS, gratuitously insulting other people's play style isn't a good way to make friends. TUXs and I have had some epic arguments, but I have never deliberately insulted his play style, and he's never insulted mine. If you want people to listen to your argument, all y'all might want to think about that.
Excellently stated Ian!!!
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Krazhez's Avatar


Krazhez
01.03.2018 , 03:13 PM | #105
Didn't read through all of this, so I'm not sure if it was mentioned. Do the missions without armorings in. If you are under the effects of planet bolster, it doesn't bolster your armor rating if there's nothing in the slot. (side note, a blue armoring gives the same armor no matter the rating, a 116 blue will bolster higher than a 190 green, etc)
Anyway, It may not make story content that much harder, because you still kill really fast, but it will make heroics harder, at very least if you are dps running with a dps companion or no companion.

Keta's Avatar


Keta
01.06.2018 , 11:08 AM | #106
Quote: Originally Posted by RahaylaCora View Post
Now that the double XP event is over, keep using the White Acute Module. You will see that your leveling progression is slower. Try a new character if you like and comment your new game experience.
I just did this just for grins on two different accounts. First was my real account and the other was a very old preffered account.

Account 1:

Level 50 legacy, numerous unlocks though no legacy wide or character unlocks that have an xp boost in them. A moderate number of datacrons collected over the years. Rolled a commando trooper as I realized I'd never played a commando in all these years.

1. collected my 51 mails upon exiting the first scene on Ord Mantel. Activated the white acute module even though the event is over just in case. Went through the mail and used every title etc. Some give xp. Unlike earlier where I dinged 2 just on the mail (on a 'throwaway' toon), I didn't get all that much xp from.

I equipped an empty orange canon and kept it that way throughout Ord Mantel. Did the entire planetary arc, the trooper story and ALL other missions including bonus missions except the heroics. Used only mission reward armor otherwise it was just empty shells. Use the class trainers at the main base only -- no field training. No cartel xp boosts unlocks or potions. No xp armor from the DvL event. After doing all the missions (including the minefield race and the finding the repair stuff for the lady npc nearby there) and collecting Jorgan I did the planetary heroics. Collected 0 Ord Mantel datacrons as they were all collected on the legacy previously. Clicked on convenient lore items only.

End result was level 12 when I went to Fleet.

2. Preferred account. Level 1 legacy with ZERO unlocks and ZERO datacrons collected.

Collected both emails and activated the single title. No clue where that came form but as I said .. old account.

Did the planetary "arc' and storyline missions plus every single other mission except the heroics. Did all the bonus missions. Used reward gear only (no shells). No xp boost potions no xp unlocks. Used the Sith academy trainer only. Collected all the Korriban datacrons. Clicked on all convenient lore items. After collecting Khem I did the planetary heroics.

End result was level 16 when I went to fleet.

Playing the trooper for a bit on Coruscant afterwards quickly reinforced my thoughts that if you actually want to keep your level close to the planetary level, you need to under equip and do only the class story on pretty much every single planet. Not what I personally like to do but that's me.

Also, I hadn't played a prefered account in ages. I was literally shocked at just how restricted the accounts really are. They're quite close to crippled at the base preferred level and I hate to see a genuinely f2p account.

Anyway, did all that for "fun".
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IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
01.07.2018 , 09:09 AM | #107
That's interesting - developer statements have said that you're supposed to be doing all the purple missions (but not the heroics, they're not purple) to stay on the level curve for each planet. Wonder if that's for the pure F2P rate.
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Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
that doesn't mean I want anyone else punished or shunned...we ALL matter.
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Keta's Avatar


Keta
01.07.2018 , 10:27 AM | #108
Quote: Originally Posted by IanArgent View Post
That's interesting - developer statements have said that you're supposed to be doing all the purple missions (but not the heroics, they're not purple) to stay on the level curve for each planet. Wonder if that's for the pure F2P rate.
That's the way I normally play it. I leave the starter planet usually around level 18... without heroics. Last character I leveled was somewhere around level 30 when leaving Coruscant. But that included the heroics there.

I'd hate to see a true FTP account. Preferred was bad enough imo. The game felt crippled, not a good image to be putting forward. But that's just me.
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casirabit's Avatar


casirabit
01.07.2018 , 12:27 PM | #109
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
Skills change far too much from 1-70 to be of any use at end game. If I did it your way, I'd be using explosive round in my commando's rotation, because that's what I learned to do at level 5. There's no learning anything until you have all your skills...to suggest otherwise is silly.

Yup...putting your companion on passive may not be enough for super duper skilled players like yourself...so remove all your class buffs and try that. If it's still too easy for you, do something besides easy mode story missions (FP's, Heroics, Ops, PvP). You're looking for your challenge in the entirely wrong place my friend.
While I agree with some things, I have to disagree with you on a few things. I did learn how to use my abilities while I was leveling up at launch but I was also playing a healer and playing with friends even on the class missions. While I get what you are saying there are some abilities people get they should know how to use. I.E. interrupt and those are the abilities they are not learning and on the consular final mission it is something I keep hearing that final boss is impossible because they have no idea of how to use an interrupt so that is the one ability they should have and know how to use way before lv 50.
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IanArgent's Avatar


IanArgent
01.07.2018 , 12:54 PM | #110
Quote: Originally Posted by Keta View Post
That's the way I normally play it. I leave the starter planet usually around level 18... without heroics. Last character I leveled was somewhere around level 30 when leaving Coruscant. But that included the heroics there.

I'd hate to see a true FTP account. Preferred was bad enough imo. The game felt crippled, not a good image to be putting forward. But that's just me.
I ran F2P for about 2 weeks prior to subbing. Being able to open lockboxes convinced me to subscribe!

F2P and preferred really seem to be set up to be extended demos rather than a way of life.
You want Things? Do some Work. Find me on Star Forge
Quote: Originally Posted by TUXs View Post
that doesn't mean I want anyone else punished or shunned...we ALL matter.
Referral link - click it, or don't