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Kaggath Battlegrounds Heats - Republic Reborn vs Wroshyr Alliance

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > STAR WARS Discussion
Kaggath Battlegrounds Heats - Republic Reborn vs Wroshyr Alliance

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
07.28.2014 , 01:01 PM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Aurbere View Post
This is actually a fairly balanced match-up. I'm not sure who would win.

To Tune: I wouldn't give up so easily. This is a really good faction you've got here.
How could Tune even think he can't win this. It is so close I'm still deciding who to argue for.

I like Tune's faction more right now because I know more about them, so he'll have me doing a lot of debating in his favor for now at least...
I know if you look deep into your heart- which is currently all over that tree- you'll find a way to forgive me.

Aww, geez you look like a puppy! A blonde, eviscerated puppy!

-Alucard

Aurbere's Avatar


Aurbere
07.28.2014 , 01:07 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
How could Tune even think he can't win this. It is so close I'm still deciding who to argue for.

I like Tune's faction more right now because I know more about them, so he'll have me doing a lot of debating in his favor for now at least...
I feel the same. It's a really close one. I know more about Sel's faction, so I'll probably argue for her where I feel it's necessary.
Added Chapter 66 to The Shadows Fall
"Your only hope to survive is to give in to the rage boiling within you, to acknowledge the Dark Side you deny, and tap into it!"--Darth Tyranus

LadyKulvax's Avatar


LadyKulvax
07.28.2014 , 01:19 PM | #13
I will be back tomorrow (my time) and will judge from then on.
I am the Battlemaster of the Jedi Order. I've struck you down once already. Today, I'm finishing the job.
Jedi Order

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
07.28.2014 , 01:25 PM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
The RR sacrificed too much firepower and got too little of a reward in fighter numbers for its trouble imo. The WA's Hapan Battle Dragons and Majestic-class ships will wreck the Interdictors and the Hammerheads won't stand a chance in a direct fight. Each of the WA's capital ships outguns its analog on the other side and outnumbers them (except the Battle Dragon which still easily outguns its rival) as well. I give a bigger edge to the WA here for having ships with bigger guns.
I'm going to have to majorly disagree with this part, for a few reasons.
The Hammerhead was the epitome of Republic Engineering, it could take on much larger vessels in a one on one scenario. It's blasters were oriented in such a way that they could create a cross of fire, which was likely the inspiration for the MC140 Scythe-Class. This allowed the Hammherhead to obliterate one single spot anywhere it chose, concentrating it's weapons to punch through any shielding or hull.

The Drawback of the Hammerhead was it's difficulty to actually organize itself into a valid fleet, so whilst it took any ship in a One on One, it had large issues being used as a command ship, however this is entirely eradicated by the use of the other cruisers, particularly the Alliance, as a command cruiser.

Now, another advantage of the Hammerheads is their relatively slim posture and target. The Battle Dragons skimped on the Targeting computers, and were only effective En Masse, which they are not here. They also do not have a wide target to hit like in most fleet battles, and concentrated shielding on the front of the vessel would likely negate a lot of enemy fire.

Thank you though for noting the large role the Alliance will play in this battle, I feel the cruiser could rip through any of the WA's battleships without even breaking a sweat.
We all live or die as Krayt wills, Stryfe. At his word, I would cut out my own heart. Or yours.
Celéna Mercenary Cathinka Seeliara Sage

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
07.28.2014 , 01:26 PM | #15
Does somebody more versed than I wish to make a note about tacticians and defections? Not of course that none of the command staff would defect from the Republic Reborn, so it's if anyone from the WA would defect.

I'll make my argument for the NJO Knights later.
We all live or die as Krayt wills, Stryfe. At his word, I would cut out my own heart. Or yours.
Celéna Mercenary Cathinka Seeliara Sage

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
07.28.2014 , 01:38 PM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Selenial View Post
I'm going to have to majorly disagree with this part, for a few reasons.
The Hammerhead was the epitome of Republic Engineering, it could take on much larger vessels in a one on one scenario. It's blasters were oriented in such a way that they could create a cross of fire, which was likely the inspiration for the MC140 Scythe-Class. This allowed the Hammherhead to obliterate one single spot anywhere it chose, concentrating it's weapons to punch through any shielding or hull.

The Drawback of the Hammerhead was it's difficulty to actually organize itself into a valid fleet, so whilst it took any ship in a One on One, it had large issues being used as a command ship, however this is entirely eradicated by the use of the other cruisers, particularly the Alliance, as a command cruiser.

Now, another advantage of the Hammerheads is their relatively slim posture and target. The Battle Dragons skimped on the Targeting computers, and were only effective En Masse, which they are not here. They also do not have a wide target to hit like in most fleet battles, and concentrated shielding on the front of the vessel would likely negate a lot of enemy fire.

Thank you though for noting the large role the Alliance will play in this battle, I feel the cruiser could rip through any of the WA's battleships without even breaking a sweat.
Ok, you're kidding me about the Hammerheads. I want to see an engagement were a Hammerhead took on a much larger ship alone and won.

It was small, maneuverable, and mass-produced and THAT was its advantage. Here, they aren't en-mass and they are vastly outgunned. There is absolutely no way in hell a ship with 7 or so turbolasers could come close to matching the 40+ (on top of torpedo launchers) of a Battle Dragon.

Now I agree that it has advantages like the crossfire, and that they'll serve well against fighters, but against capital ships here they just won't pull their weight.

Also the Battle Dragons do have big targets, like the Interdictor-class and the Alliance, but they don't even need them because a few well-placed proton torpedoes can penetrate Hammerhead shields (it has been done by weaker missiles) and blast them to pieces.

Also, the Battle Dragons can decimate single targets, thanks to having those four computers they can concentrate fire better. Considering they are nearly equal in number to the Hammerheads, they can easily survive the pathetic firepower of the Hammerhead long enough to dispatch them 3-4 at a time.

As for the Alliance, yes you're right. But if the WA can strip away the RR's other ships first, it is extremely exposed. The WA has ships with excellent shielding and firepower. They won't all get ripped apart as easily as you might think.
I know if you look deep into your heart- which is currently all over that tree- you'll find a way to forgive me.

Aww, geez you look like a puppy! A blonde, eviscerated puppy!

-Alucard

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
07.28.2014 , 01:41 PM | #17
The Republic Reborn


So yeh, time for a 2256 word essay on two of my leadership characters. I don't expect anyone to read this all unless they are having a hard time recalling a lot about the characters, I just had to compile a solid base of arguments to use in favor of them, as the entire faction is really built around them.


Meetra Surik
"...and where they look at you and see the death of the Force, I look at you and see hope for all life."
Leadership and Personality:

Spoiler


Notable Accolades and Feats
Spoiler


Revan
"Savior, conqueror, hero, villain. You are all things Revan… and yet you are nothing. In the end you belong to neither the light nor the darkness. You will forever stand alone."

Leadership and Personality
Spoiler


Notable Powers and Abiltiies
Spoiler
We all live or die as Krayt wills, Stryfe. At his word, I would cut out my own heart. Or yours.
Celéna Mercenary Cathinka Seeliara Sage

StarSquirrel's Avatar


StarSquirrel
07.28.2014 , 01:42 PM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Selenial View Post
Does somebody more versed than I wish to make a note about tacticians and defections? Not of course that none of the command staff would defect from the Republic Reborn, so it's if anyone from the WA would defect.

I'll make my argument for the NJO Knights later.
Antilles is the only person I can see who might defect. He'd chafe a bit under the more brutal and aggressive leaders he works with (Revan in particular) and some of his best friends are on the other side (Corran, Chewie, Dodonna). The WA's entire faction is tailor made to make Antilles feel right at home.

Something to consider.
I know if you look deep into your heart- which is currently all over that tree- you'll find a way to forgive me.

Aww, geez you look like a puppy! A blonde, eviscerated puppy!

-Alucard

Silenceo's Avatar


Silenceo
07.28.2014 , 01:43 PM | #19
Quote: Originally Posted by Selenial View Post
Does somebody more versed than I wish to make a note about tacticians and defections? Not of course that none of the command staff would defect from the Republic Reborn, so it's if anyone from the WA would defect.

I'll make my argument for the NJO Knights later.
Actually, the more I look at it, the more I consider that Wedge might defect... I mean yeah, the RR has rebel troops, but so does the WA, not to mention that he has history with practically every WA leader. Corran Horn especially.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Wedge defected, and brought the rebel troops with him. The RR is trying to resurrect what had eventually turned into the Galactic Empire, and the WA fits a lot better ideal wise with what he is used to.

It is also good to note that Wedge might not feel comfortable serving under someone who was once a Sith Lord, redeemed or not. He once fought a rebellion to free the galaxy of Sith rule, and he just might buy that Revan is fully redeemed. This might turn the war a bit, due to the repercussions.

However, I will also note that even if he did defect, the RR flagship would still pose quite an issue. (though, I thought the Universal Tech Rule would make it more or less what a Mk II is to a MK I when comparing to ships that compared to MK II's. Aka, the next step up, approximately 20% stronger.)
"What I unveil today will mark a new era for the Empire. We will be able to decimate the Rebels just as we did the Jedi Knights. At last the Emperor's war will be filled only with the glory and beauty of decisive victory."―Rom Mohc Never force a droid to think without numbers...

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
07.28.2014 , 01:51 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by StarSquirrel View Post
Ok, you're kidding me about the Hammerheads. I want to see an engagement were a Hammerhead took on a much larger ship alone and won.

It was small, maneuverable, and mass-produced and THAT was its advantage. Here, they aren't en-mass and they are vastly outgunned. There is absolutely no way in hell a ship with 7 or so turbolasers could come close to matching the 40+ (on top of torpedo launchers) of a Battle Dragon.

Now I agree that it has advantages like the crossfire, and that they'll serve well against fighters, but against capital ships here they just won't pull their weight.

Also the Battle Dragons do have big targets, like the Interdictor-class and the Alliance, but they don't even need them because a few well-placed proton torpedoes can penetrate Hammerhead shields (it has been done by weaker missiles) and blast them to pieces.

Also, the Battle Dragons can decimate single targets, thanks to having those four computers they can concentrate fire better. Considering they are nearly equal in number to the Hammerheads, they can easily survive the pathetic firepower of the Hammerhead long enough to dispatch them 3-4 at a time.

As for the Alliance, yes you're right. But if the WA can strip away the RR's other ships first, it is extremely exposed. The WA has ships with excellent shielding and firepower. They won't all get ripped apart as easily as you might think.
You uhh... You need to check your sources Star, stop using Wookieepedia... It sucks.

"Nearly too large for frigate classification, the 315 meter long Hammerhead-Class cruiser is more than a match for Capital Ships of it's time. [...] Success comes at a cost however, [Goes on to talk about the Data stuff I already mentioned]"

And 7 turbolasers? Again, I'd suggest No Wookieepedia if that's where you're getting it from. 4 Light Laser batteries, 2 Medium batteries, and 2 point defense... then a tractor beam.

So yeh, if we're using the breakdown on the Gladiator Vessel that Wookieepedia uses from the sourcebook, that's 20 individual light turbolasers, 10 Medium Turbolasers, 10 Point Defense Laser Canons, and 2 Tractor Beams... Which is actually a slight rework to the armament of the Gladiator Vessel itself, replacing Concussion Missiles with more turbolasers.

As for the shielding, that's because of the actual Strength of the Shielding that the Galaxy had at that point every ship could get torn apart by missiles. Using the Universal Tech rule, this flaw is greatly evened out.
We all live or die as Krayt wills, Stryfe. At his word, I would cut out my own heart. Or yours.
Celéna Mercenary Cathinka Seeliara Sage