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WTB, w/ coins, alternate ani's for Consular project and throw - no more junkyard jedi

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion > Cartel Market Suggestions
WTB, w/ coins, alternate ani's for Consular project and throw - no more junkyard jedi

Dyvim's Avatar


Dyvim
01.30.2014 , 10:55 PM | #1
Edit: Updating original post to be more concise.

This proposal is for alternate animations, purchasable with Cartel Coins, for two consular skills, project and telekinetic throw. The underlying functions and stats for these skills would remain UNCHANGED. With the mirror design paradigm of this game in mind, where identical or like powers simply had new animations slapped on top of them in order to mirror classes, the concept of alternate animations seems entrenched into this game already. Project and Throw currently have snicker-worthy junk, rocks and pebbles animations that strike many as thoroughly un-jedi like and unpowerful. Moreover, in contrast with the lightning on the sith side, the coolness factor gap is huge. There have been complaints and dissatisfaction with these junk animations and the theme it creates for jedi consular's since the earliest days of beta.

With all the alternate animations for things like out-of combat rejuvenation, the cartel market is the perfect place to allow players to customize the look and feel of their jedi AWAY from a junk tossing, pebble throwing fred flintsone, WoW-ish earth shaman reject. Also, people that are happy with the current animations could keep them.

While there are MANY possibilities, I have limited my proposed replacements to ani’s that are already in the game, in some way, shape or form. I am also trying to focus on canon abilities that are more light side oriented than junk throwing, which we saw every sith do in the movies, much more than jedi, and more than sith lightning even.

The proposed replacements:

Project:

1) Force Burst: The Inquisitor companion, Ashara Zavros, a fallen padawan, has a skill called Force Burst. It is the best mirror animation for Shock I have seen in the game. It is instant, has a quick hand gesture, and has no projectile...the target is hit with force energy...almost exactly like what shock does....it is described in the tooltip as "A powerful burst of force energy that deals kinetic damage...". Here is a photo that compares the two, Force Burst and Shock, side by side:
http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/8...rstvsshock.jpg

2) Electric Judgment (aka Emerald Fire) - green, more concentrated sparcs or arcs of lightning would be very cool, and are canon (but rare) for jedi. Nice analog for Shock. Picture a more concentrated arc...more focused. A green colored version of the Trooper's Ion Pulse, for example. Canon reference to it for info… http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Electric_Judgment

"A Jedi sufficiently strong in the Force can be trained to produce a facsimile, but not true Sith lightning." ―Darth Plagueis

Concept for what it could look like as an arc:
http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/...EmeraldArc.jpg

3) Saber Dance: Replace project with a saber throw on steroids...motion blurred and bad ***....consulars are the ones that can throw things and yet they can’t throw one of the MOST deadly things in the universe, that happens to ALREADY be in THEIR HAND - their lightsaber???? People have long complained that cons/sages use their saber almost NONE. Well here is a chance to change that.... That makes sense...also, a double-bladed throw for shadows would rock. Also, if the devs were worried about distinguishing it from other saber throws, again, this should be more refined....so let them throw the hilt and ignite the blade at impact, or some other such affect of being able to remotely ignite the blade. Would look awesome and distinguish it from other throws. We saw Yoda impale a clone with his saber in ROTS, so imagine a saber throw where the consular ignites the blade as it reaches the target and impales the target with it, then the con pulls the saber back to his hand....nice concept, as lore based as it gets.

In fact, it is in this game already, again, as a cut scene in the Esseles, except it is done by the sith end boss that throws and chokes the trooper up against a wall before he throws the saber, ignites it as it strikes the trooper to impale him, then yanks it back...so subtract the choking and sith face paint, and you get the idea.


4) FORCE TREMOR: I knew there was a reason I liked the name Force Tremor...it is ALREADY in the GAME....AGAIN. This time Kira has it, and it looks very good. I think it is a PBAoE, but the animation itself would be AWESOME as a retooled Project replacement. Kira makes a very cool Hand motion, with force effects, where she reaches up into the air, then slams her hand down...and then the ground quakes and splits as the affected target has particles around him....here is a pic of the start and the end to refresh people's memories:

http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/...orceTremor.jpg


Telekinetic Throw (pebblestorm):

1) Force (Burst) Throw: It turns out that the sith side is full of all the good jedi ani's...the Agent has a companion named Raina Temple...and she is force sensitive...and she ALSO has a power called Force Burst...with ANOTHER animation, different from Ashara's. And this animation is exactly what some people had envisioned when suggesting a pebblestorm, err Throw, replacement...it needs to be looped to pulse as a channeled effect, right now it is instant. The particles in the animation could also stand to be more substantial, or beefed up....
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/1658/forceburst.jpg


2) Emerald Fire: (version of Electric Judgment) There is some variance in the idea of what EJ could look like….Plo Kloon’s was yellow…Luke Skywalker's was green…so anyway, it would be easy enough to have a Throw replacement that was more Emerald Fire Lightning like, and would like like this:
http://i1167.photobucket.com/albums/...meraldFire.jpg

3) FORCE TREMOR (channeled): From Ultimas, an idea I'll label Force Tremor: "I say a good replacement for Telekinetic Throw would be a mini-Force Quake that targets a single enemy, Channeled damage and a more bad*** animation. I'm all in on the project replacement. EDIT: I added Kira's Force Tremor above as another option for a project replacement, but this would be a great channeled ani, too, as I see it as a combination of Force Quake and Force Tremor....


How it would work:

Here is a simple, dirty mockup of what the "p" Abilities window would look like with Emerald Fire (Electric Judgment) and Saber Dance on the Consular tab - they could just as easily be on the Legacy tab:

http://imageshack.com/a/img585/8482/m4im.jpg

I referenced Emerald Fire/Electric Judgment above and linked to canon info about it - EF is an obvious alternate for Throw/pebblestorm. Saber Dance would be an alternate for Project. As the consular version of a saber throw, its hallmark would be MORE elegance and control than the knight versions, who are not as adept at telekinetics. These alternative animations would be slottable on your toolbars, like any other skill. You could even put an alternate right next to its original. It would be the same things as putting two copies of the same skills next to each other...they share the same cooldown, etc. They are functionally identical, they just LOOK different because they have a different animation.

For example, Project has the upheaval talent, where you get a chance to pull up a second piece of magical junk for additional damage...Saber Dance would handle this with a quick boomerang second hit, after its first hit on the target. Without the second hit proc, it would just return normally. With Force Burst as a Project alternate, the double hit would look like a "double pump", just like Shock does now. Electric Judgment would handle it with a second arc of force power.

And again, these are OPTIONAL, PURCHASABLE...win win win. And there is no reason you couldn't provide players with multiple options...the game is aging, we have all seen the same ani's a BILLION times....why not give players some choice and a VERY cool way to customize their toons a bit? And why not start with the most lackluster ani's?


Original Post:

Always said put your money where you mouth is...I would be perfectly happy to pay for a set of alternate animations for project and throw so my jedi is NOT a junk, rock and pebble thrower. Why do they bother me? Because in the movies, Sith throw junk, all the time, all of them, much more than jedi, and in fact in the movies sith throw junk more than they use lightning, even. It also strikes me as inelegant and sloppy, like a temper tantrum - very darkside. Some love it. The people that like the fred flintstone rock and gravel earth shaman mode can remain in bliss. This would be alternate ani's for abilities that we are already used to seeing some companions use...more on that in a bit.

When I see in the game all the alternate ani's now for the out of combat recuperate/regen (bacta tanks, imperial healing bed, gree digitizer, etc., etc.,) it really strikes me as doable for EAware to start making money off people that would like to see some different combat animations for skills, especially bread and butter skills that we have all seen millions of times. The junk and pebble throwing for jedi has been WILDLY unpopular for many players ever since the earliest days of beta, and has been a constant source of derision and snickering. The coolness factor compared to lightning is non-existent. The lack of a truly interactive environment makes throwing skills silly on many levels, and at the end of the day, even if the game engine could do it right, without magically conjuring junk out of the ground, jedi STILL are not junk throwers.
...
So yes, this would take some dev time, but yes, I am willing to pay for it. Others would be too. So instead of a new gsf skin or whatever, or random packs that have worse odds than a lottery for actually getting something you want, I would love to buy something like this that made the game feel more like a jedi experience for me. And yes, it would be completely optional. I would foresee it as another ability icon in my powers window, with the EXACT same stats as the old ones, just a new icon on a new button that fires a new ani on top of an old ability. There are plenty of other ideas for replacing the junk, rocks, and pebbles, but the above are very straightforward.
The Crystal is the Heart of the Blade.
The Heart is the Crystal of the Jedi.
The Jedi is the Crystal of the Force.
The Force is the Blade of the Heart.
All are Intertwined...the Crystal, the Blade, the Jedi...

theUndead's Avatar


theUndead
01.31.2014 , 05:30 AM | #2
I like your idea and think it could work. It's just what if people like me like the pebbles?
The Hellion Legacy (Harbinger)
Referal Link
Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post
As theUndead mentioned, I can't exactly spell out all of our policies in depth, but that should hopefully cover your concerns.

RowanThursday's Avatar


RowanThursday
01.31.2014 , 12:22 PM | #3
While personally I love project- and I'd like the PROPER project animation (pre stupid balance nerf) back as one of the purchaseable options, I can easily see that others don't, and I'm not too sold on Summon Gravel... sorry, telekinetic throw, so I'd support this as an option.

How would you implement it? I'm not sure 'make this player's skill X' trigger these animations in everybody's client instead of default ones' is something that could be implemented quite like that- It'd mean that everytime someone used the skill the game would have to perform an additional check on which animation to use before propagating it to every client in viewing distance. It would also make it tricky to switch back.

My preferred method - pay attention bioware ;-) - would be you buy the SKILL - like rocket boost or others like that. Exact same stats as project or gravel throw, and shared cooldown, so you can just swap it out on your action bar. No balance issues, you're not gaining anything gameplay wise other than variety and - I THINK- answers what you wanted from the option?

And yes, if you had room on your taskbar through some miracle of better shadow skill organization than I can manage, you could have - both- project and force burst - or whatever, and use whichever you preferred. Why not? Other classes could have similar alternatives for equality, and shared cooldown would mean zero combat advantage or disadvantage to having both.
"Next time you come to a rough choice in the dark, and think to yourself 'No one's gonna know'... imagine you've got yourself a mirror and hold it up, think like you're lookin' in the glass. That's who's gonna know."
-- Captain Melody January of the Freighter Hestia's Dawn.

Dyvim's Avatar


Dyvim
01.31.2014 , 02:45 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by theUndead View Post
I like your idea and think it could work. It's just what if people like me like the pebbles?
Nothing. You keep the pebbles. Remember, this is a purchasable alternate animation. You don't buy it, nothing changes. You buy it, don't like it, nothing changes...Basically I would see it showing up in your Abilities window (hit "p" key), under one of the tabs...perhaps Legacy, or Jedi Consular, or they could make a new tab and call it Cartel. Either way, on that tab, it would be a slottable ability, just like project, or throw is now. If you choose to slot it on your action bar and use it, after you buy it, fine. If you don't like it, you don't have to use it. If you don't buy it, nothing changes anyway.
The Crystal is the Heart of the Blade.
The Heart is the Crystal of the Jedi.
The Jedi is the Crystal of the Force.
The Force is the Blade of the Heart.
All are Intertwined...the Crystal, the Blade, the Jedi...

Dyvim's Avatar


Dyvim
01.31.2014 , 02:51 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by RowanThursday View Post
While personally I love project- and I'd like the PROPER project animation (pre stupid balance nerf) back as one of the purchaseable options, I can easily see that others don't, and I'm not too sold on Summon Gravel... sorry, telekinetic throw, so I'd support this as an option.

How would you implement it?...

My preferred method - pay attention bioware ;-) - would be you buy the SKILL - like rocket boost or others like that. Exact same stats as project or gravel throw, and shared cooldown, so you can just swap it out on your action bar. No balance issues, you're not gaining anything gameplay wise other than variety and - I THINK- answers what you wanted from the option?

And yes, if you had room on your taskbar through some miracle of better shadow skill organization than I can manage, you could have - both- project and force burst - or whatever, and use whichever you preferred. Why not? Other classes could have similar alternatives for equality, and shared cooldown would mean zero combat advantage or disadvantage to having both.
EXACTLY. Exactly what I tried to describe in my last paragraph. Hit the "p" key, bring up your abilities window, and it would be a slottable skill, identical in EVERY way, functionally, to the original project or throw, just with different icon and different animation...but with the SAME cooldown, etc. So theoretically you could slot both. It could be found on the consular tab, where project and throw are at now, or it could be on the Legacy tab, purchasable with cartel coins through legacy (along with a legacy level requirement if they wanted, whatever), or they could make a NEW "Cartel" tab....whatever. Point is, it would be a slottable skill, located where all the other skills are stored. And you could choose to slot it and use it, OR not.
The Crystal is the Heart of the Blade.
The Heart is the Crystal of the Jedi.
The Jedi is the Crystal of the Force.
The Force is the Blade of the Heart.
All are Intertwined...the Crystal, the Blade, the Jedi...

MirrimFaranth's Avatar


MirrimFaranth
01.31.2014 , 03:34 PM | #6
Please make this happen and take my money. Now.

I have always hated the Project and Telekinetic Throw animations. They make me want to play Imp.

Heck, I would even re-roll, just so I could have a Shadow and a Sage that never had to throw from the junk pile...lol.
"It is such a quiet thing, to fall. But far more terrible is to admit it." ― Darth Traya

RowanThursday's Avatar


RowanThursday
01.31.2014 , 04:24 PM | #7
This might be an answer to one thing various people have been asking for since release- option for dark side Jedi (or, inversely, light side sith) to use the opposing faction animations. Allow- amongst other animations, "shock" and "force lightning" available to Jedi characters by cartel purchase - with the restriction "Only usable by Jedi Consular, only usable at Dark IV and above". Conversely, allow Sinquisitors of light IV and above to access Project and Summon Gravel.
"Next time you come to a rough choice in the dark, and think to yourself 'No one's gonna know'... imagine you've got yourself a mirror and hold it up, think like you're lookin' in the glass. That's who's gonna know."
-- Captain Melody January of the Freighter Hestia's Dawn.

Dyvim's Avatar


Dyvim
01.31.2014 , 04:33 PM | #8
Here is a simple, dirty mockup of what the "p" Abilities window would look like with Emerald Fire (Electric Judgment) and Saber Dance on the Consular tab:

http://imageshack.com/a/img585/8482/m4im.jpg

I referenced Emerald Fire/Electric Judgment above and linked to canon info about it - EF is an obvious alternate for Throw/pebblestorm. Saber Dance would be an alternate for Project. As the consular version of a saber throw, its hallmark would be MORE elegance and control than the knight versions, who are not as adept at telekinetics.

For example, Project has the upheaval talent, where you get a chance to pull up a second piece of magical junk for additional damage...Saber Dance would handle this with a quick boomerang second hit, after its first hit on the target. Without the second hit proc, it would just return normally. With Force Burst as a Project alternate, the double hit would look like a "double pump", just like Shock does now.
The Crystal is the Heart of the Blade.
The Heart is the Crystal of the Jedi.
The Jedi is the Crystal of the Force.
The Force is the Blade of the Heart.
All are Intertwined...the Crystal, the Blade, the Jedi...

Dyvim's Avatar


Dyvim
01.31.2014 , 04:43 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by RowanThursday View Post
This might be an answer to one thing various people have been asking for since release- option for dark side Jedi (or, inversely, light side sith) to use the opposing faction animations. Allow- amongst other animations, "shock" and "force lightning" available to Jedi characters by cartel purchase - with the restriction "Only usable by Jedi Consular, only usable at Dark IV and above". Conversely, allow Sinquisitors of light IV and above to access Project and Summon Gravel.
In some ways that would be an improvement, however, I don't think the devs would go for it because they want distinction in pvp...that is why I have tailored my proposal the way I have. No one will think Force Burst (either version) or green emerald fire/lightning is coming from a sith. They would be as immediately distinctive to consulars as purple lightning is to sith inqs now. That may not be as important to the devs as it was, there has been a lot of turnover, but who knows.

Also, I'm not sure I would make those distinctions....palpitane, dooku, and vader were as evil/darkside as you get, and they chunked junk non-stop. Also, electric judgment or emerald fire IS NOT darkside necessarily, and force burst/saber dance definitely aren't darksidish....and there is definitely nothing inherently lightsided about junk throwing, in fact, just the opposite...darksiders loved it in every canon movie. Also, if you recall, I believe color crystals were originally tied into light/dark affiliation (red required dark) and the devs moved away from that in favor of diversity and player choice. The same should hold here, IMO.

I would rather see it tied into the legacy, if anything, with the emphasis on GIVING players options...some imps don't like/are tired of lightning...as a second step, they could give them a chunk a clunker, again purchaseable through the cartel market, with legacy req's, but with a DIFFERENT table of junk to chunk....more darkside choices, like jagged pieces of metal, torso's and arms of different armor suits, functioning droids instead of droid chassis, kittens, jawas, ewoks, whatever....lol. Just a completely different table of projectiles. NOW THAT would work, IMO. As far as pebblestorm, Im not sure why anyone would want it in any version...lol, but Im sure you could come up with a variant with something "darker" than pebbles.

But let's keep the focus on fixing the consular craptasms for now so jedi aren't restricted to junk throwing, ala some twisted, darksided Sanford and Son...lol. Lightning is much much much MORE popular and has a much larger coolness factor. Plus it is impossible to argue that it isn't appropriate for sith to use ALL the time, every chance they get. The need for alternates to it simply aren't as great as for consular. But yes, there is no reason EAware couldn't roll out some new combat animations for the different classes for their most common skills to breath some new life into the cinematic combat of the game, which has become stale and boring after several years.

I know the animations are labor intensive, that is why I have suggested re-using existing ones with tweaks in the four examples I have cited (Ashara's Force Burst, Raina' Force Burst, Emerald Fire, and Saber Dance), and why I have proposed making them cartel market items so EAware can make money off of them directly and immediately.
The Crystal is the Heart of the Blade.
The Heart is the Crystal of the Jedi.
The Jedi is the Crystal of the Force.
The Force is the Blade of the Heart.
All are Intertwined...the Crystal, the Blade, the Jedi...

Malister's Avatar


Malister
02.02.2014 , 07:20 AM | #10
You have my support, my good sir.
<The Aethon Legacy>