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Advanced Augment 28s constantly selling for less than they take to make?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Crew Skills
Advanced Augment 28s constantly selling for less than they take to make?

wainot-keel's Avatar


wainot-keel
02.20.2014 , 07:28 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Khevar View Post
I've run into the same thing myself.

I've can understand why some mats can get pricey, like Turadium. It's used for 3 crafting professions, and many schematics ask for 4 units for every 2 Mythra. So it tends to be scarcer, thus price goes up. Logical.

But Thermal Regulators can only be used to craft augments. Its a mystery to me why people will buy TRs to craft augments if it's cheaper to just buy the finished augments directly.

Go figure.
It's the crits.
Whether you have the augmenter or a friend/guildie does (who will give you the crits, lol).

On my server, TRs go steady at 20k a pop. Augments around 80k (mainstat ones, which can drop to like 75k) and 90k the others (sometimes a bit more,sometimes a bit less).
I have the slicers and I have the augmenters. No way I'm selling the TRs. It'd be foolish. I only sell the augments.
Tanno Vik and the ship droid with the synth sensor rock.

IMO, the only reason to buy directly the augments is either you need them now or you have no access to an augmenter giving you the crits.

And let's forget about the crits.
Yeah, let's say I can make a bit of more money by selling all the mats (TRs, the 2 different green mats, white mats,etc) instead of augments.
What about the hassle of listing/relisting all that garbage ? If you wanna do it right, you need to check prices for each item. Then you need to do the spliting stacks stuff. Every time for evey mat...God... I'm tired by just thinking all that. Augments, on the other hand, are a really simple and really quick thing to list. Spending as little time as possible on the GTN is nice.
In my case, indulging my laziness is priority . I would do that even if it meant less profit (which it doesn't)

psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.20.2014 , 08:28 AM | #12
I agree with those who have explained that it's the crits being taken into account. However, I do not agree with that mentality for one simple reason: what if you don't crit?

Even with two +5 crit companions (on my synthweaving JK: Kira and C2-N2), there have been times when I craft ten augments and I get ten augments. Over the last 18 months, these instances are rare, but numerous enough for me to take crits off the table when it comes to determining my pricing.

Hence, why I rarely dip into the artifact quality item modifications markets. Blue quality item modifications are much cheaper to make, invariably sell for a higher profit margin (as a function of percentage), and are much easier to scoop up when someone posts them under the cost to manufacture.

wainot-keel's Avatar


wainot-keel
02.20.2014 , 09:25 AM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by psandak View Post
I agree with those who have explained that it's the crits being taken into account. However, I do not agree with that mentality for one simple reason: what if you don't crit?

Even with two +5 crit companions (on my synthweaving JK: Kira and C2-N2), there have been times when I craft ten augments and I get ten augments. Over the last 18 months, these instances are rare, but numerous enough for me to take crits off the table when it comes to determining my pricing.

Hence, why I rarely dip into the artifact quality item modifications markets. Blue quality item modifications are much cheaper to make, invariably sell for a higher profit margin (as a function of percentage), and are much easier to scoop up when someone posts them under the cost to manufacture.
But, overtime, you do crit. Inevitably. So crits do exist.
Yes, one week will be less profitable than other. But the profit from crits is certainly there.

Also, if you sell purple augments doesn't mean you can't sell blue ones. I sell both. I agree, profit margin is bigger for blue stuff, but that also means more work.

psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.20.2014 , 10:30 AM | #14
Quote: Originally Posted by wainot-keel View Post
But, overtime, you do crit. Inevitably. So crits do exist.
Yes, one week will be less profitable than other. But the profit from crits is certainly there.

Also, if you sell purple augments doesn't mean you can't sell blue ones. I sell both. I agree, profit margin is bigger for blue stuff, but that also means more work.
I do not deny that crits exist, but I do not believe that one should depend on them for profit. Just my opinion.

With that opinion in mind, as for crafting purples along side blues, it is a better investment of materials and credits to go exclusively blue:
  • As a function of time one can craft 2 blues for every 1 purple
  • As a function of credits I can craft 13 blues each purple
  • And players who buy blues tend to buy in bulk so I usually sell out in one transaction
  • So for every one purple you might make a profit on, I am selling five or six blues and definitely making a profit.

Khevar's Avatar


Khevar
02.20.2014 , 10:42 AM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by wainot-keel View Post
It's the crits.
Whether you have the augmenter or a friend/guildie does (who will give you the crits, lol).

...
I do understand, and have used that in my profit math before.

But the mystery is not how someone can make a profit. The mystery is: who is buying all these TRs?

Most of the crafters I know that make money on augments also run their own slicing missions. So they have a choice of selling TRs for x credits or selling the final augments (hoping for crits) and 1.1x credits.

This I can understand.

But is someone going to go to the GTN, buy up all these TRs, spending 45 minutes per augment, just to make a small profit IF they get the expected crit rate?

That is the mystery.

psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.20.2014 , 11:05 AM | #16
Quote: Originally Posted by Khevar View Post
I do understand, and have used that in my profit math before.

But the mystery is not how someone can make a profit. The mystery is: who is buying all these TRs?

Most of the crafters I know that make money on augments also run their own slicing missions. So they have a choice of selling TRs for x credits or selling the final augments (hoping for crits) and 1.1x credits.

This I can understand.

But is someone going to go to the GTN, buy up all these TRs, spending 45 minutes per augment, just to make a small profit IF they get the expected crit rate?

That is the mystery.
Just running missions is rarely enough to maintain a proper stock of materials. Eventually and inevitably one runs
into the issue of running low on materials. The choice then becomes:
  1. time: stopping production of crafted items while stock is rebuilt
  2. or credits: for all intents and purposes paying someone else to rebuild your stock for you


The other possibility, is someone who does not have an (proper) augment crafter, buys the materials off the GTN and is hoping a crafter friend/guildmate crits. If we assume an idealized circumstance - 28% crit rate actually happens in the short term - one needs 44 TRs to get 14 augments (the first eight crafts yield two extra, then because of the slightly better than 1 in 4, you get an extra in the final three; or any combination therein)

wainot-keel's Avatar


wainot-keel
02.20.2014 , 11:52 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by Khevar View Post
I do understand, and have used that in my profit math before.

But the mystery is not how someone can make a profit. The mystery is: who is buying all these TRs?

Most of the crafters I know that make money on augments also run their own slicing missions. So they have a choice of selling TRs for x credits or selling the final augments (hoping for crits) and 1.1x credits.

This I can understand.

But is someone going to go to the GTN, buy up all these TRs, spending 45 minutes per augment, just to make a small profit IF they get the expected crit rate?

That is the mystery.
Gotcha.

I imagine there's a bit of everything. While I've never done it, I did consider buying TRs just to make profit off of crits. But since that would mean not gaining anything on non-crits (just even at best), I figured it'd be too much work for nothing.
I get my own TRs (I have 6 slicers), so I make profit with non-crits too.

But that's me, I'm lazy and cheap (I don't want to pay 20k for something I know it costs, in terms of creds, 4k - 5k ish )
Though I do see names that are always selling purple augments, every day, a bunch. They either have an unholy army of Slicers with multiple accounts and spend lots and lots of times sending minions or they just buy the TRs and they're always selling purple augments everyday. The more you roll the dice for crits, the more crits you get.

Maybe some have only the augmenter(s) and cba leveling slicers and do a bunch of missions for mats. Specially considering there are only 2 missions that may grant TRs and one of them sucks. Or, if someone has few characters and they want to make money with purple augments, they need to buy TRs.

MaximilianPower's Avatar


MaximilianPower
02.20.2014 , 03:07 PM | #18
Re: who comprises the TR market - I'll buy a few here and there. I've only recently figured out how to profit off of augment crafting. I have two 450 slicers, working on a 3rd, so obviously my influx of TRs is fairly small. I'm able to run Unsliceable? and WtW several times a day (working from home ftw), typically a total of about 5-6 times per mission per alt. So my total potential net is around 60-70 TRs if everybody crits, which, of course, never happens. I'm more likely to end up around 15 or so for the day.

Sometimes I'll have a particularly bad run, landing only, say, a couple of pairs of TRs from WtW. In those situations, I have been known to buy TRs off the gtn to supplement my inventory. I figure if I score two via slicing and pay around 40k for the other two, I'll still come out ahead (even considering the cost of failed missions). While I won't go nuts buying tons of TRs at 20k a pop, I feel it's important to maintain a positive cash flow.

Also, I'm more likely to do this when I see the aug market trending towards higher prices. As I said in my earlier post, prices on my server can get up to 110k for mainstat ugs. Usually that only happens 1-2 days a week. During those high points, I'll snatch up more TRs than I otherwise would.

Quote: Originally Posted by psandak View Post
I agree with those who have explained that it's the crits being taken into account. However, I do not agree with that mentality for one simple reason: what if you don't crit?

Even with two +5 crit companions (on my synthweaving JK: Kira and C2-N2), there have been times when I craft ten augments and I get ten augments. Over the last 18 months, these instances are rare, but numerous enough for me to take crits off the table when it comes to determining my pricing.

Hence, why I rarely dip into the artifact quality item modifications markets. Blue quality item modifications are much cheaper to make, invariably sell for a higher profit margin (as a function of percentage), and are much easier to scoop up when someone posts them under the cost to manufacture.
+1 on this. You'll notice in my post thus far I haven't considered critting on crafting the augs. I would never bother with the aug market if I had to rely on crits for profits. I consider them a bonus. Ultimately they do make aug crafting wildly profitable (even in my small-scale 2-slicer enterprise), but I want to ensure that I'll land a significant profit without them. And thus far I have. The day I'm no longer able to maintain a margin without crits, I'll move on to another market.
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DawnAskham's Avatar


DawnAskham
02.22.2014 , 12:26 PM | #19
My server hasn't seen prices fall to that level yet, though they seem to be pushing closer and closer to it every day.

I have seen what someone else noted, and that is quite a few 31 items now priced significantly below the selling prices of mats (such that any profit even with crits is going to be very low - though most are probably posted by the 'trading X31 for mats' people that constantly spam chat on fleet).

It does seem like this is where the market is heading for all servers though, so have started offloading my excess stock.

And at the prices mentioned by the OP, I would just sell mats (unless the idiots start pricing them below mission cost as well, in which case R.I.P. crafting / crew skills).

It does seem pointless to me to craft items and have to rely on crits just to make a measly 1K when I can simply have my crafting crew members run missions instead and sell the mats for more overall profit / time at less risk.

Millardkillmoore's Avatar


Millardkillmoore
02.22.2014 , 04:36 PM | #20
Augment crafter here. I make millions a week purely from crafting Adv 28 Augs. I have to constantly buy up Thermal Regulators because I don't have any crafting alts (working on that now). I never purchase other materials from the GTN and run my own gathering missions. Crits mean that there are significant profits to be made even at 80k. It's key that you're using max affection companions with crit bonuses and that you have the legacy of crafting perks.

The price of Thermal Regulators is not always 20k. I don't buy them for anything above that price. 19.5k is the typical price on Harbinger. I always buy every TR I see listed for less than 19k. Sometimes, I'll even see bulk sales of 99 sold for 15-17k each. Grabbing those up is a huge boon.

Another thing to consider is that the price of augments is not always 80k. That's the bare minimum I'll sell for and only if I need the capital to gather more materials. I have built up a huge stockpile of Absorb, Reflex, Skill, and Shield augments. Whenever the price starts to rise, I can sell dozens/day for 90k+ each. If I have the capital and feel the prices have been too low for too long, I like to buy out everyone in the market and set the price to a much higher level. On Harbinger a few days ago, I set the prices of absorb augments to 130k (I find that they simply don't sell at higher prices than 130k) and made sure that they stayed as high as possible for as long as possible. After 4-5 days, they basically returned to normal and I made ~6 million in profits. So if you felt that you were getting gouged on Absorb Augment prices on Harbinger for the past few days, that was my fault.

I've recently noticed that I have a massive stockpile of Bio-Mechanical Interface chips. I'm currently studying the market and contemplating expanding into Augmentation kits.

tl;dr There's huge money to be made in the augment market if you pay attention.