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Over-Priced GTN Items

Wefi's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:09 PM | #31
welcome to the free market.
Ex-SWG clientside Modder. Creator of Super Jedi. Fixing what is broken since 2004.

ikinai's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:10 PM | #32
Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
comment from a porevious post:

"On topic though. I've resubbed for a few short months now, and without trying to make credits I have about 10 mil. If there was an item I wanted and it was 50 mil I could play with credits in mind and gain that amount in short order. "

This is like spitting in all of our faces as it is a clearly obvious and total lie.
How is that a lie? I did a total of five dailies last night, while throwing snowballs and drinking a bottle of wine, and made nearly half a million. Had I concentrated on just doing dailies I probably would have made over a million last night just doing dailies. It really isn't hard to do, even I can do it. A drunken old lady, are you saying you aren't better at a video game than a drunken old lady?
I'll tell you what, then. Why don't you call me some time when you have no class?
--Rodney Dangerfield Back to School
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horrorfaneightys's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:12 PM | #33
Quote: Originally Posted by Elminster_cs View Post
Yeah of course is over the top i was just saying

I can also buy most of the thing, i have near to 60% of the whole collection and never spend a CC.
This is not the point, I think people have to sell better on the GTN
Lol my humour sensor obviously malfunctioned there.
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AlixMV's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:13 PM | #34
Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
People do not have an equally fair chance to acquire the items in question.
Yep, that's true. Some people are Premium subs and can accrue more than 350K credits. Some people don't have to work and have the time to play 100 hours a week grinding out credits through dailies. Some people work and use their money to buy oodles of Cartel Packs and either win the RNG lottery. Or they convert them into in game credits by selling stuff on the GTN. Some people are able to identify an untapped market and save up enough credits over time to acquire the high price items.

But, here's the secret: the system is not designed to be "fair" by your definitions of it.

Games are engineered around the understanding of human psychology, and what gamers want (and need) to continue playing are brass rings to strive for, or what a friend of mine dubbed "the Nintendo effect". Get the credits together to buy the new sword with better stats. Find out there's another sword with even better stats, work to acquire that. Wash, rinse, repeat.

They also want to be a special snowflake. They want to have the thing no one else has, or very few people have. What makes the Gree Red Sphere speeder so desirable? Revan's Mask? Their rarity.

When everyone can get whatever they want easily, no one is special. Everyone is the same. The game is vanilla. It's boring. People quit. And that's the last thing Bioware wants.

So some things are rare, and some people get them and others don't, and they sell things for exorbitant quantities of money--and get it. In a true free market economy, which this is, the only rule is supply vs. demand. "Fair" doesn't factor into the equation at all.

You don't have to agree with it. If you don't like it, then quit, simple as that. But continuing to QQ about it won't change a darn thing.
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TheNahash's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:14 PM | #35
I'm sorry but this whole post is absurd

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
I have read all of the posts here and I disagree with soem things. I don't want to dictate anyone's actions and I AGREE with anyone being able to sell for whatever price they want. I do NOT agree with: People do not have an equally fair chance to acquire the items in question.
But... they do.
You can farm dailies, craft and play the market and you can make 15mil. You don't want to spend that much time in the game? Excellent! I agree, it would be unhealthy. Then say goodbye to the expensive item you want. I don't understand why that's a problem.

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
The only way to get the items at this time in game would be to waste an absurdly large amount of real world money to even have an equally fair chance at the item.
No, they don't actually have to.
You don't want to spend that absurdly large amount of real world money? Don't.
You can make the credits by paying the price of your subscription and nothing else above and beyond that, by actually playing the game and its market. It will take you A LONG time but you'll make them.

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
The item should be available to be acquired in game some how or to be able to be purchased somehow in the game, but simply should not be only acquireable by having to pay someone (another player) an amount of money they do not deserve.
No it shouldn't. Players who've been here longer already have it and most of them also have the credits to buy it. And, I'm sorry if that sounds harsh, but people who've been doing something longer than you have should be rewarded by having access to things you don't. You can't seriously expect to start playing an MMO and have easy access to everything someone who's been in it for 2 years has, right?

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
Just make the items more readily available. I am putting the hate-bomb comments out of my mind here and focusing on the real problem at hand.
Again, there is no "real" problem. You see it as a problem because you want to buy something that's rare for a price that's convenient for you. For you, it's a problem but generally speaking, it's not because that's not how things work.
Revan's gear is a vanity set.
You don't NEED it. There are no super-powerful mods in it that would make it easier for you to play the game.
You like the way it looks and you WANT it.
There's a big difference there.
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Jeweledleah's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:15 PM | #36
none of those items are in any way, shape or form required to play the game.

they are fluff.

and as such, you are neither obligated to buy them, nor is seller obligated to price them in a way that you can afford.

think of it as.... Tiffany jewelry. is it ridiculously expensive? yes it is. is it worth it? that's debatable. should the company lower the prices so that more people could buy it? that is entirely up to them, but they certainly shouldn't be forced into it.

you are NOT entitled to everything you want, especially when the item you want is pure luxury to begin with.

and the most ironic thing is... unlike real life, people in SWTOR ,well subscribers anyways DO have a fair chance to acquire nearly any item they want. it may take some longer than the others, but you don't have to spend a single cartel coin on it. even if all you do is dailies (which is guaranteed income) - you can eventually make up enough. right now its easier then ever. the only items you cannot acquire are the founder items and anniversary items fro mthe aniversary that you weren't a part of. and IMO? that's absolutely fair.

ELRunninW's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:15 PM | #37
I remember seeing recently a thread about undercutting the prices on GTN, go figure.

In other news, the items you want will return to Cartel Market one day. Just wait for the occasion to have a chance winning them out of hundreds of packs.

Elminster_cs's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:19 PM | #38
Quote: Originally Posted by horrorfaneightys View Post
Lol my humour sensor obviously malfunctioned there.
hehehehe no I really have all the not over priced items most from pack two and three of course
Member of Dread Master. The Red Eclipse Italian Guild.

Andryah's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:19 PM | #39
Let's dissect this, objectively, a bit since you did take the high road and shrug off all the nonsense and take time to restate your opinion politely:

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
I don't want to dictate anyone's actions and I AGREE with anyone being able to sell for whatever price they want.
Maybe, but... that is exactly what you are doing effectively. You don't like player pricing on extremely rare items (the items you itemized ARE extremely rare, and in fact were always very rare even when the packs containing them were in open sale.

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
I do NOT agree with: People do not have an equally fair chance to acquire the items in question.
This statement is incongruent with MMOs in general. Why? How? Every MMO that uses loot itemization as part of it's core play mechanics ALWAYS has items in game (regardless of how they are dropped into the game servers economy) that are very rare, very coveted, and people willing to go to extreme lengths to acquire.

I understand the theme of your statement (which is accessibility to all), but it ignores one of the fundamentals of MMOs.. players love to covet and brag and display really hard to acquire items. Not all players, but many in fact do as part of their game play.

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
The only way to get the items at this time in game would be to waste an absurdly large amount of real world money to even have an equally fair chance at the item.
The extremely rare items you have picked as your talking points... were once, while still expensive, much easier to acquire through the GTN. Human nature, supply (limited) and demand (over the top on some items on the part of players) all play a factor here. IF the items in question were common, available to many for low effort (be time, or credits or cartel coins, or whatever) then they would by definition not be craved and desired in a manner that drives up prices between players. And you know what.. players would complain that everyone has everything and it's all too easy to acquire. So, inside MMOs, devs have to find a balance point somewhere.... some good things being easier to acquire, some extremely hard, and some so ugly/undesireable you cannot give them away.

Quote: Originally Posted by RPetrelli View Post
I am putting the hate-bomb comments out of my mind here and focusing on the real problem at hand.
So... let's ask for a bit more clarity..... what exactly IS the real problem at hand? Is it rarity of supply? Is it rarity coupled with extreme cravings on the part of players? Is it the method in which they are acquired.... (ie: random very rare drops from old cartel packs? I is it a desire for a more socialized "welfare epic" style loot model?

The fact is... in the context of the GTN....nothing sells if it is priced beyond a persons (any person on the server, you only need one daddy_war_bucks looking for the item to sell it) willingness to pay. Hence.. the item may never sell if priced out of the demand curve of the players. However, if these items do indeed sell at the prices you are objecting to.. then by definition.. they are not over priced, just priced at extreme premiums that are within the supply/demand mechanics of a particular server.

There are many extremely wealthy veteran players in this game (it is two years old now and making multiple millions of credits per day in game is not that difficult) who might think over a 30 million dollar price tag for a bet or boots or something... but having done so.. if they want it.. they may indeed buy it.

Clearly, items being listed for 1 Billion credits and such is just players in game trolling you with absurd pricing. But hey.. that may well be one of their mini-games.. and the game mechanics permit it. Someday they will get tired of it and sell the item off for market prices.

AND.. let's close with the sub-topic of "market prices". Market prices is one of my mini-games personally as I make most of my in game wealth playing the spreads in the market. In order to do so, I have to understand the actual market pricing (ie: pricing that reflects actual buyer perception of value) as I buy under priced items and resell them at market rate = 10% as my personal business model. Now, extremely rare items are hard to market price accurately as they are priced more on emotion and passion then practicality. Needless to say, I don't play the GTN in the extremely rare end of the listings (unless I find one up for silly low prices as I am perusing the market, and this has in fact happened on occasion for me).

Let's TL;DR this now: buyer demand meets seller pricing. When the two are congruent within some player driven tolerance range.. sales take place...... regardless where the item dropped, or how it dropped in game. There is nothing to fix here. The GTN in this MMO works extremely well in a player economy driven supply/demand model.
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mecher's Avatar

12.19.2013 , 04:30 PM | #40
Quote: Originally Posted by DOHboy View Post
ummm ok.. what about me talking about "free market" makes me a 'dumb nut".

feel free to point out anything that I said that was wrong or untrue. Also feel free to state how it would be "better" to do it some other way.

also think that was a rather blatant personal attack for no reason. I simply stated a fact and was jumped on as a "dumb nut" I am neither dumb..nor a nut thank you very much.
LOL, because the game doesn't have a free market at all.

The only game that comes close to having a free market is EVE Online. Is this EVE Online, no. Get a clue.