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Slicing Nerf & Future Game Design

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Crew Skills
Slicing Nerf & Future Game Design

Drewser's Avatar


Drewser
12.26.2011 , 12:47 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Androvis View Post
There was a twitter feed confirming that the issue with slicing "had been taken care of". Someone with more time on their hands can dig it up. They definitely reduced the number of Rich and Bountiful class 4 and 5 yields.
It is still easy to clean up with slicing. BTW, the 4 and 5's were never the most profitable when you factor in time.

Repefe's Avatar


Repefe
12.26.2011 , 01:09 PM | #12
I atill make money ... not sure what was nerfed.
Killer: 53%, Socializer: 53%, Achiever: 47%, Explorer: 47%

drakeborn's Avatar


drakeborn
12.26.2011 , 01:23 PM | #13
No nerf here.

Unaki's Avatar


Unaki
12.26.2011 , 01:51 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by Androvis View Post
There was a twitter feed confirming that the issue with slicing "had been taken care of". Someone with more time on their hands can dig it up. They definitely reduced the number of Rich and Bountiful class 4 and 5 yields.
If you are going to say it was nerfed, don't post useless garbage without proof no matter how lazy you are. There is only one official twitter that even matters with this game and its the official one, where there was NO MENTION OF SLICING.
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Viera's Avatar


Viera
12.26.2011 , 01:55 PM | #15
I do not support a 'nerf' because of the following.

Quote: Originally Posted by Freeborne View Post
I'd like to take a moment to talk about how slicing in its current form helps SWTORs economy, and why I think many are over reacting. SWTOR is a game of fixed rates. By which I mean the following cost/profits never change:

1. Character skill training
2. Crew Skill Missions Cost (The money you pay to send crew on missions)
3. Crew Skill Missions Return (The money you get from slicing)
4. Mount Training
5. Mount Cost (high end CE costs *a lot* of money.)

This means that Slicing has a fixed ceiling on profit. 10 months from now, I will be able to make just as many direct credits from slicing as I can today. For arguments sake, lets say I can make 5000 credits an hour max using slicing. (Not the real number, just makes the math easier)

There is only 1 area in which prices can inflate, and deflate:

1. The Galactic Trade Network: where we can sell our crafted/discovered goods.

Today a stack of Silica may sell for 500 credits. In four months time that stack of silica may sell for as much as a 10,000 credits. (An over simplified, and extreme example, to be sure.)

That means, as a slicer, today I can buy a lot of silica. In four months, I could only buy a stack after two hours of missions.

Here's the rub though: The Underworld Trader got that silica through a Crew Skill Mission at a fixed cost--it will never change. (Let's say 100 credits, I can't recall the exact cost of an UT mission right now.) Today, or 4 months from now it costs him the same amount of credits to acquire the raw goods, but he's selling it for 9500 more credits at stack. That's not inflation, that is profit induced by fixed-rate game mechanics. That is profit a player NEEDs to further their own crew skills, buy mounts, and train combat abilities.


Now, "Freeborne," you might say, "What about slicing nodes in the wild? Can't Slicers really boost their income with those?"

And I'd say, "Poster, I'm glad you asked!"

The answer is yes, and no. A slicer may find wild nodes, and shoot up his/her credit per/hour income. However, any of the other harvesting crew skills may do the same thing, and sell their goods on the GTN. And even if the Slicer *is* making more credits per hour, it just translates into more money they can spend on the GTN.


"But Freeborne," you could ask next, "What about players who only BUY things from the GTN, and don't sell on it. Won't they suffer from this Inflation?"

And I'd say, "Yes. Those players aren't participating in an MMO economy. They're driving by it and they're doing their own thing (which is certainly their right), but the thing is:"

If a player isn't taking a mission skill that returns marketable goods (Diplomacy, maybe? Can't tell you how well the "companion gift" market will do. But you can't sell the LS/DS points you get.), and is only depending on income from quests/mobs in the game, they are in for a World of Hurt--even if we removed Slicing from the game. You need to bring either disposable income, or desired goods to the market. The games current credit return from questing barely covers your combat skill training + mount training.

What does this tell us? Slicing *needs* to exist, otherwise people won't have have the disposable income required to purchase off the GTN.

If you have a clear, and academic, argument as to why slicing is "bad" for the economy, please post it in response and I'd be happy to debate it with you.
"I was a historian once, gathering the relics of the Jedi, learning the ancient mysteries. Always, there were more questions."

Samboni's Avatar


Samboni
12.26.2011 , 02:00 PM | #16
Can someone dig up that tweet, please? Until then, this is all unfounded.

DustomaticGXC's Avatar


DustomaticGXC
12.26.2011 , 03:16 PM | #17
Slicing was nerfed? I can't tell a difference.
Don't act like you didn't see this coming.

Mccluggen's Avatar


Mccluggen
12.26.2011 , 03:46 PM | #18
I can tell a difference, it has been changed. Slicing is still profitable once you can have 3+ crew out, but they force you to wade through a larger percentage of moderate missions to get to the bountiful and rich missions now.

In my experience it is still a useful skill, just not auto-win. I am, however, concerned if Bioware caved to forum qq. The folks who take the time to ***** on the forums are usually just a very vocal minority. Keeping slicing the way it was for another month or so would have really helped to energize the economy.

As it is now the AH UI is so clunky, the cost to list so high, and the number of people with money to burn so low, that very little business (comparatively) is being done on the AH.

RadjezZ's Avatar


RadjezZ
12.26.2011 , 03:54 PM | #19
Since i got kinda curious about slicing i dropped a gathering skill and took slicing.

This are the results.

I had armstech, scavenging and investigation.

for example, i made 20k a day with that.

I dropped investigation and even though i have to buy the stuff i normally got with investigation i now make 40k a day.

So u people can make up the rest and draw conclusions.

Drewser's Avatar


Drewser
12.26.2011 , 03:56 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Mccluggen View Post
I can tell a difference, it has been changed. Slicing is still profitable once you can have 3+ crew out, but they force you to wade through a larger percentage of moderate missions to get to the bountiful and rich missions now.

In my experience it is still a useful skill, just not auto-win. I am, however, concerned if Bioware caved to forum qq. The folks who take the time to ***** on the forums are usually just a very vocal minority. Keeping slicing the way it was for another month or so would have really helped to energize the economy.

As it is now the AH UI is so clunky, the cost to list so high, and the number of people with money to burn so low, that very little business (comparatively) is being done on the AH.
You should never have to run a moderate mission once you get a full set of missions for level 2.