I love GSF, and would like to play a lot more. The death matches are brutal, with a veteran team turning the match into a farm fest when they roll in to Gunship down an an opposing team, often made up of players with a fresh new stable of ships. Is there any way that the matchmaker could even it out, or better yet, BW could invest in a few more diverse matchup locales, so we might not get what seems like an entire day of nothing but DM?

ok rant off. sorry had to vent.

The problem, unfortunately, has less to do with the matchmaker and more to do with the size of the players base. When enough people are playing, the matchmaker actually does a pretty decent job of matching up players of equal experience. However, when not enough people are on to have multiple matches going at once, the game just throws everyone in together. It really all depends on what server you're on, and what time of day you're playing.

The best thing you can do is get ask for advice from other players, and see if anyone will group up with you. The GSF vets are pretty willing to help newer pilots learn the ropes, including how to effectively deal with gunships. You should definitely check out Despon's GSF School youtube channel as well: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCWTo5N9w5J_9OeqCvKfWMbQ

As there is no true solution for a "GS fortress" (4-6 GS and 1-2 Bombers camping somewhere, nearly invincible, especially if the match is only 8 people and not 12, which isn't uncommon), except for another GS fortress to oppose them, I think there must be a permanent solution to the problem:

Cap the number of GS in the field to a maximum of 3 per team (other players can see a "red" or "grayed out" gunship button if capacity is reached, and what of players who have only GS in their active roster? Well, simple solution, make it impossible! Roster will require at least one non-GS ship (the guys who run statistics and numbers can decide if such an act is required for bombers, personally, I think there should be, but 3 is not too OP and can't think of a match in which I actually I saw more).

I can already imagine how many anti-posts will come about this (and at least a half would be the so called veterans who score big only, and only, in GS fortresses), but I only stated my opinion. These matches are not too common to make someone (reasonable) quit GSF forever, but not too uncommon to make this someone give up on queueing for 2-3h (unless he doesn't care about losing badly, for daily or cxp sake, for example, which is understandable), so the community, and I speak of the side usually suffering from those (in TRE, only the reps use this tactic, far as I can tell), should decide if this problem is worth changing the rules or not, and the devs, in their phase, will get to see the community's opinion and do the exact opposite

As there is no true solution for a "GS fortress" (4-6 GS and 1-2 Bombers camping somewhere, nearly invincible, especially if the match is only 8 people and not 12, which isn't uncommon), except for another GS fortress to oppose them, I think there must be a permanent solution to the problem:

There certainly is a solution. 1-2 gunships with Ion Railgun who know what they're doing and 2-3 battlescout pilots who know what they're doing. Which means that about 1/2 to 1/3 of the team needs to know what they're doing.

The hard part is getting more than 2 pilots who know what they're doing onto a team during your average match.

The Ion Railgun AOE upgrade destroys the fortress of mines and drones, and also makes the gunships and bombers more vulnerable to damage from the battlescouts.

Once the fortress is breached the scouts go in and slaughter things. You just need enough scouts so that between the scouts and gunships the enemy gunships can't concentrate all their fire on one target.

Gunships and bombers have mechanics that allow inexperienced pilots who aren't using teamwork to be very effective against inexperienced pilots in scouts and strikes who aren't using teamwork.

The teamwork isn't that hard, it doesn't require premades or communication. If you're on a gunship, you Ion AOE the bomber fortress too pop the mines, and knock down the shields on the gunships. If you're on a scout and see that a gunship just ionned down the minefield, you go in for the kill.

Doing those things without getting killed though is not so easy. That's where the experience is required to make it work.

There certainly is a solution. 1-2 gunships with Ion Railgun who know what they're doing and 2-3 battlescout pilots who know what they're doing. Which means that about 1/2 to 1/3 of the team needs to know what they're doing.

To get bombers, friendly GS have to go into firing range . Since bombers are behind GS (or hiding in asteroids), that means friendly GS are targets for enemy GS.

It is doable - but the level of coordination needed is far greater than needed to build good 'fortress'. AND - if the 'fortress' players have the same levels of coordination, they are able to counter this with ease.

Thus, theoretically doable, practically impossible, assuming equal level of skill.

The only counter is to adopt the same tactic - maybe with some T3 scouts giving repairs / tensors/evasion boosts etc.

There certainly is a solution. 1-2 gunships with Ion Railgun who know what they're doing and 2-3 battlescout pilots who know what they're doing. Which means that about 1/2 to 1/3 of the team needs to know what they're doing.

Doesn't need to be a battlescout. I eat through this kind of fortresses in my Novadive quite nicely (using Distortion Field, Running Interference, Targeting Telemetry with Evasion upgrade and Power Death to weave through enemy lines). But you need support from Ionrailguns and you definitly don't want to be the only scout. And you need to be willing to die a few times (I don't mind because getting ammo for the pods can be difficult, as I see too many T2-Bombers running their Repair Drone without ammo refill).

It also helps to target the GS in the back. Usually this leads to some heavy fire when the enemy Gunships all turn around to get you, but this allows your team to get into better position. And if they don't turn around even better. Just shoot them one by one.

But I still think that the tactic of this fortress is boring and not good use of time. Especially if it ends with two teams doing the same thing. It takes forever and is as far away from fun as trenches can be.

To get bombers, friendly GS have to go into firing range . Since bombers are behind GS (or hiding in asteroids), that means friendly GS are targets for enemy GS.

It is doable - but the level of coordination needed is far greater than needed to build good 'fortress'. AND - if the 'fortress' players have the same levels of coordination, they are able to counter this with ease.

Thus, theoretically doable, practically impossible, assuming equal level of skill.

 

The only counter is to adopt the same tactic - maybe with some T3 scouts giving repairs / tensors/evasion boosts etc.

Especially in Lost Shipyards the bombers are so often in front of the GS that they are not even a threat to the scouts...

If so, then pilots aren't really experienced.

I'd argue that experienced pilots wouldn't run that tactic, but I'm afraid that isn't the case. Aynway, even if you are loosing while trying to crack the fortress, it is more fun than sitting there and trying to snipe along with your fellow players. At least you get the Death Star trench run feeling

I think the real problem is that since GSF has come out, they really haven't followed through, maybe the real problem is that they need to work the system add a few more GSF themes, like team escort, or a different capture the flag mechanic type scenarios, and they might get a more devoted following of people, instead of the die hards, who dominate, getting mixed in with people trying it, but finding the learning curve to be to steep to make the grade.

I think the real problem is that since GSF has come out, they really haven't followed through, maybe the real problem is that they need to work the system add a few more GSF themes, like team escort, or a different capture the flag mechanic type scenarios, and they might get a more devoted following of people, instead of the die hards, who dominate, getting mixed in with people trying it, but finding the learning curve to be to steep to make the grade.

I think everyone would be in full agreement there. We would all love to see new content added to GSF, but sadly all active development has long since stopped on our little mini game. I won't pretend to know the reasons for it, but the devs have outright said that GSF is not a priority for them, and likely won't be any time soon. Those of us who really get the GSF bug learn to make the best of what we have, and lots of veteran players hold their own events and contests, far more so than any other part of SWTOR. At least we didn't get forgotten in the whole CXP and unassembled components system, that's more attention than we've gotten in years.

True that, well I got the bug, but the fail is strong with this one <-----

well, i know many will say 'get better' or give tactics on how maxed veteran pilots would handle things.

I know what you are talking about. Imp side harbinger went on a 13 hour binge this very day, making many pub side question why they keep q'ing. Or, even taking a sabbatical away from gsf.

One guy, who has only played about a month himself, actually told me, pubs are too sensitive about that. Don't worry, he said he can talk smack because he can back it up. Don't worry, he is on my 'to kill repeatedly' list.

As far as making match maker better, it isnt going to happen. When groups of four play, the groups get priority. Whether they are all aces or all noobs in those four man groups. This is why you have aces against a whole slate of noobs, even in live fire.

Now, if we took into consideration, everyone had maxed ships, there is still the question of skill. Which that game cannot take into consideration.

If things dont work out, you might try other servers that arent so top heavy.

Just so you know, pilots from all servers come to harbinger to fly. So, while they are on harbinger, binge winning, you can be on their home server chillin.

Wouldn't it be fun though if one team gets more than 10 ahead of the other in DM that all gunships and blc scouts on the leading team would be automatically un-shipped (not destroyed), and have to choose a different ship. I guess this would be hardcode mode, giving the obvious losing side a chance to narrow the gap a bit and avoid this very common farm-fest that happens most DMs. Most DMs are way too one sided. Maybe other more realistic ideas for giving a total face-rolled team a reason to keep playing in a match?

Just a fun idea. We know no changes will ever be made.

Going along with what Stellar suggests, in a domination match, de equip all bombers that are on satellites when they get more than 400 points lead.

These solutions would certainly cut down on bomber, scout or GS "spam" and make things more interesting.

Going along with what Stellar suggests, in a domination match, de equip all bombers that are on satellites when they get more than 400 points lead.

 

These solutions would certainly cut down on bomber, scout or GS "spam" and make things more interesting.

I'd go more along these lines, except all bombers when a team gets 200 point ahead would be forced to change ships to something else in a Domination. Make all those bomber spam teams learn how to play a different strat to win.

I'd argue that experienced pilots wouldn't run that tactic, but I'm afraid that isn't the case.

Good, coordinated premade may try this and be successful. But not against a good, coordinated premade of gunships.

And I rarely see this tactic working in real matches anyway.

What is the reaction of typical average-to-good pilot if he doesn't have a target in range? Advance forward. If I am going to 'try to break the fortress' then the respawners (assuming the rest of my teams scores kills, if that is not the case, then ... doesn't matter anyway) will focus on scout attackers. My team doesn't have targets in range, so they are advancing too. Fight gets closer to enemy spawn.

Finally, you get killed. Fight returns to stationary 'chess' of GS. The only difference is that it is closer to enemy spawn. Your team gets picked one by one, replacements aren't coming back fast enough (can be countered with the beacon, but that means one less useful ship in your team). Slowly, team dies.

Fight comes back to middle, only the enemy has a few more kills.

Aynway, even if you are loosing while trying to crack the fortress, it is more fun than sitting there and trying to snipe along with your fellow players. At least you get the Death Star trench run feeling

If you like to play Porkins, go ahead. But I am afrad there aren't vent shafts that would allow you to 'insta-win' this battle.

I would rather wait an hour or two in queue and get into a team of nabs like myself flying scouts and fighters than to get into a battle every 20 min where I basicly get slaughtered by way more experienced and better equiped players with their gunships. Even if the better team is on my side, it's not fun, not much left for me to do in that case. I tried out gunships, and that is boring as hell. I think most people would want a hectic, fast paced battle in their fighters, not a war of attrition.

How about gunships and bombers had their separate missions? Maybe PvE content for bombers and gunships,, perhaps ops against capital ships, and space stations? It's not good for the game when these gunship snipers kill the buzz for newbies who want to fly a pvp battle. If these battles only had strike fighters and scouts, things would improve wastly, and we'd have a true Galactic STARFIGHTER experience...

...or give a long cooldown ability to scouts and strike fighters to torpedo those damn gunships from slightly outside their firing range. That might balance things out a bit too. They kill fighters too easy, and are too robust to kill off easily, gunships need to get either nerfed or more vulerable or both. Also bombers should be bombers, not mine layers.

I would rather wait an hour or two in queue and get into a team of nabs like myself flying scouts and fighters than to get into a battle every 20 min where I basicly get slaughtered by way more experienced and better equiped players with their gunships. Even if the better team is on my side, it's not fun, not much left for me to do in that case. I tried out gunships, and that is boring as hell. I think most people would want a hectic, fast paced battle in their fighters, not a war of attrition.

 

How about gunships and bombers had their separate missions? Maybe PvE content for bombers and gunships,, perhaps ops against capital ships, and space stations? It's not good for the game when these gunship snipers kill the buzz for newbies who want to fly a pvp battle. If these battles only had strike fighters and scouts, things would improve wastly, and we'd have a true Galactic STARFIGHTER experience...

 

...or give a long cooldown ability to scouts and strike fighters to torpedo those damn gunships from slightly outside their firing range. That might balance things out a bit too. They kill fighters too easy, and are too robust to kill off easily, gunships need to get either nerfed or more vulerable or both. Also bombers should be bombers, not mine layers.

Ha

I would love nothing more than to see you fly in an 8v8 of all scouts/strikes with reasonably competent pilots behind the joysticks. You'd change your tune pretty darn quick when you realize you just banished the easiest targets from the match and now lock on missiles may as well not even exist, and one build of T2 scout has become a proverbial lawnmower.

If gunships and bombers didn't have utility then why would anyone ever choose the clunkiest, most immobile ships? If you have a need for speed, there are plenty of racing games available.

Use your head

like team escort

This might actually give a purpose to the type 2 strike or the torpedo version of the tier 2 gunship or bomber. It could also give a role to things like the shield projector component or a use for tensor outside the start of a match. Presumably the ship we are escorting would not have a missle break since it would be npc, and the turbo laser turrets could be "offline" hence why they need an escort. They could make it like Voidstar where the teams alternate between escorting and assaulting. Reskin a version of Denon which is expansive but has some objects for line of sight.

Ha

 

I would love nothing more than to see you fly in an 8v8 of all scouts/strikes with reasonably competent pilots behind the joysticks. You'd change your tune pretty darn quick when you realize you just banished the easiest targets from the match and now lock on missiles may as well not even exist, and one build of T2 scout has become a proverbial lawnmower.

 

If gunships and bombers didn't have utility then why would anyone ever choose the clunkiest, most immobile ships? If you have a need for speed, there are plenty of racing games available.

 

Use your head

Yeah it's not like it's less aggravating to be shot down by a skilled fighter pilot than getting one-shotted by a camper, not at all..........