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Mistakes I see daily


Gobgrot's Avatar


Gobgrot
02.12.2014 , 09:52 PM | #1
Hi everyone, if your reading this you're like me and enjoy crafting and selling your wares on the GTN. This in itself can be a fun and rewarding mini game within the game of SWTOR with the way of keeping score the amount of credits you make.

To this end Id like to help out a few of you I keep on seeing make the same mistakes over and over again. To make money you need to know your market, our market is the older players who have a huge amount of credits built up and are working on their 2nd, 3rd or more alt. These people have tons of credits sitting around with nothing to do with it, they see credits mostly as worthless.. To them spending a couple of hundred thousand every ten levels is nothing (at 55 your repair bill on a night of raiding can easily top 100k if you have a bad night). Ive occasionally asked people why they sell items at low amounts and they normally come back with "Its to help out the newer players and give them a break" or " I'm new and this seems like a lot to me". Well I hate to burst your bubble people but most of the time the items you sell for real cheap are bought up by people like me and resold at a much higher price.

Next thing people seem to do wrong is considering the cost of the materials for the items they sell. If you make assumptions about the costs of coarse your going to assume the selling price should be in line with it. Another thing knowledgeable players do is look at the gtn for people selling items at or below the actual cost of making said item, buy them up and sell them for a much higher amount. No matter what you think the cost of making an item is, "well I got those rares on a crit while getting the blues I wanted so the cost was free", its wrong.

To find the cost of making an item each mat must be considered, find the average cost of that mat on the gtn. If, for example, it sells for a low of 5k and an high of 20k, I will put the cost of each at about 9k as the higher priced ones are normally trying to find someone desperate for the mat when all others sell out. You cant say the cost is 5k as that is the lowest because it wont always be the lowest price, Ive seen rare days where I can pick that mat up for 4k and weeks where it wont drop below 10k. Even the mats you gathered yourself needs to be added in to the cost of the item your making. Not only was there time involved but you can sell them by themselves as mats and make money. This may seem wrong to you when your leveling a toon ( after all your picking up the mats as you play) but as you get into the game of selling on the gtn you realize the time involved in going out to harvest is too much, you cant keep it up. You will eventually have to buy most if not all of your mats on the gtn.

To continue our example, lets say we added up all the costs to make the item you want to sell and it comes out to 10k credits. If the item is blue then we can safely double the price as your selling price, if its purple we need to add in a few more thousand to make up for the RE cost of getting this recipe. The reason Ive added a few thousand for this is to get that recipe you had to RE on average 10 blues (check your recipes, that 20% drops to 10% real fast at higher levels) at a cost of 5-10k each ( Im being nice here as in the real world you would use the cost of lost sales for the item not making it) to get 1 random purple recipe, sometimes it takes 3-4 of those random recipes to get one for a salable item.

Once you've done all this make sure there isn't a large amount of this item already on the gtn, make a couple and put them up at your price. If there are many of them on the gtn bypass it for now and move on to the next item. After doing this for a while you will find out what you can make and sell at a good profit for your time involved. Some things will sell very fast so even if there are a few on the gtn, at a lower price than what you want to sell for, you will still be able to sell yours at the price you want. One of the biggest mistakes Ive seen people do is get a new recipe and immediately flood the market with that item. Its a waste of materials and time.

Last thing to consider when selling items is if you want to undercut people or not. If you do you will sell more but: you will get a much lower profit per item and it creates more work for yourself at less earnings.

However you go about running your little business the idea is to have fun and hopefully Ive helped you out to make a better profit.

dermitni's Avatar


dermitni
02.13.2014 , 04:08 AM | #2
A great posting, thank you. I always wondered about a good way to calculate the cost of crafting a certain item and went with the cost for unning ressource gathering missions. But the average GTN price could be a better point to start the calculation.
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psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.13.2014 , 12:12 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
/snip..

Well I hate to burst your bubble people but most of the time the items you sell for real cheap are bought up by people like me and resold at a much higher price.
This cannot be emphasized enough.

Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
No matter what you think the cost of making an item is, "well I got those rares on a crit while getting the blues I wanted so the cost was free", its wrong.
Again for emphasis. I used to think this way. I learned my lesson years ago playing WoW. Long story short, in that game I gathered all my own materials and sold finished goods to guildmates and friends (my Guild Master insisted I sell), thought I was making good money, was proven SOOOOO wrong when I actually looked at the Auction House prices for materials and the finished goods.

Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
To find the cost of making an item each mat must be considered, find the average cost of that mat on the gtn.
Unless you are actually doing the math, you are more likely visualizing the other two statistical values:

median (arrange the values highest to lowest and find the middle)
mode (the most common value)

And in case you are doing the math, be aware that just taking the mean (average) value is not always the most accurate.

Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
Last thing to consider when selling items is if you want to undercut people or not. If you do you will sell more but: you will get a much lower profit per item and it creates more work for yourself at less earnings.
That all depends on by how much one undercuts. This statement above it true if you are undercutting by a significant amount. But FYI, one will make just as many sales undercutting by a handful of credits (1-10) as undercutting by a larger amount. I know because I used to undercut to the nearest multiple of 250 (i.e. lowest posted is 12500, I would post at 12250), now I undercut by 1 (i.e. 12500 to 12499) and sales have not diminished one bit.
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Gobgrot's Avatar


Gobgrot
02.13.2014 , 03:26 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by psandak View Post
That all depends on by how much one undercuts. This statement above it true if you are undercutting by a significant amount. But FYI, one will make just as many sales undercutting by a handful of credits (1-10) as undercutting by a larger amount. I know because I used to undercut to the nearest multiple of 250 (i.e. lowest posted is 12500, I would post at 12250), now I undercut by 1 (i.e. 12500 to 12499) and sales have not diminished one bit.
True but I was thinking of a situation where the other person was way lower than the price you want to sell for. To continue my example, if the item was blue and cost 10k in mats to make our selling price would be 20k. If the current lowest price on the gtn is 12k whats the point of making the item today for a profit of 2k when you can move on to the next item on your list that will sell for your asking price. Its very situational.

psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.13.2014 , 04:05 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
True but I was thinking of a situation where the other person was way lower than the price you want to sell for. To continue my example, if the item was blue and cost 10k in mats to make our selling price would be 20k. If the current lowest price on the gtn is 12k whats the point of making the item today for a profit of 2k when you can move on to the next item on your list that will sell for your asking price. Its very situational.
But it is up to each player to decide what his/her bargain basement pricing is. And one needs to re-evaluate that pricing level now and then.

For example: when I first started selling blue quality top end augments (grade 22 at the time), they typically sold for 12k - 20k each, most commonly falling around 15k. Grade 28 blues augments initially fell into the same range. But then prices plummeted. No matter how many I bought up and re-posted; no matter how long I held back my stock the new range was 7.5k to 15k. I knew how much it cost to make them and at the new pricing I would still profit...just not as much. My choice was to either abandon that market or adjust my bargain basement pricing. I did both. I slowed my production and focused on other items, but I also decreased my bargain basement pricing.

But even with that in mind, players do need to realize that they need not always post at their bottom level. It only takes a moment to check current pricing and yet - based on some of the major undercutting I see - many players don't even bother; they post at what they post without even thinking about it.
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nightsproull's Avatar


nightsproull
02.18.2014 , 07:56 AM | #6
What you're labeling as mistakes are more commonly just players who care more about playing SWTOR than the mini-game of playing the GTN.

psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.18.2014 , 11:31 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by nightsproull View Post
What you're labeling as mistakes are more commonly just players who care more about playing SWTOR than the mini-game of playing the GTN.
Then why are they posting in the first place and at anything but the default pricing?
The Ortzid Legacy on The Harbinger
Car'beerd (Guardian) Dalkery (Scoundrel) Blairnah (Sage) Ulunnes (Commando)
Zaggema (Sin) Daellia (Merc) Carrud (Marauder) Quith'edi'ata (Operative)


high end schematics * best crew skills * crew skill money making * Probability 101
"You can't just ask customers what they want and then try to give it to them. By the time you get it built, they'll want something else" Steve Jobs

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Slightrider
02.18.2014 , 11:56 AM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by psandak View Post
Then why are they posting in the first place and at anything but the default pricing?
Because I have 6 cargo bays on 9+ toons full of crap and need it gone...I will undercut you by at least half or even more just to clean it out from time to time.

and for some reason, I still make millions.
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psandak's Avatar


psandak
02.18.2014 , 12:02 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Slightrider View Post
Because I have 6 cargo bays on 9+ toons full of crap and need it gone...I will undercut you by at least half or even more just to clean it out from time to time.

and for some reason, I still make millions.
You make millions, because I (and players like me) buy up what you are posting, re-post, and still sell everything.

Thank you for being my/our wholesaler
The Ortzid Legacy on The Harbinger
Car'beerd (Guardian) Dalkery (Scoundrel) Blairnah (Sage) Ulunnes (Commando)
Zaggema (Sin) Daellia (Merc) Carrud (Marauder) Quith'edi'ata (Operative)


high end schematics * best crew skills * crew skill money making * Probability 101
"You can't just ask customers what they want and then try to give it to them. By the time you get it built, they'll want something else" Steve Jobs

DarthOvertone's Avatar


DarthOvertone
02.18.2014 , 04:08 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by Gobgrot View Post
Profiteering Stuff
Solid post. Part of me wishes you hadn't disclosed this information, however. heh


Quote: Originally Posted by Slightrider View Post
and for some reason, I still make millions.
That's because people like me are buying your poorly priced items for millions and then flipping those items to make tens of millions.

But do carry on. My toons need easy inventories of goods. lol
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