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Ideas for balancing Medicine


TheSupaCoopa's Avatar


TheSupaCoopa
12.14.2013 , 07:54 PM | #1
Duran'del here:

I actually mained an op healer for a while. It was quite fun. However, the class is a little OP when it comes to healing. I won't suggest anything that will make it unplayable, but something that makes it a little more balanced in 8v8s.

-When 2 kolto probes are on a target, there is a lockout debuff that lasts 15s.
-Surgical Probe no longer refunds a tactical advantage when used on targets under 30% health and requires 16 energy.
-Shield Probe no longer heals when it collapses but gives a 10% damage reduction for 10 seconds
The Valiance Legacy, Begeren Colony
"I don't get paid to do the easy jobs, ma'am."- Republic Trooper
Current 50's and 55's

vPLethality AmillarArturon

dbears's Avatar


dbears
12.15.2013 , 09:54 AM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
Duran'del here:

I actually mained an op healer for a while. It was quite fun. However, the class is a little OP when it comes to healing. I won't suggest anything that will make it unplayable, but something that makes it a little more balanced in 8v8s.

-When 2 kolto probes are on a target, there is a lockout debuff that lasts 15s.
-Surgical Probe no longer refunds a tactical advantage when used on targets under 30% health and requires 16 energy.
-Shield Probe no longer heals when it collapses but gives a 10% damage reduction for 10 seconds
The 2 Kolto Probe 15s lockout would be a little useless since Kolto Probe last 18s and the debuff would expire before you had to refresh Kolto Probe anyway.

Are you saying that you want Surgical Probe to cost 16 energy only when used on targets under 30% max health or just in general? I personally think Surgical Probe should still regrant tactical advantage when used on targets below 30% max health, but put a 6 second IGC on it or something.

No one specs in to Med Shield because the amount you get healed for is so insignificant. Making it give you 10% damage reduction for 10 seconds would only serve to make us more OP than we already are.

CaptainApop's Avatar


CaptainApop
12.15.2013 , 11:08 AM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
-When 2 kolto probes are on a target, there is a lockout debuff that lasts 15s.
- Current UI would make this MASSIVELY frustrating in pvp. Especially pug'd. Or have no effect whatsoever, such as in arenas.
- Double operatives in pve would be nerfed to balls AND become even blander than they are now.
- 90% of the time in pvp this wouldn't impact anyone. There'd be no real reason to alter your playstyle becuase of it. All it would do is just randomly nerf op healers during moshpits.

Just a bad change from a design standpoint in my opinion.

Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
-Surgical Probe no longer refunds a tactical advantage when used on targets under 30% health and requires 16 energy.
Translation: Surgical is now a crap heal but you can use it while moving and enjoy never having energy to do anything because what was once your energy regen filler now costs you 7 energy per GCD instead of regen'ing 9.

Seriously, if you used to main an op healer you know how *********** appalling the healing build is pre-surgical probe.
You want that to be end-game play? Really? I sure as hell don't.

Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
-Shield Probe no longer heals when it collapses but gives a 10% damage reduction for 10 seconds
Umm...sure I guess? I mean, I don't want this but sure make med shield a not totally worthless ability I guess. Doesn't fit the ability thematically though so still a bad change. Seems like you just threw this on to make it sound like you have a balanced approach when you want to gut the class.

I'd like some changes to op healing if only for spice nevermind balance but really 90% of the proposed changes I see on these forums are just bad or awkward.
"I bind kolto probes to Q, partially for the convenience but mostly for the irony"

Subterfuge legacy - Tomb of Freedon Nadd

Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
12.16.2013 , 03:54 AM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
Duran'del here:


-Surgical Probe no longer refunds a tactical advantage when used on targets under 30% health and requires 16 energy.
This would actually make us instantly useless in PVE, the class doesnt have that much burst healing abilities and once you really have to oh **** heal, spamming surigcal probe often is the only thing you can do to keep you tank alive, hopeing that kolto probe will get him out of the critical area soon enough. We don't have bubble and healing trance to do that for us, so without the surgical probe spam, operative probably wouldnt be raid material. I think if you want to add change it make the one about 30% cost some energy, so you get operative into hard casting a bit more.

TheSupaCoopa's Avatar


TheSupaCoopa
12.16.2013 , 02:28 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Cordorian View Post
This would actually make us instantly useless in PVE, the class doesnt have that much burst healing abilities and once you really have to oh **** heal, spamming surigcal probe often is the only thing you can do to keep you tank alive, hopeing that kolto probe will get him out of the critical area soon enough. We don't have bubble and healing trance to do that for us, so without the surgical probe spam, operative probably wouldnt be raid material. I think if you want to add change it make the one about 30% cost some energy, so you get operative into hard casting a bit more.
Duran'del here:

At least you're not a commando. We have the worst heals in game.
The Valiance Legacy, Begeren Colony
"I don't get paid to do the easy jobs, ma'am."- Republic Trooper
Current 50's and 55's

vPLethality AmillarArturon

Texnolyze's Avatar


Texnolyze
12.16.2013 , 04:21 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
Duran'del here:

I actually mained an op healer for a while. It was quite fun. However, the class is a little OP when it comes to healing. I won't suggest anything that will make it unplayable, but something that makes it a little more balanced in 8v8s.

-When 2 kolto probes are on a target, there is a lockout debuff that lasts 15s.
-Surgical Probe no longer refunds a tactical advantage when used on targets under 30% health and requires 16 energy.
-Shield Probe no longer heals when it collapses but gives a 10% damage reduction for 10 seconds
First suggestion will make no changes since as someone pointed out - Probes last longer than that.

Second suggestion would be a very significant nerf. I could live with nerfing TA refund (for example refund it once every 10 seconds) but adding an energy cost to a heal that is supposed to be our energy dump would pretty much kill the spec. It would force us to cast but we don't have any mechanic like a Merc (immunity to interrupts) or sorc (Force speed/knockback/bubble stun) that would allow as casting without being interrupted all the time.

Third suggestion would make Operative healers even more powerful than now.

I think that cover nerf we received in patch 2.5 was a step in the right direction. Thanks to that you can always pull/leap to an Operative. But I'm afraid you don't see the bigger picture. It's not about nerfing Operatives - it should be about boosting other healer specs - or I should say - casting specs. The game is designed around so many interrupts/cc's that it is impossible to cast anything once you're pitched against a good team. You'll instantly get shut down unless there's more of you (casters). When it comes to casting only Snipers seem to be in a very good place. Other than that it's just a meele insta-killing fest.

Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
12.17.2013 , 02:10 AM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by TheSupaCoopa View Post
Duran'del here:

At least you're not a commando. We have the worst heals in game.
for pvp maybe, but then again the two top pve guild from my server one with world first on TFB and S&V nightmare 8 man and the other with world first one the same ops in 16 man both roll with a merc healer. So PvE wise the class is doing fine, not saying they dont deserve a serious buff. And while Operative healers can be a major nuissance in PVP, this game if still mostly PVE. Being able to spam surgical below 30% is essential for this class being viable at all in PVE, since it generally lacks the burst healing abilities both commandos/merc and sages/sorcs have. I think a better move might just the get Kolto Probes energy cost back to the old level, since then energy management is an issue again. That still wouldnt make the two other healers viable in arenas, because the problem is not so much that operatives are so ridiuclously OP, but rather that the arena setup absolutely doesnt work with casting healers. To make them viable the whole class would have be redesigned. In old 8v8 at least sorcs were absolutely viable and good since they hide in the backline and their AoE heal did a lot of good, but it is ultimately Arenas that made Operatives the only viable PVP healers.

Arcadius-Fett's Avatar


Arcadius-Fett
12.17.2013 , 09:27 AM | #8
Those are some pretty bad ideas, instead of nerfing Ops for the 900th time, they should work on fixing Sorcs and Mercs. Nothing wrong with Op healers right now, any good player can kill one.
Ziara - Vanaden
The Shadowlands

Cordorian's Avatar


Cordorian
12.17.2013 , 09:49 AM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Arcadius-Fett View Post
Those are some pretty bad ideas, instead of nerfing Ops for the 900th time, they should work on fixing Sorcs and Mercs. Nothing wrong with Op healers right now, any good player can kill one.
If there isn't so much cross healing and/or a good tank around it isn't actually that difficult at all. One carnage mara and it is a sealed deal. focus fire actually help. Even surgical spam doesn't help you then, stealth out mean your team is not getting heals, so a win for the other side. But the myths will never stop and yes please bring the other healing classes somehow in line.

CaptainApop's Avatar


CaptainApop
12.19.2013 , 04:11 AM | #10
Perhaps OP would find the crowd of tear stricken faces in the pvp forum more receptive? :L
"I bind kolto probes to Q, partially for the convenience but mostly for the irony"

Subterfuge legacy - Tomb of Freedon Nadd