Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Questions of Light and Dark

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Questions of Light and Dark

Audoucet's Avatar


Audoucet
05.06.2016 , 08:13 AM | #21
Quote: Originally Posted by Seireeni View Post
You yourself seem to disagree with the part of a dark side user being able to be morally good (or at least "not completely psychopathic").
Not necessarily. In the first seasons of Rebels, the hero unknowingly uses the Dark Side more and more, for very good reasons. In the last episode, he starts to become crazy, and it seems that the third season will be about that.

Just like hell, the dark side is paved with good intentions.You don't need to be evil to use the dark side, just like you don't need to be an addict, to use drugs, it comes after.

Seireeni's Avatar


Seireeni
05.06.2016 , 08:21 AM | #22
Quote: Originally Posted by Audoucet View Post
Not necessarily. In the first seasons of Rebels, the hero unknowingly uses the Dark Side more and more, for very good reasons. In the last episode, he starts to become crazy, and it seems that the third season will be about that.

Just like hell, the dark side is paved with good intentions.You don't need to be evil to use the dark side, just like you don't need to be an addict, to use drugs, it comes after.
I wouldn't know since I'm avoiding the new Disney canon like it's the plague, but the good old Expanded Universe had characters like Mara Jade, who most likely used the dark side, but never went nuts.
There is a face beneath this mask but it's not me.
Darth Malgus - And some alts on Satele Shan and Star Forge - The Firslay Legacy
referral link http://www.swtor.com/r/J24zRp

DeltaBos's Avatar


DeltaBos
05.06.2016 , 02:05 PM | #23
Quote: Originally Posted by Seireeni View Post
I wouldn't know since I'm avoiding the new Disney canon like it's the plague, but the good old Expanded Universe had characters like Mara Jade, who most likely used the dark side, but never went nuts.
*internet high five*

EU is my cannon, anything else is just an alternate timeline as far as I'm concerned.
Query: Is there someone that you need killed master?

Audoucet's Avatar


Audoucet
05.06.2016 , 03:17 PM | #24
Quote: Originally Posted by Seireeni View Post
I wouldn't know since I'm avoiding the new Disney canon like it's the plague, but the good old Expanded Universe had characters like Mara Jade, who most likely used the dark side, but never went nuts.
I wouldn't say most likely. She wasn't a Sith, but a tool. It is totally thinkable that he didn't make her use the dark side, especially since she seems to be described as a "cold" killer, which brings us to your point that a "light side" user could be considered before. She would have been probably way more loyal and easy to control than a dark side user. And even if she did use the dark side, she probably never needed to rely on the force a lot, she wasn't fighting force users.

DeltaBos's Avatar


DeltaBos
05.06.2016 , 03:46 PM | #25
Quote: Originally Posted by TheAresian View Post
So my question is: Does the game treat light and dark as static for purposes of convenience or is there some lore out there that more clearly defines the force as a whole with Jedi and Sith being the names applied to marginalized ideologies subject to change? (I know the prequel shows Anakin as Jedi falling to Sith which implies Jedi and Sith are just philosophies. Also, I long ago gave up trying to figure out what the game was trying to do with Revan as a character. )
Going back to this just to make sure the question is clearly answered, Jedi and Sith are names applied to two different ideologies, but both make the incorrect assumption that the force has "sides." Light and Dark are exclusively labels applied to different techniques of using the force. Individuals who claim to use the "Light side" simply use the force with a clear and serene mind, they approach the force as a companion, etc., we've all heard the speeches. The "Dark side" supplements the use of the force with emotions, and most people who use the force that way act out of selfish desires.

That being said, the point needs to be stated very clearly. These are just labels that individuals who wield the force put on it. The force itself does not have any sides, it is a conscious entity present throughout the universe. It has a will, but it does not actively support any people who wield it except in extreme purposes (such as Darth Plagueis and Sidious attempting to pervert it, and the force reacted with the creation of Anakin Skywalker.) The ultimate goal of the force is for there to be a universal harmony in the galaxy, but an all the different ideologies of force users sort of makes this difficult to achieve. There needs to be a balance between: life and death, and those whose nature is to be selfless, and those whose nature is to be selfish. Essentially, the goal or will of the force is for there to be a sort of yin/yang thing going in in the galaxy, but those who can use the force tend to just screw up the balance somehow.
Query: Is there someone that you need killed master?

Seireeni's Avatar


Seireeni
05.06.2016 , 04:03 PM | #26
Quote: Originally Posted by Audoucet View Post
I wouldn't say most likely. She wasn't a Sith, but a tool. It is totally thinkable that he didn't make her use the dark side, especially since she seems to be described as a "cold" killer, which brings us to your point that a "light side" user could be considered before. She would have been probably way more loyal and easy to control than a dark side user. And even if she did use the dark side, she probably never needed to rely on the force a lot, she wasn't fighting force users.
Oh, I doubt Palpatine actually forced her to use the dark side, but he probably didn't teach her to use the light side, either. She would have had to teach herself to do that after being taught to use the dark side, but why would she? She was taught by a dark side user, admired said dark side user and seemed to use the Force as a tool and not really consider the philosophical points of it, so it would make sense she would use the dark side, since that tends to be easier to use. And, as far as I know, she's widely considered a dark jedi, which would require her to use the dark side even though she was never sith. Yet she never went nuts.
There is a face beneath this mask but it's not me.
Darth Malgus - And some alts on Satele Shan and Star Forge - The Firslay Legacy
referral link http://www.swtor.com/r/J24zRp

Aeneas_Falco's Avatar


Aeneas_Falco
05.06.2016 , 04:21 PM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by Analyst View Post
Interesting enough, you often do not even need these emotions. Many Sith in-game do not really show great anger, unless they follow the example of movieBanner and are simply always angry inside.
Lord Goh from the Assault on Tython Flashpoint (Rep) is an example of that. One of the dialogue options for Jedi mentions that they sense no anger in him.

Audoucet's Avatar


Audoucet
05.06.2016 , 04:35 PM | #28
Quote: Originally Posted by Aeneas_Falco View Post
Lord Goh from the Assault on Tython Flashpoint (Rep) is an example of that. One of the dialogue options for Jedi mentions that they sense no anger in him.
As I said, SWTOR doesn't care about that. You can be a full dark Jedi sociopath, and still get a sit as a master on the council.

Audoucet's Avatar


Audoucet
05.06.2016 , 04:43 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by Seireeni View Post
Oh, I doubt Palpatine actually forced her to use the dark side, but he probably didn't teach her to use the light side, either. She would have had to teach herself to do that after being taught to use the dark side, but why would she? She was taught by a dark side user, admired said dark side user and seemed to use the Force as a tool and not really consider the philosophical points of it, so it would make sense she would use the dark side, since that tends to be easier to use. And, as far as I know, she's widely considered a dark jedi, which would require her to use the dark side even though she was never sith. Yet she never went nuts.
I never said that you become crazy immediately. As I said, she probably never used the force A LOT.

Seireeni's Avatar


Seireeni
05.06.2016 , 04:59 PM | #30
Quote: Originally Posted by Audoucet View Post
I never said that you become crazy immediately. As I said, she probably never used the force A LOT.
It's been a couple of years, but I recall her using the Force several times during Allegiance and Choices of One alone. Not to mention that all the Force users seem to have at least a subconcious connection to the Force at all times (since they are able to feel the danger in the Force if someone is i.e. about to shoot at them), so one could argue that a dark side user is, in fact, connected to the dark side all the time.

She didn't want to gather more and more power, though, only maintain the amount needed to get the job done, so one could also argue that it's not the dark side, but the lust for more power that drives people crazy. After all, you channel emotions to use the dark side, so you'd need more and stronger emotions to get more powerful, and having loads of strong emotions could also make you go crazy, no Force needed.
There is a face beneath this mask but it's not me.
Darth Malgus - And some alts on Satele Shan and Star Forge - The Firslay Legacy
referral link http://www.swtor.com/r/J24zRp