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TDM much improved by removal of capital ship turrets

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Galactic Starfighter
TDM much improved by removal of capital ship turrets

Gerfaut's Avatar


Gerfaut
02.26.2014 , 07:35 PM | #1
Ever since 2.6 came out, I've hated TDM games. They always devolved into one side sitting at their spawn on gunships, protected by their capital ship turrets, out of reach of enemy scouts and strike fighters. The only people on the opposing team who could do anything were other gunships. You would see games where one team had 7 out of 8 people flying gunships, never leaving their capital ship, and the players on the opposing team were forced to switch to gunships also as a result.

I hate playing gunships, and these games were excruciatingly boring and frustrating while playing a strike fighter or scout. I had to keep track of when I hit another ship, and when the timer got close to one minute, make a suicide run on one of the ships sitting at the capital ship, to try and hit it and barrel-roll away before getting blown to bits by turrets and/or enemy gunships. Otherwise I would get marked as inactive, for lack of a reachable target, and lose the few reqs I earned for the game. Most of the time, I would get killed as a result, respawning at the opposite end of the map, taking forever to get back to the action, only to have nothing to do for the next minute as all the enemy ships were sitting out of reach.

Having a safe zone in a TDM game just flat out does not work. It would be like having artillery in ground pvp arenas, so that the team who is losing can go sit next to it, out of reach of the other team who would risk getting blown up if they go anywhere close. It just breaks that type of game mode.

Last night, everything changed. As a result of the loss of turrets, the enemy team was not able to hide at their capital ship on gunships anymore. The action spread out all over the map. There was finally dog-fighting! All types of ships had a role to play, not just gunships. A previously mind-numbingly boring game mode turned into a wonderfully dynamic mix of wild dog-fighting and high-speed chases through deep canyons (I really love that map now), stalking bombers through narrow passages while trying to disarm their traps, using terrain to ambush gunships or risk getting ambushed by them, etc... It was so much fun!

The good gunship pilots were still at the top of the scoreboard, but the bad ones were getting slaughtered with no safe zone to run to. I must admit I greatly enjoyed blowing those "deer-in-the-headlight" gunships out of the sky in my strike fighter. Playing a gunship now requires some skill, imagine that! By the end of the night, the balance in ship composition was much better, with a lot of dogfighters and maybe 2-3 gunships and 1-2 bombers per side, in a 12 v 12 game, instead of having more than half of each team in gunships like before the patch.

This was the most fun I'd had since 2.6 came out. This is what TDM should be. Camping was always dictated by the people huddling at their cap ship, not by their opponents, who were forced to go where their targets were, since the whole point of TDM is to kill enemy players.

The addition of a middle spawn point improved things in various ways, making the situation more unpredictable and also allowing players who got killed to return to the fight faster by using the middle spawn point, instead of being exiled to a far corner of the map at respawn.

So I wanted to say a big THANK YOU to the dev team for removing capital ship turrets from TDM and adding the middle spawn point. And I also want to express my appreciation for whoever designed the Kuat Mesa TDM map. It is absolutely awesome for dogfighting, now that the fight is actually occurring in those canyons instead of at a cap ship.

LegoUniverseBC's Avatar


LegoUniverseBC
02.26.2014 , 07:43 PM | #2
You're kidding right? The fights are at the capital ships now.
I don't know what server you're playing on...

Gerfaut's Avatar


Gerfaut
02.26.2014 , 09:35 PM | #3
I play on the Harbinger, both on Pub and Imp sides. I played 11 games last night, most of them TDM, and only the first one had any kind of spawn camping going on, simply because the enemy team insisted on staying at their spawn or running back to it, so my team had to go there in order to get kills. It didn't make any sense for them to behave that way since there is a lot more cover away from the capital ships than around them, but maybe they hadn't read the patch notes and thought the turrets would still protect them...

As I said before, spawn camping is caused by the team staying at their spawn (or running back to their spawn to avoid being killed), not by the other team. Except for that one game where players were acting irrationally, the removal of turrets caused players from both teams to leave their capital ship after spawning, since there was no advantage in staying there. As a result, spawn camping did not happen. The fight naturally spread out all over the map and it was a lot of fun, with more dogfighting than I'd ever seen in TDM before.

The capital ship turrets providing a refuge were causing the spawn camping. Without turrets, there is almost no spawn camping going on because there is no reason for a team to stay at their spawn, and there is no reason for the other team to go to their enemy's spawn when the fighting is going on all over the map. Also, there are 3 different spawns and when an enemy dies, you can't predict which of the 3 spawns he is going to use, so fighting near the center of the map is more optimal than waiting near one of the spawn points.

Deimos_Olympian's Avatar


Deimos_Olympian
02.26.2014 , 09:47 PM | #4
No way have TDM been improved it has been ruined... spawncamping

ShadowsNIte's Avatar


ShadowsNIte
02.26.2014 , 09:58 PM | #5
Dropped a Rail sentry behind the spawn point in a match late last night. Fellow drone carrier did the same. Just sat back and watched, wondering when they would switch to the other spawn points. Didn't happen, they pretty much got melted before they could barrel roll away. Not really my idea of an improvement.
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Deimos_Olympian's Avatar


Deimos_Olympian
02.26.2014 , 10:02 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by ShadowsNIte View Post
Dropped a Rail sentry behind the spawn point in a match late last night. Fellow drone carrier did the same. Just sat back and watched, wondering when they would switch to the other spawn points. Didn't happen, they pretty much got melted before they could barrel roll away. Not really my idea of an improvement.

I completely agree with you spawn camping doesn't require any skill or improves dog-fighting like so many spawn campers claim so they can get easy victory's instead of applying a real strategy to be victorious

Zohkar's Avatar


Zohkar
02.26.2014 , 10:07 PM | #7
Going to have to say not much of a improvement. Never seen people running back to the ship in TDM matchs to maintain a lead, but now the team that is dominate in pushing the opponent back to there capital ship is setting up killing fields that destroy opponents before they have a chance to even completely load after a re-spawn. Now your seeing bombers dropping there payloads on the three locations and gunships and strike fighters dropping there arsnels onto what ever managed to survive. All thats changed basically is insteead of those teams staying 15k out from capital ships allowing some ability for the team to push out to just into space to never leave.
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Jandi's Avatar


Jandi
02.27.2014 , 12:09 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by Deimos_Olympian View Post
Sorry think this is not the proper way to discuss something by insulting people. If you would discuss something do it with facts not insults because people have a different point of view than you do.

And 4 strikes that spawn are no match against two bombers and two gun ships working in tadem.

Full power to shield, repairdrones, mines, raildrone, gunships aoe ionrail than pick them of with their slugrailcannon
Every single person who whines about gunships and bombers is someone who plays nothing but scout because it's the easiest ship to get kills with but has little to no defense against these craft, so they do nothing but cry in every thread.

I'm a mediocre pilot with a non-mastered Pike and I take on 2 gunship teams on a regular basis, easily and you're telling me 4 can't do anything? Uhuh, yeah, how bout them facts? By the way, these same people would demolish you just as easily 15k away so being at your spawn is completely and utterly irrelevant. Your team obviously didn't pose any challenge at all or you wouldn't be at your spawn so tell me, how is it different from getting demolished in the middle? It isn't.

The only difference since patch is that you can no longer get kills the only way you previously could, by boosting to the cap ship and hope it kills something. Must be so tragic when you have to actually learn how to fight.
Those that demand respect deserve only pity.

zaskar's Avatar


zaskar
02.27.2014 , 12:30 AM | #9
is it just me or does anyone else think it's hilarious that all the qq'ing about this and most people did not figure out to kill the ship turrets to get to the campers pre-.1? It took a bit of skill to do so in a scout but with a little teamwork it was fairly easy.
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Deimos_Olympian's Avatar


Deimos_Olympian
02.27.2014 , 01:04 AM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Jandi View Post
Every single person who whines about gunships and bombers is someone who plays nothing but scout because it's the easiest ship to get kills with but has little to no defense against these craft, so they do nothing but cry in every thread.

I'm a mediocre pilot with a non-mastered Pike and I take on 2 gunship teams on a regular basis, easily and you're telling me 4 can't do anything? Uhuh, yeah, how bout them facts? By the way, these same people would demolish you just as easily 15k away so being at your spawn is completely and utterly irrelevant. Your team obviously didn't pose any challenge at all or you wouldn't be at your spawn so tell me, how is it different from getting demolished in the middle? It isn't.

The only difference since patch is that you can no longer get kills the only way you previously could, by boosting to the cap ship and hope it kills something. Must be so tragic when you have to actually learn how to fight.
Again with the insults and no real facts.

You make assumptions that people raise a issue with bombers or gunships they flying scouts. So not true and this thread is about the turrets on the capital ships not about bombers and gunships. With the removal of the turrets spawn camping is now the major issue in TDM. I fly bomber and gunship and i like the TDM to be more than me and my teammates spawn camping the other team and get easy victory's.

I like the both side using real combat strategy and teamwork to win, spawncamping requires neither