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COOL ! premades already ruining starfighter

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion
COOL ! premades already ruining starfighter

tekhiun's Avatar


tekhiun
01.01.2014 , 11:05 AM | #31
Somehow i posted twice here, ignore this.
Star Wars: Attack of the Cartel.

Tsillah's Avatar


Tsillah
01.01.2014 , 11:50 AM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by tekhiun View Post
This is why they dont separate premade from pugs, most of the players just want an easy win. If they were playing against premades and winning less they would probably stop playing altogether, just sad imo.
Not entirely true. If you had separate queues, then people going into premade matches would lose people who then can only go into random teams. So they can't premake and mess things up in the solo queue.

But isn't this just a general PvP problem? Most people who lose a lot either don't care and keep sucking at it or quit cause their ego is hurt.

It's much better to have some play modes with objectives that can be had. SWTOR has just settled for domination and forced team death match. Huttbal and Voidstar are much more interesting even if some people hate them. But really they should get rid of the domination format altogether. It's the worst type of map in my view and it makes people get bored or stupid. Sadly it's been BW's favourite mode so far and it's the one mode that creates the most problems.
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Beltane's Avatar


Beltane
01.01.2014 , 12:10 PM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by Helig View Post
The sad part isn't that he can't/doesn't want to make friends. The sad part is calling people you play online with "friends".
This is such a ludicrous comment I can't even properly express it.

Considering the number of people who use the internet as a social outlet and the fact MMOs as a whole have a myriad of social tools I think you're in the minority with not considering people online friends just because they're online.

It's the year 2014 bro. You don't have to be sitting in the same room with someone to like them.

Eyesmindassassin's Avatar


Eyesmindassassin
01.01.2014 , 12:14 PM | #34
Don't like premades, form a premade or leave. I premade all day with a team of fully upgraded ships and voice chat. We never lose and it's fun smashing bad players and casuals with no or few ship upgrades and no voice chat. If you separate the queues, premades like mine (99.9% of all premades) will just stop queueing altogether rather than have to lose to better premades. BioWare needs to keep it like it is where premades like mine can farm easy comms on solo queuers like you. Like I said, if you don't like it form your own premade or stop playing. Whining will get you nothing but our smug disdain for your ilk.

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
01.01.2014 , 12:17 PM | #35
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Although I generally agree with your feelings on this, I still think it would be better to have random warzones where you can only q as solo and a separate q for premade teams. In the end there is a definite advantage to having both. What BW's problem is though in my view is that there isn't enough PvP going on to be able to separate it into different activities.
MMO players have very little tolerance to anything these days. No tolerance to waiting, no tolerance to being outplayed by teamwork, no tolerance for consequences of their actions/inactions, no tolerance for working toward goals and objectives, etc. etc. etc. And yes, this is a generalization and does not reflect every player, but it is both valid and appropriate generalization when talking about the wider player base of the genre we call MMOs.

This is not a Bioware problem, nor is it a problem in any way unique to this MMO.

It's a genre wide community play style problem that there is no way for Bioware to effectively address. If they separate the queues, people complain that queue times are too long. If they maintain a single queue, then players complain that they are getting rolled by premades.
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MazakMatsura's Avatar


MazakMatsura
01.01.2014 , 12:31 PM | #36
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Honestly, people may love or hate GW1, but that game had a much better idea how to handle PvP and offer different formats for it.
^ This. I came directly from Guild Wars 1 to here, Every single PvP format was a premade group of some kind, (even in RA you could synch ) You had to be actually good to succeed, there wasn't a bolster, expertise, or any kind of gear gap. In all honesty, ToR could take some huge lessons from Guild Wars 1. But I digress.

Why gimp yourself by solo queuing in the first place?

Playing with the same folks (premade) you'll better understand their individual quirks, strengths and weaknesses. I encourage everyone to form groups, kick your own game up a notch, and take some responsibility. If you want to win at PvP of any kind, get a team and practice.

tldr:
Don't expect to queue, jump in and rack up wins VS someone who spent 5 minutes of effort. That's just a stupid mentality.

P.S. Since this was about Galactic Starfighter, I'll share a tip. A few of us are using tack balls, where we drilled into the ball itself, and put about a inch of threaded 8-32 rod, since there is no joystick support. Lil funky to get the hang of, but miles ahead of regular mouse control.
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Sangrar's Avatar


Sangrar
01.01.2014 , 12:45 PM | #37
How do you even know if its a premade in GSF, you can't even see the guildnames!

Yeah there are probably a few premade groups out there but its not as bad as people seem to think, many times it just seems like "I keep losing it has to be a premade, can't possibly be just me or my teams fault we lost". Seriously though, people blow things too much out of proportions.
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EzioMessi's Avatar


EzioMessi
01.01.2014 , 01:00 PM | #38
I can see how using VoIP might be an advantage in GSF. In warzones, using VoIP does what, give you 1 second headstart while calling incs? Solo players can still type in "inc 1 grass" as fast, if not a teeny bit slower than I can tell people over VoIP.

Problem with GSF is, if you're stationary near an enemy, you're dead. The only time when you can call incs by typing is when you're in spawn, and if you were guarding a satellite and are now in spawn, it's already too late. Being able to PTT and say it to groupmates is a big plus, since you don't have to be stationary for it, and can even do it during a dogfight.

Now I'm not saying that ban premades from GSF Solo Battle GSF. VoIP is used by what, 5% of the premades? 10? No reason to punish the 90% that don't. And there *are* ways to counter this. Generally if there's too little pressure on one sat, it means there's tons of incs on the other sats. Also there's the fact that you can see any enemy that has been identified on your teammates' sensors which makes it easier to find where the incs are. Finally, the icon for the sat starts blinking when enemies come too close.

There are ways to help this though. For one, they could put an in-built VoIP software, with the option to mute idiots who will just use it to trash-talk. Or they could make all enemies visible to your teammates' sensors appear to all of us on the map as red dots. Either one of these could mitigate the issue of players using VoIP in GSF.

But a separate Premades-only queue? Nope. Never gonna work.
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Danylia's Avatar


Danylia
01.01.2014 , 01:10 PM | #39
Quote: Originally Posted by Sangrar View Post
How do you even know if its a premade in GSF, you can't even see the guildnames!

Yeah there are probably a few premade groups out there but its not as bad as people seem to think, many times it just seems like "I keep losing it has to be a premade, can't possibly be just me or my teams fault we lost". Seriously though, people blow things too much out of proportions.
To be honest, you have a point. I myself only assume that the same names in the same ships I mostly play against are a premade, but they may as well be just random people always queueing at the same time (and to explain, I don't mean this as sarcasm, I mean it genuinely). So when this issue comes up, I tend to generalize it as "matchmaking problem" rather than solely "premade problem".

Quote: Originally Posted by Eyesmindassassin View Post
Don't like premades, form a premade or leave. I premade all day with a team of fully upgraded ships and voice chat. We never lose and it's fun smashing bad players and casuals with no or few ship upgrades and no voice chat. If you separate the queues, premades like mine (99.9% of all premades) will just stop queueing altogether rather than have to lose to better premades. BioWare needs to keep it like it is where premades like mine can farm easy comms on solo queuers like you. Like I said, if you don't like it form your own premade or stop playing. Whining will get you nothing but our smug disdain for your ilk.
8/10, I actually smiled and would read again.
Quote: Originally Posted by Rafkin View Post
Last nights group finder was a mess. The short version is that two of the people were really bad but the tank was pretty good. After we called it I asked the tank if he wanted to queue up with me. He said "I'm eleven and I have to go to bed".
The one guy who knew what he was doing was eleven years old.

tekhiun's Avatar


tekhiun
01.01.2014 , 01:24 PM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by Tsillah View Post
Not entirely true. If you had separate queues, then people going into premade matches would lose people who then can only go into random teams. So they can't premake and mess things up in the solo queue.

But isn't this just a general PvP problem? Most people who lose a lot either don't care and keep sucking at it or quit cause their ego is hurt.

It's much better to have some play modes with objectives that can be had. SWTOR has just settled for domination and forced team death match. Huttbal and Voidstar are much more interesting even if some people hate them. But really they should get rid of the domination format altogether. It's the worst type of map in my view and it makes people get bored or stupid. Sadly it's been BW's favourite mode so far and it's the one mode that creates the most problems.
Didn't quite get what you meant on your first paragraph could you rephrase it ?

I agree that objective is much more fun, even so in large scale pvp. However pugs don't usually play that kind of pvp and the majority of them just want to kill kill kill kill. THe ideal solution would be to have several different queues for different type of play styles, however there is not a single server where the population is high enough that splitting queues or having a selective matchmaking system would not increase queue time. The solution would be x-server queues, but as it has been stated by the devs it is something that seems very hard to be implemented at the moment. The result is then either your premade or you pug, and there is nothing challenging about either cause the final outcome is pretty much determined before poeple jump out of the spawning area for the first time.

At launch I was playing in one of the top premades of my server, the result was that people did emoticons with our names and if we turned out to be in that warzone people just left, either that or we would win the match within 2-3 minutes (unless we started defending on voidstar), the result was that the members of that premade got bored and left the game, I am the only one that's still playing. They didnt even bothered returning for RWZ as they were already invested in another games.
Star Wars: Attack of the Cartel.