Hello friends and enemies!

 

Since 2.6 has dropped, I have seen a bunch of nerf scrapper threads and comments.Having played all 3 scoundrel specs since launch(Dirty fighting being my favorite) I just wanted to help players in the community who are having troubles with scrappers since the buff.(I am speaking about regs btw)

 

When specced scrapper and i open up with shoot first and it hits for 2k, in my head i am like fml. So if you have an aoe taunt and see a bunch of enemies throw it at them. There may be a scrapper in stealth that you just caught with that taunt making their opener painfully weak.

 

If i get the jump on an enemy ,get my shoot first off with a decent damage number and right as I am about to continue my rotation i get knocked back out of range or cced... in my head im like fml. So if you see your teamate get opened up on by scrapper and your in range for cc knock back w/e do it!Help a bro or sis out.

 

If im about to get the jump on an enemy and someone throws down a stealth scan or aoe breaking me out of stealth before i can get off a shoot first.In my head im like fml.If you have stealthscan.. use it! throw it down right on you healers position.. your position... or any position they would need to go.

 

Scrappers have a knock down attached to shootfirst one hard stun a root and a mez.(mez is pretty much useless on a target your dpsing since Flechette round is a dot so personally i used it as an escape mechanism or interrupt)

For some reason most of the people i root just stay there, dont do any abilites dont turn their character towards me to deny me the backblast.My advice... if a scrapper roots you turn towards them and throw out some dps or cc that fool.

 

I'm going to leave it at that. The more i write this thread the more awkward i feel about teaching people how to defeat me when im specced scrapper. so im going to leave it to the rest of the community to list other ways to ruin a scrappers day.Merry friday peoples and cheers. remember to have fun and i will see you all in game.

 

One last thing i would like to say.....

 

 

 

SCRAPPERS ARE NOT OP... YOU ARE JUST NOT USE TO ONE ACTUALLY HAVING A CHANCE!

 

Much respect

 

Crownsolo

Yes. This.

 

Dps Jugg main here.

Trying to share knowledge instead of reacting to qq.From the looks of the forums it seems like we are invincible and out of line with other strong dps specs for pvp; but scrappers arent. hopefully we can fill this thread with scrapper counters to shut down the whine.

Slow is ever best skill against stealthers

 

If char can have talents to boost slow, I always take it. Slowing down constantly makes easy to face stealther and they can't use biggest hits.

Slow is ever best skill against stealthers

 

If char can have talents to boost slow, I always take it. Slowing down constantly makes easy to face stealther and they can't use biggest hits.

 

oh man thats another thing that ruins my day. when im slowed and distanced is created all i have is sab charge (which is usually on cd since i use early in my rotation)charged burst(which doesnt hit very hard non crit) and frag grenade. this is another situation where im like fml.

Slow is ever best skill against stealthers

 

If char can have talents to boost slow, I always take it. Slowing down constantly makes easy to face stealther and they can't use biggest hits.

 

This slows really ruins scrappers and concealment.

You guys aren't even being honest anymore. I have many ways to counter a slow and my laceration now hits nearly as hard as my positional without the positional. Like all classes, you feel like you can have your scissor vs rock moments but you guys are really getting hilarious. This class isn't as overpowered as the forums banter makes it out to be but it's very strong right now and almost feels a wee bit broken in 1v1 wz play. Stop pretending that it isn't. They're not going to change it regardless, you can at least be honest about it.

I play scoundrel healer and respecced to this to play around with it and have some fun in PvP. There's quite a lot that can screw up your day as a scrapper, but KBs can be countered with rolly poleying your butt back to the target. Roots or slows usually see me using disappearing act to avoid the sitting duck scenario. The biggest ballache is Electro net =P That one's a frustration fest. Having fun with it in arenas though, they do shine particularly bright in there, especially when everyone's occupied with taking down your healer/s if you're fortunate enough to have one on your team.

That said, even with all the counters, what's not to love about being a punchy, nut booting, pistol whipping ball of fury?

You guys aren't even being honest anymore. I have many ways to counter a slow and my laceration now hits nearly as hard as my positional without the positional. Like all classes, you feel like you can have your scissor vs rock moments but you guys are really getting hilarious. This class isn't as overpowered as the forums banter makes it out to be but it's very strong right now and almost feels a wee bit broken in 1v1 wz play. Stop pretending that it isn't. They're not going to change it regardless, you can at least be honest about it.

 

Personally i don't use dodge to remove a slow(I save it for right before a disappearing act).Scrapper does have a talent with a chance to dodge when you scamper but using it for a chance to remove a slow is a crap shoot.Tech slows can be removed with trauma thats all i can think of atm.

You guys aren't even being honest anymore. I have many ways to counter a slow and my laceration now hits nearly as hard as my positional without the positional. Like all classes, you feel like you can have your scissor vs rock moments but you guys are really getting hilarious. This class isn't as overpowered as the forums banter makes it out to be but it's very strong right now and almost feels a wee bit broken in 1v1 wz play. Stop pretending that it isn't. They're not going to change it regardless, you can at least be honest about it.

 

so what you are telling is that the moment Oper can win a 1v1 duel, the game have to be considered as totally broken.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Missandei

Biggest thing that ruins a Scrapper's day is getting hit by random AOE and knockbacks pushing you out of stealth and then taking 270 million years to break combat.

Knock-back + ElectroNet + Arsen-opener (Power Surge ---> Insta-Tracer ---> HeatSeeker ---> Insta-Tracer ---> RailShot):

 

That hinder + the alpha-strike of the Gods works just as well as it ever did

so what you are telling is that the moment Oper can win a 1v1 duel, the game have to be considered as totally broken.

 

You missed the point entirely.

You missed the point entirely.

 

lol.. no.

I nailed it pretty right.

 

The majority of QQ going because people are not used to the fact that DPS Opers could actually fight back.

For the last 2 years Opers considered as more a nuisance than a real threat.

Now people are forced to learn to play against «new» opponent. All who are at least average skilled perfectly know how to counter Opers and have no problems dealing with them. Sure now it is not the 99 to 1 chance to kill an Oper and it is more like 60 to 40 in fair 1vs1 fight. Opers still need some buffs to be on par with other classes.

 

But all this QQ only shows that swtor is full of casuals.. and all this casuals want is to have a one button that will kill all the opponents.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Missandei

It's fine that Scoups have strong burst. What's not fine is that that burst isn't burst, it's sustainable for quite a while. Their burst was buffed and that's great, but their sustained DPS went from crap to fantastic along *with* their burst being buffed. That's what's making them ridiculous.

 

My geared Assassin tank is being *obliterated* by Scoups. You might say, "survive the burst and you'll win" and that's exactly how it *should* be with a stealth squishy against a damage-heavy tank, but it's not just the burst. The burst comes, I pop a cooldown and survive it then work on killing the Scoup...and I can't even come close 'cause their DPS massively outdoes mine. So they bring me down to nearly nothing right away, and despite surviving it and popping a medpack/cooldowns they still bring me down. Alone.

 

No other class has that much burst coupled with that much DPS. One or the other can be dealt with, but both is just insane. Deception Assassins can burst that hard or harder, but can't follow it up like Scoups can. Snipers, PTs and Smashmonkeys can do plenty of DPS but not nearly as much burst.

 

Now you might say, "the low survivability offsets their burst and DPS." And you'd be right, *if* they didn't have rolls, Evasion and re-stealth (which lets them start over with their burst a second time, making them even scarier). If a fight isn't going their way they can be 40m away and stealthed in seconds. A smart Scoup will be ready to do just that. Plenty of less-smart ones won't, and that's where the "they aren't OP" claims come from. There are a lot more crappy Scoups than there are good ones, and the good ones are making WZs an absolute nightmare right now.

 

Either their burst or their DPS needs to be toned down. Preferably not both so we're not back to the lolConcealment days, so the Devs need to decide whether they want Concealment to be a good DPS spec and thus viable in raids or a good burst spec and thus viable in PvP. Both is too much.

Ok I have been neutral about the whole scrapper QQ in forums but seeing that this thread is actually a legit one I will share my experience and thoughts.

 

I am going to ask a few questions and I will give my answer. Feel free to answer the same questions for yourself.

 

Q1. Which DPS do I find most annoying in game?

Ans: Ranking according to annoyance: 1. Concealment Op. 2. Vigilance Guardian. 3. Vengeance Jugg (Guardian is above jugg because its annoyingly hard to see the unstoppable buff on the guardian which is very obvious on a Jugg)

 

Well, all the good players out there might have already guessed, I play ranged DPS most of the time. I am not saying my list is the most logical. It is not. There is no way I can defend the fact that I find operatives annoying but not assassins. Its a personal point of view. And FYI I dont play an assassin DPS.

 

Q2. Why do you find these DPS classes annoying?

Ans: Scrapper is a burst spec on a stealth class that opens with a stun. They can deliver their burst meanwhile I wait for the second stun to break out of it. Its a helpless feelings which I dont like. If the op does not get lucky with crit he has a number of options: Root + Scamper away, Mezz + Scamper away, Stealth out and try again. If the op gets lucky with 1 crit and the fight is going evenly they get to turn the table with : stealth out + start the opening burst again, LOS throw one heal and get back in action. I am not saying scrappers are op, but they have too many options to cheese out of a close fight.

I find vigilance annoying because there are no counters to them once they jump on you. and the Root on master strike means you will get the rubber band effect even if you have any kind of runaway ability. Which mean : zero counter to Guardian jump.

 

The point I am trying to make is it does not feel good to not have a counter.

 

Q3: Are scrappers actually overpowered?

Ans: I dont think so. But they are extremely annoying when they are alone. They are rage inducing in a pack of 2 or 3. And if the number of scrapper stay high in war zones it is not unreasonable to expect a severe reaction from the casual player base as it happened after launch which resulted into an absolutely awful and unwarranted nerf.

 

So what is the point of this wall of text. The point is scrapper might be in a good place right now from a scrapper point of view but it will soon become the most annoying spec to play against in a WZ and will also become the focus of all QQ.

If I loved playing scrapper this would be a very good time to come up with suggestions to make the class play slightly differently. (Remember with new MMOs on the horizon BW is in a very delicate spot right now) May be less 1v1 god but more useful in group play. Sadly I dont play scrapper and I cant help in this matter.

Anyway that is how I feel. Its not based on number crunching or theorycrafting its just my personal opinion.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Helmholtzz

It's fine that Scoups have strong burst. What's not fine is that that burst isn't burst, it's sustainable for quite a while. Their burst was buffed and that's great, but their sustained DPS went from crap to fantastic along *with* their burst being buffed. That's what's making them ridiculous.

 

My geared Assassin tank is being *obliterated* by Scoups. You might say, "survive the burst and you'll win" and that's exactly how it *should* be with a stealth squishy against a damage-heavy tank, but it's not just the burst. The burst comes, I pop a cooldown and survive it then work on killing the Scoup...and I can't even come close 'cause their DPS massively outdoes mine. So they bring me down to nearly nothing right away, and despite surviving it and popping a medpack/cooldowns they still bring me down. Alone.

 

No other class has that much burst coupled with that much DPS. One or the other can be dealt with, but both is just insane. Deception Assassins can burst that hard or harder, but can't follow it up like Scoups can. Snipers, PTs and Smashmonkeys can do plenty of DPS but not nearly as much burst.

 

Now you might say, "the low survivability offsets their burst and DPS." And you'd be right, *if* they didn't have rolls, Evasion and re-stealth (which lets them start over with their burst a second time, making them even scarier). If a fight isn't going their way they can be 40m away and stealthed in seconds. A smart Scoup will be ready to do just that. Plenty of less-smart ones won't, and that's where the "they aren't OP" claims come from. There are a lot more crappy Scoups than there are good ones, and the good ones are making WZs an absolute nightmare right now.

 

Either their burst or their DPS needs to be toned down. Preferably not both so we're not back to the lolConcealment days, so the Devs need to decide whether they want Concealment to be a good DPS spec and thus viable in raids or a good burst spec and thus viable in PvP. Both is too much.

 

Saying that pt's dont have that kind of burst or sustained is just wrong. Pyrotech says hi... oh and it actually has D cd's

lol.. no.

I nailed it pretty right.

 

The majority of QQ going because people are not used to the fact that DPS Opers could actually fight back.

For the last 2 years Opers considered as more a nuisance than a real threat.

Now people are forced to learn to play against «new» opponent. All who are at least average skilled perfectly know how to counter Opers and have no problems dealing with them. Sure now it is not the 99 to 1 chance to kill an Oper and it is more like 60 to 40 in fair 1vs1 fight. Opers still need some buffs to be on par with other classes.

 

But all this QQ only shows that swtor is full of casuals.. and all this casuals want is to have a one button that will kill all the opponents.

 

 

Actually, you hit your thumb.

Saying that pt's dont have that kind of burst or sustained is just wrong. Pyrotech says hi... oh and it actually has D cd's

 

Pyro has decent burst but it's super easy to counter. You have 3s to pop a cd while their nades are on you and then all they can do is cross their fingers for the proc on rail shot.

Edited February 8, 2014 by Puissant

So what is the point of this wall of text. The point is scrapper might be in a good place right now from a scrapper point of view but it will soon become the most annoying spec to play against in a WZ and will also become the focus of all QQ.

If I loved playing scrapper this would be a very good time to come up with suggestions to make the class play slightly differently. (Remember with new MMOs on the horizon BW is in a very delicate spot right now) May be less 1v1 god but more useful in group play. Sadly I dont play scrapper and I cant help in this matter.

Anyway that is how I feel. Its not based on number crunching or theorycrafting its just my personal opinion.

 

Hey look someone who approached the topic honestly.. now I have seen everything. IMO just change jarring strikes so they no longer have the knockdown, give us some defensives, and call it a day. Concealment is the only spec I play regularly. I didnt feel gimped for dps pre-patch, nor does it feel OP post-patch. It is gimmicky. And the knockdown is what i really think people/noobs/baddies are crying about.

Pyro has decent burst but it's super easy to counter. You have 3s to pop a cd while their nades are on you and then all they do is cross their fingers for the proc on rail shot.

 

true enough, but they have two hard stuns that can be used to prevent that. missle --> det ---> rs--->rp--> rs is a good chunk of damage

Smash > Scrap/Conc

Knock-back + ElectroNet + Arsen-opener (Power Surge ---> Insta-Tracer ---> HeatSeeker ---> Insta-Tracer ---> RailShot):

 

That hinder + the alpha-strike of the Gods works just as well as it ever did

 

idk if a bunch of people read your comment or not but i had this done to me a bunch today. I have been countering with cc breaker defensive shield dodge disapearing act and licking my wounds in a corner. If my cc breaker is on cool down i just try to stand still and spam diagnostic scan if that gets interrupted without an upperhand ready ill pop pugnacity and cast a kolto pack.if that all fails well i am toast .

Edit: Wrong thread Sorry Edited February 24, 2014 by Helmholtzz

Edit: More annoying double post... argh. Sorry again. Edited February 24, 2014 by Helmholtzz