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Resource Exhaustion is bad system

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Galactic Strongholds
Resource Exhaustion is bad system

Muljo_Stpho's Avatar


Muljo_Stpho
09.22.2014 , 08:49 PM | #21
Ugh. It's how many hours since my previous post? I've left the unclickable nodes alone (instead of just picking them up to place them down again) to see if they'll ever sort themselves out and, thanks to this phantom guest that the system apparently thinks has been in my stronghold all day, every single node that I harvested from last night is STILL unclickable right now. (edit: about 10 hours since my previous post / 14-15 hours since I harvested these nodes)

Starlite_Chobo's Avatar


Starlite_Chobo
09.22.2014 , 11:05 PM | #22
I'm having the same issue of persistent non-clickable nodes. I haven't checked if I too have a phantom guest. I'd say this has been going on for about 24 hours now, so about the same as you.

CAMELOTCRUSADE's Avatar


CAMELOTCRUSADE
10.06.2014 , 03:01 PM | #23
Not sure if this has been brought up yet, but I have found another "bad system" aspect. If you're in a group with a buddy and you're both in the stronghold, it makes you roll for the drop if one of your harvests - but you BOTH get the debuff. The first time this happened we both declined and were going to drop group and do it individually. The result? We both got the exhaustion debuff and the resource vanished. Stupid, stupid, stupid...

Don't make us roll for them in a group and for Pete's sake, don't apply the debuff to people who are minding their own business when a group member tries to use a node!

Edit: Also, if you're scanning the item and you're interrupted, you can still get the debuff and NO resource. At least tie it to whether or not you get anything if you must keep it.

Muljo_Stpho's Avatar


Muljo_Stpho
10.06.2014 , 10:41 PM | #24
I hadn't noticed the shared exhaustion application happening with it but I have also seen it rolling for resources when a friend was grouped with me and harvested from nodes in my stronghold. With or without that spreading exhaustion like a pvp flag (err, I mean plague) though, I agree that it's extremely silly to put that up for a roll.

On a similar note though, going back before the introduction of strongholds I have noticed some odd behavior with slicing nodes out in the wild when myself and another group member both had slicing. It did not make us roll for the credit boxes but it did have them on a group loot bind timer and warn upon opening them that it wouldn't be possible to trade the items to other players after using them.

thewatcheruatu's Avatar


thewatcheruatu
10.08.2014 , 09:14 AM | #25
They definitely erred on the side of waaaay too conservative with these utility resources. It only starts to become a productive use of your time if you've got, say, 16 characters, at which point you can spend 20 minutes cycling through them to earn maybe...100k (average # harvests = 1.5, average harvest amount = 3, good sell price = 1500/unit). That's not bad. Not fun, though I suppose some would say it's at least as fun as running dailies, and probably slightly more profitable per time spent. But selling is a hassle owing to getting undercut, and a lot of the prices on the GTN are kind of fictional when you actually try to realize them as a seller.

The truth is, the materials market could actually use more inflow. I know it would suck a little for people who make their income this way, but as it is, the inflow on some items is still too low, meaning that prices are wildly erratic from day to day, meaning that it's very difficult to work out proper profit margins on crafted items. These stronghold utility items could have been a good way to give a necessary boost to the supply-side (think EVE Online, where basic materials prices barely waver and the player economy is very strong and stable), but as they are, they're mostly just nice as decorations at the moment.

My suggestion would be to decrease the debuff to about 2 hours (so you can use them twice in a casual player's gameplay window) and probably decrease the debuff chance, because right now, I can go through a roster of 8 characters and very commonly get exactly 8 harvests. It's pretty rare to get more than 1 harvest per character, actually. I was pretty generous above when I said it was 1.5 per character. Probably more like 1.25.
Project Broken Compass | Hapan Delegation

Muljo_Stpho's Avatar


Muljo_Stpho
10.08.2014 , 09:46 PM | #26
20 minutes? If only. It seems to take at least an hour to cycle through my 18 characters for this. It would be nice to be able to cycle through them all and get back to doing something else that quickly. They can produce a stack of 70-90 of a material (depends on how many get allowed 4-6 harvests instead of the usual 1-2 harvests) on each cycle like that though.

I don't typically do this to sell. I stockpile for my own crafting. It's a nice boost if I'm in short supply (compared to other stockpiled materials) of something specific though.

But about that comment about a run like this being worth 100k (give or take depending on exact yield and exact going rate for them on the GTN), I guess compare that with any max level character being able to run Black Hole, Section X, Oricon, etc. in about an hour per dailies area and pulling in roughly 100k for that hour of dailies. Run four dailies areas on one character or the same dailies area on four characters and that's around 400k in the time it will take to run out the timer on your legacy's exhaustion buffs. (And the characters running the dailies could scavenge some grade 6 / grade 9 stuff along the way on top of that.) I'm pretty sure dailies still have the edge there.

Even if someone can cycle through 16+ characters in less than half the time it always seems to take me to cycle through mine, they're still locked out of getting more than that out of the nodes for 4 hours. Your productivity for stronghold gathering is capped for that 4 hour window between when the first character in line harvests something until their exhaustion wears off.

thewatcheruatu's Avatar


thewatcheruatu
10.09.2014 , 07:24 AM | #27
Quote: Originally Posted by Muljo_Stpho View Post
20 minutes? If only.
That was just a guess. I've only got 8 characters, and I've never timed it. But figured about 15 seconds for switching characters, 15 seconds to put down and later pick up the utility decoration you're harvesting, 15 seconds per harvest, and you typically get 1 harvest (I've never gotten more than 4, so that would be a full minute of harvesting in a very rare case). So if you're being completely efficient, and you're standing right next to your legacy storage, so you can put stuff in as you're harvesting, you can probably average about a minute per character. But I tossed a little extra time just to be more realistic.

If I'm being honest, I don't know why it would take you an hour to cycle through 18 characters unless all of your characters are improbably lucky!

[Edit: Did it this morning--took me 9 minutes to harvest on 8 characters. I think I got about 14 harvests (got really lucky on one character). So figure average of (being generous) 4 materials per harvest = 56 materials, sell for, let's say, 1000 each, you can make 56k in less than 10 minutes (with some good luck). So...that's not bad, to be sure. Comparable to plowing through CZ-198 with a well-geared level 55 character.]

Quote: Originally Posted by Muljo_Stpho View Post
But about that comment about a run like this being worth 100k (give or take depending on exact yield and exact going rate for them on the GTN), I guess compare that with any max level character being able to run Black Hole, Section X, Oricon, etc. in about an hour per dailies area and pulling in roughly 100k for that hour of dailies. Run four dailies areas on one character or the same dailies area on four characters and that's around 400k in the time it will take to run out the timer on your legacy's exhaustion buffs. (And the characters running the dailies could scavenge some grade 6 / grade 9 stuff along the way on top of that.) I'm pretty sure dailies still have the edge there.
Yeah, maybe. Unless you really hate running dailies.

I'm comparing it with running, say, CZ-198 and Black Hole, which would take me about 25-30 minutes and probably earn me about...well...100k once all junk and loot is sold and mission rewards are claimed. Probably slightly more profitable, and certainly less of a hassle than trying to sell on the GTN. Plus, I'm getting reputation in some cases, and commendations, which can be turned into credits if you want to.

I agree that it's probably a better use of your time if you're just doing it for your own stockpile and what you're harvesting isn't something that has a lot of supply on the GTN (otherwise, you'd just run dailies and buy what you want and pocket the remaining credits, right?). E.g., I've used the color crystal utility decorations for this purpose. Much better than running the color crystal missions or buying on GTN, where supply and prices are super-erratic.
Project Broken Compass | Hapan Delegation

TheWookiee's Avatar


TheWookiee
10.14.2014 , 09:50 AM | #28
I think you should be guaranteed multiple pulls if you have max level in that harvesting skill (450 archaeology should be able to get 3 or 4 pulls per arch node).

Also, the resource cool down is completely pointless with the exhaustion debuff when you can just pick up the node and re-drop it to reset it.

on a side note, has anyone gotten more than 8 pulls on a node? I have gotten to 8 twice so far, but never higher.

Muljo_Stpho's Avatar


Muljo_Stpho
10.15.2014 , 11:40 PM | #29
Quote: Originally Posted by TheWookiee View Post
I think you should be guaranteed multiple pulls if you have max level in that harvesting skill (450 archaeology should be able to get 3 or 4 pulls per arch node).

Also, the resource cool down is completely pointless with the exhaustion debuff when you can just pick up the node and re-drop it to reset it.

on a side note, has anyone gotten more than 8 pulls on a node? I have gotten to 8 twice so far, but never higher.
You would think so, wouldn't you? It doesn't seem like that has been the case for me though. Whether I get 1-2 pulls or 5-7 pulls seems to be completely independent of whether a character has the correct skill and whether that skill is 100 or 300 or 450 or whatever.

And I'll say again that I am absolutely certain now that there's no such thing as an internal cooldown on specific nodes. It's a bug caused by relogging into the same stronghold without logging into and loading in from somewhere else first each time. I have seen it happen every time I have had characters left logged out in the same stronghold and cycled through them to harvest nodes. It also happens when a friend who has keys on several characters is hanging around in there while I cycle through characters to harvest nodes, but aside from that I have never noticed a node become unclickable when characters were not left logged out in the same stronghold. When a node does bug out though, it is true that you can just pick it up and place it back down again to reset it.

MotorCityMan's Avatar


MotorCityMan
10.20.2014 , 12:37 AM | #30
Crafting nodes is a great idea. But I concur with the OP in that a blanket 4 hour CD for all conquest crafting nodes is overkill. 60-90 mins seems more reasonable.