I recently rolled a Mara and I'm having some issues adapting to it. To explain, I have level 55 Jugg, Shadow and Sin. The Jugg just soaks up damage and the Shadow and Sin, being ranged, coupled with Force Speed, make mobility a non-issue. However, with the super long cool down on Force Charge and Predition requiring fury, I'm finding the lack of mobility a problem.

What I'm after is general advice on tactics for sub-level 55 PvP, please. All the vids I see cater for capped players. Any advice offered will be gratefully recieved. Thanks.

If you don't mind playing Rage, Obliterate is a pretty good short-range gap closer with a relatively short cooldown.

I play a Carnage build, the thinking being I can take down someone fast but like I said, it's the lack of mobility I'm looking for help on adapting to. It seems to have the worst mobility of any class. Whenever I force charge, I'm immediately battered away (and quite some distance since I'm now fighting people up to 21 levels above me) and because its cool down sucks and I'm inviarably slowed as a result. At level 32 (at time of writing) I only have Deadly throw which has poor distance and by the time I get in range I have insufficient rage left. I use Force Cammo to escape mobs and get myself out of trouble.

Please understand that I'm not moaning about the class, I simply want to understand the class since it's so much different to that which I'm used to playing.

I just don't get this class at all. I'm level 32 and I have no stuns, no slows, no roots, no push away and no way to remove periodic effects. Every other class does and I'm squishier than my Sorc or Sin or Shadow characters where at this level.

There is Crippling Slash to slow enemies. But don't worry, you have to wait until lvl 45, when you can learn Massacre (if you put all skill points in Carnage before that) Then you should put 2 points in Short Fuse, to improve Fury generation. Anyway, the sad truth is that Carnage is rather weak without Massacre.

There is Crippling Slash to slow enemies. But don't worry, you have to wait until lvl 45, when you can learn Massacre (if you put all skill points in Carnage before that) Then you should put 2 points in Short Fuse, to improve Fury generation. Anyway, the sad truth is that Carnage is rather weak without Massacre.

So should I change to Anhiliate in the interium?

So should I change to Anhiliate in the interium?

No, get Short Fuse and defensive forms...u get to use predation every 7.5 seconds...that's what I used to do during lowbies since your dmg output isn't nowhere near as great without massacre. Plus predation benefits ur whole team. Try doing a WZ where all you do is use predation...half the melee won't even touch you. I personally got Short Fuse and Enraged Slash first, its true I only got Massacre at 50, but I was doing just fine spamming Vicious Slash, since Enraged Slash allowed me to use more attacks in general my DPS output was better than if I had Massacre without Enraged Slash. Coz Massacre costing 3 rage and the alacrity buff from berserk make u rage starved in literally 3 seconds since ur GCD is around 1.05s and each Massacre costs 3 Rage...also never charge into a fight...go there by foot (first let people actually start fighting each other and get distracted) so that when they knock you back you can Charge immediately after that.

This is what my build looked like at 39. Keep Overwhelm and Displacement as the last talents to max, you'll be left with 1 point at lv 55 which you should put into Narrowed Hatred, this way you get 95% accuracy from you skill tree and don't need to get any on item modifications.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#100bcZRGMRRror.3

So should I change to Anhiliate in the interium?

Annihilation is one of the worst PVP DPS specs, period. The only things worse than Annihilation in PVP right now are Concealment and Madness (assassin) It has all of the problems you're having with carnage, except it has no burst. If you're going to re-spec, go with Rage. Rage has obliterate which is basically a second leap, and it has Overpower which causes your main attacks to lower the cool down of both leaps. This will fix your range problems.

The main thing you need to know about marauders in PVP is that Cloak of Pain is essential and you will constantly die if you're not always using it.

Annihilation is one of the worst PVP DPS specs, period. The only things worse than Annihilation in PVP right now are Concealment and Madness (assassin) It has all of the problems you're having with carnage, except it has no burst. If you're going to re-spec, go with Rage. Rage has obliterate which is basically a second leap, and it has Overpower which causes your main attacks to lower the cool down of both leaps. This will fix your range problems.

 

The main thing you need to know about marauders in PVP is that Cloak of Pain is essential and you will constantly die if you're not always using it.

Only Obliterate man Not Force Charge

Only Obliterate man Not Force Charge

Whoops, you are correct.

So I'm screwed until the mid-40s then? Perhaps Bioware should look at moving some of the stuff around to make it more balanced when leveling.

Look at my suggestion on how to PvP until you get good stuff. I delayed Massacre but that predation spam definitely made up for it, helps you whole team, especially your tanks since it boosts their defense chance by 10%. In addition, if you decide to spam berserk, you can do it much more often, and if you stick to predation, melee fighters will have a very hard time focusing you.

Nothing and I mean absolutely nothing about this class makes sense. Sith Juggernaught - tank, supposed to sit there soak up damage, gets Force Push. Maruader who is squishier than a Blancmange doesn't. In addition, my one and only stun comes at level 42, which, with the exception of the Warrior's mirror, is later than every othre class, including the Sin/Shadow class which can not only pump out more damage at lower levels but can also tank a hell of a lot better.

As I said, nothing about the Mara/Sent makes sense. Glass Cannon? More like a Glass Pea Shooter.

While anni sucks at end game.. in the 1-30 bracket (which i assume you are at if you just started leveling) its imo the best spec to run after 20. Since with overload saber/deadly saber its quite strong when played well especially when you get obfuscate/pacify as well. The other trees are more useful yes but they don't really mature enough until 40s IMO. Best classes in 10-30 bracket are probably assault/pyro troopers, anni/watchman sent/mara, sniper/slinger and sorc/sage.

Worst class there is without a doubt, juggernaut/guardian. It has not many dps tools or many tanking tools best thing i found was tanking and guarding/taunting (when you got to like lvl 16 or whatever to do that) but its squishy as hell since healers have next to no abilitys yet.

Nothing and I mean absolutely nothing about this class makes sense. Sith Juggernaught - tank, supposed to sit there soak up damage, gets Force Push. Maruader who is squishier than a Blancmange doesn't. In addition, my one and only stun comes at level 42, which, with the exception of the Warrior's mirror, is later than every othre class, including the Sin/Shadow class which can not only pump out more damage at lower levels but can also tank a hell of a lot better.

 

As I said, nothing about the Mara/Sent makes sense. Glass Cannon? More like a Glass Pea Shooter.

You get:

Saber Ward at level 4. Increases melee/ranged defense by 50% and reduces damage from Force/Tech attacks by 25%. 12 second duration. 3 min cooldown.

Rebuke at level 10. 20% less damage and reflects damage back to attacker. Can last up to 30 seconds. 60 second cooldown.

Pacify at level 26. Reduce target's melee/ranged accuracy by 90% for 6 seconds duration. 60 second cooldown.

In the Combat tree, you get:

Defensive Forms: increases your speed by 15% in Ataru form.

Defensive Roll: 30% less damage from AoEs.

Fleetfooted: Using Force Camuflage has a 100% chance to clear movement-impairing effects and increases the movement speed bonus of Transcendence by 30%.

Saber Screen: Ataru procs will increase defense by 2%, stacks up to 3 times (for a total of 6% defense).

Ummmm... what was it you were complaining about again?

You get:

Saber Ward at level 4. Increases melee/ranged defense by 50% and reduces damage from Force/Tech attacks by 25%. 12 second duration. 3 min cooldown.

So does everyone.

Rebuke at level 10. 20% less damage and reflects damage back to attacker. Can last up to 30 seconds. 60 second cooldown.

There's no such thing as Rebuke on the Maruder. You're mistaking it for Cloak of Pain. You're still squishy at low levels even with this. The problems I'm facing aren't with tanking, they're with mobility. Everyone is faster than me.

Pacify at level 26. Reduce target's melee/ranged accuracy by 90% for 6 seconds duration. 60 second cooldown.

There's no such thing as Pacify. It's called Obsfucate. Again, you're mistaking not only the names but also the issue I'm asking advice about - mobility.

Fleetfooted: Using Force Camuflage has a 100% chance to clear movement-impairing effects and increases the movement speed bonus of Transcendence by 30%.

No trace of this either.

Add to this, no way to remove Periodic effects, no knock back and no root, all from a class that isn't designed to tank, it's designed to take down other classes fast. If I get mobbed and Force Cammo is on cool down, I'm done for. If you can't keep them still, if you can't catch them because unlike Force Speed, Predition requires Rage and only provides a 50% speed boost compared to 150% for FS.

Ummmm... what was it you were complaining about again?

I'm not complaining, I'm saying the class doesn't make sense. There's a difference and if you want me to listen to your advice, try posting the correct names for the things you're giving advice about, until then, all you're doing is confusing the issue further. What I'm saying here is from all my research, this class is meant to be a hit and run class - get in, hit hard, get out before you're mobbed, but the abilities available to you just don't support that. Where is the harm in making Force Push a Warrior ability rather than specific to the Jugg? Where's the harm in being able to remove Periodic effects? All other classes can.

I have characters from all the other classes. This is the only one I can't get to grips with and so, to get back to the original request, I'm after tactical advice in terms of game play when under level 45 because all videos involve capped characters.

There's no such thing as Rebuke on the Maruder. You're mistaking it for Cloak of Pain. You're still squishy at low levels even with this. The problems I'm facing aren't with tanking, they're with mobility. Everyone is faster than me.

 

There's no such thing as Pacify. It's called Obsfucate. Again, you're mistaking not only the names but also the issue I'm asking advice about - mobility.

His point stands regardless of sentinel or marauder ability names.

Add to this, no way to remove Periodic effects, no knock back and no root, all from a class that isn't designed to tank, it's designed to take down other classes fast. If I get mobbed and Force Cammo is on cool down, I'm done for. If you can't keep them still, if you can't catch them because unlike Force Speed, Predition requires Rage and only provides a 50% speed boost compared to 150% for FS.

1. periodic effects, you are not a healing class.

2. you are a melee class, knocking someone back is counter productive.

3. no root? Go read the tooltip of force charge for me.

4. it's spelled predation and does not require rage.

5. just about everyone is "done for" when they get mobbed.

6. force speed lasts 2 seconds, predation lasts 10. You also have a spammable slow unlike assassins.

His point stands regardless of sentinel or marauder ability names..

His point doesn't stand because the issue is not one of tanking ability. It's about mobility, specifically mobiliity within PvP.

1. periodic effects, you are not a healing class.

2. you are a melee class, knocking someone back is counter productive.

3. no root? Go read the tooltip of force charge for me.

4. it's spelled predation and does not require rage.

5. just about everyone is "done for" when they get mobbed.

6. force speed lasts 2 seconds, predation lasts 10. You also have a spammable slow unlike assassins.

I really don't understand the toxic nature of this community, I really don't. Why try to turn this in to an argument when I'm a player seeking advice? But to address your points.

1. Sins/Shadows aren't healers and they get to remove periodcs.

2. So is a Jugg/Guardian and they get Force Push.

3. Fair enough, I hadn't considered that.

4. Regardless of spelling, it's not on a cool down which is my point. I confused Rage with Fury.

5. Not true. As a Sin or Shadow (both I have at level 55) I can use Kockback. As a Guardian/Jugg (both I have at level 55) I can use Force Push. All four are melee.

6. 2 seconds on a cool down and is three times faster. Fair enough on the spammable slow.

Now when you look at points 1, 2, 4 and 5, hopefully you can see my confusion. It's contradictory in nature.

His point doesn't stand because the issue is not one of tanking ability. It's about mobility, specifically mobiliity within PvP.

Mobility... Let's see:

Predation. At level 22. Consumes 30 Rage and provides 50% speed increase *AND* increases melee/randed defense by 10%.

Defensive Forms. 1st tier Talent. Increases movement speed in Ataru form by 15%.

Unbound (Fleetfooted for Sentinels ). 5th tier Talent. Removes movement-impairing effects and increases the movement bonus of Predation by 30% (to a total of 65% Predation speed).

I can understand that "right now" you don't get the class. But, the tools are there for your use. Read your ability tooltips. Think how they can be used . If you need to SURVIVE do what you need to SURVIVE. If you need to DPS do what you need to DPS.

You mention your other classes. I've played them all as well. They all have their advantages and disadvantages. You've learned to play with them. You'll learn to do the same with the Marauder. Stick with it. The utility/survivability/damage are all there! You just need to "click" to the class.

Don't give up .

Regarding the roots (or lack of ):

Force Charge has a root attached to it (that you can increase with the Stagger talent) and Overwhelm (tier 6 Talent) will root the player for the duration of Ravage. Displacement (a tier 4 talent) will also allow Deadly Throw to root the target for 3 seconds.

Additionally, while not a root, Crippling Slash (that you get at level 16) will slow a target by 50% for 12 seconds (that's 12 seconds! ). It can also be reapplied at will and only costs 2 Rage.

As for having Push on the Juggernaut. When you use Push it resets the cooldown on Force Charge allowing you to use it again... keeping you in melee range...

Again, stick with the Marauder. You'll "click" with it soon enough.

I really don't understand the toxic nature of this community, I really don't. Why try to turn this in to an argument when I'm a player seeking advice? But to address your points.

It's not. You're here asking for advice and are getting it. Just because you don't like the answers and/or the class still doesn't make sense to *you*, doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the rest of us who do understand the class and do enjoy it.

Fleetfooted = Unbound

Root on Ravage.

Root on deadly throw.

At level 42, just as all warriors get, you will have an aoe mezz. on top of your force choke.

Carnage marauders have some of the best tools to stay on target.

Snip

If you think every class should be like an assassin, stick to playing an assassin.

Again, stick with the Marauder. You'll "click" with it soon enough.

Thanks for the constructive reply but my point stands. Marauder is melee, just like the Jugg but the Marauder is about doing damage, not soaking it up. If any of the two sub classes should have force push, it should be the Maurauder because it also immobilises the target for a couple of seconds, something you don't have to worry about when wearing heavy armour? Understand my reasoning when I describe it as a contradiction?

It's not. You're here asking for advice and are getting it. Just because you don't like the answers and/or the class still doesn't make sense to *you*, doesn't mean there is anything wrong with the rest of us who do understand the class and do enjoy it..

It's nothing to do with not liking the advice, it's to do with his blatant attempt to cause an argument. Pulling me up over a minor spelling mistake is nothing other than nit picking in an attempt to get a rise out of me. Most of the replies have been helpful, his was not.

 

It's nothing to do with not liking the advice, it's to do with his blatant attempt to cause an argument. Pulling me up over a minor spelling mistake is nothing other than nit picking in an attempt to get a rise out of me. Most of the replies have been helpful, his was not.

Why, I wouldn't have "pulled you over", but seeing you are such a stickler for correct ability names, I figured you'd appreciate it.