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Joystick support needs to be a high priority for GS

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > General Discussion > Suggestion Box
Joystick support needs to be a high priority for GS

Swerto's Avatar


Swerto
11.20.2013 , 08:50 PM | #1
EDIT: http://www.reddit.com/r/swtor/commen...w_if_you_want/

Upvote the reddit thread, keep this thread bumped, let Bioware know we are *not* a minority they can just ignore.




EDIT2: More or less every argument against boils down to "I don't want this because I think it gives an advantage to people who can afford joysticks/gamepads" or "I don't want this, because I think it's dumb, and therefore there should not be an option." or "I don't want this, because it takes development time away from X"

Response to number 1: People say that about fight sticks in Fighting games, yet you'll still see people at tournaments using both a controller and a fight stick.

Reponse to number 2: You are what is wrong with this community. Just because you won't use something doesn't mean it shouldn't be there. It's an option that will bring in more customers and increase options to the customers already here. It doesn't hurt anyone who doesn't want to use it, and only helps the people who do.

Response to number 3: No, it doesn't. Video game design doesn't work like that. The people doing interface coding aren't the people doing art assets, or level design, or class design/balance. Video game design is full of specialists and people who can do general things. Interface coding is usually done by people who do a lot of under the hood stuff, as in not the people who are making new content for the game.



Hear me out.

You are creating an online vehicle combat game. While it is possible to control these things with a mouse and keyboard, people who prefer precision when it comes to moving with a vehicle will often vote for a joystick/flight stick, and maybe even a controller.

Additional input support with a gamepad isn't difficult, xinput is natively supported in windows machines which allows all xbox 360 (and now xbone controllers) to be used as a PC controller. There are multiple bindings available already, and if you separate flight controls from on ground controls, this allows multiple bindings for each.

I know there is very little reason to have a joystick on the ground part of SWTOR, awesome you've gotten away with it forever, but when you create a flight section of the game where people want to move - a controller is a great addition.

Mouse smoothing/etc. can work, it's possible - but you are shutting yourself off from a large crowd of enthusiasts who prefer (and dare I say demand) controller/joystick support.

As is, this is how the current control scheme works. Your mouse x and y control your x and y flight by sending your ship moving towards your cursor (which is also your firing arc). You can turn to a maximum around a big circle that is around the center of the screen, after that you can't shoot any further or turn any faster.

This could be done on a joystick simply by removing the big circle (because at this point it's just clutter) and forcing the circle to reset (either immediately or slowly) to the center when the joystick goes neutral, and when it is at it's max, be where that circle would be.

This would create balanced joystick support without giving an inherent advantage to either party.
Ebon Hawk RP
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desint's Avatar


desint
11.21.2013 , 01:42 AM | #2
While I agree that native support would be the best, mapping controllers is a way that you can use 360/ps3 controller. Set one thumbstick to "wsad" for movement, the other for mouse up/down/left/right, and then other buttons for mouse clicks or whatever keys are used for abilities. You can also change the sensitivity of button clicks/ mouse movements. I use an application called xpadder to map my ps3 controller, and it works great with the flight in battlefront 2. Not ideal, and confusing to map at first, but definitely a viable option.

Hambunctious's Avatar


Hambunctious
11.21.2013 , 02:09 AM | #3
They're not going to do that. I'm afraid they have a strong aversion to adding anything to this game that other games have done very well. It's like they go out of their way to do things differently just for the sake of being different, and not for what works well.

EnkiduNineEight's Avatar


EnkiduNineEight
11.21.2013 , 07:38 AM | #4
No

This is a MMO. It is primarily an MMO. It is advertised as an MMO. The standard user interface for an MMO is a keyboard and a mouse.

As such, the vast majority of all players will be using a keyboard and a mouse to access the game.

To keep things 'fair' all players should have to use the same interface devices to use the game, and so at least leaving the control defaults/native support to keyboard and mouse creates this basic, level, playing field.

If you want to u se a joystick and re-map it to work with the control scheme presented in the game. Fine, but it will have to be effort on your part and NOT native support so that, again, the playing field is level and the default/standard/official control scheme is what everyone who signed up to play an MMO already has.

JamieKirby's Avatar


JamieKirby
11.21.2013 , 11:48 AM | #5
It depends on how they do it really, sometimes, joystick support isn't required.

Mallorik's Avatar


Mallorik
11.21.2013 , 12:33 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by JamieKirby View Post
It depends on how they do it really, sometimes, joystick support isn't required.
Ive never seen that proven true in a full 3d flight game.

Swerto's Avatar


Swerto
11.21.2013 , 01:25 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by EnkiduNineEight View Post
No

This is a MMO. It is primarily an MMO. It is advertised as an MMO. The standard user interface for an MMO is a keyboard and a mouse.

As such, the vast majority of all players will be using a keyboard and a mouse to access the game.

To keep things 'fair' all players should have to use the same interface devices to use the game, and so at least leaving the control defaults/native support to keyboard and mouse creates this basic, level, playing field.

If you want to u se a joystick and re-map it to work with the control scheme presented in the game. Fine, but it will have to be effort on your part and NOT native support so that, again, the playing field is level and the default/standard/official control scheme is what everyone who signed up to play an MMO already has.

Support does not mean remove the mouse/keyboard scheme, it means add the option for joystic/controller in a balanced way that doesn't' leave an advantage for either party.
Ebon Hawk RP
Abysseus Pureblood Sorcerer | Alexialas Cyborg Marauder | Swerto - Cyborg Operative
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Swerto's Avatar


Swerto
11.21.2013 , 01:26 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by desint View Post
While I agree that native support would be the best, mapping controllers is a way that you can use 360/ps3 controller. Set one thumbstick to "wsad" for movement, the other for mouse up/down/left/right, and then other buttons for mouse clicks or whatever keys are used for abilities. You can also change the sensitivity of button clicks/ mouse movements. I use an application called xpadder to map my ps3 controller, and it works great with the flight in battlefront 2. Not ideal, and confusing to map at first, but definitely a viable option.
Why would you do that when battlefront 2 natively supports joysticks/gamepads?
Ebon Hawk RP
Abysseus Pureblood Sorcerer | Alexialas Cyborg Marauder | Swerto - Cyborg Operative
Reigneir Human Powertech Meskero - Pureblood Gunslinger
Sib-Khun - Human Guadian | Atrecia - Human Shadow | Tatlia - Zabrak Commando

desint's Avatar


desint
11.21.2013 , 03:01 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by Swerto View Post
Why would you do that when battlefront 2 natively supports joysticks/gamepads?
I honestly didn't know it had native support, I mapped the controller before I even installed the game.

Morlu's Avatar


Morlu
11.24.2013 , 01:58 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by EnkiduNineEight View Post
No

This is a MMO. It is primarily an MMO. It is advertised as an MMO. The standard user interface for an MMO is a keyboard and a mouse.

As such, the vast majority of all players will be using a keyboard and a mouse to access the game.

To keep things 'fair' all players should have to use the same interface devices to use the game, and so at least leaving the control defaults/native support to keyboard and mouse creates this basic, level, playing field.

If you want to u se a joystick and re-map it to work with the control scheme presented in the game. Fine, but it will have to be effort on your part and NOT native support so that, again, the playing field is level and the default/standard/official control scheme is what everyone who signed up to play an MMO already has.
I have to say I don't agree at all, SWG did it just fine, keyboard and mouse for ground based stuff and then if you wanted you could switch to a joystick for the space flight and no one complained about it being unbalanced or somehow wrong because it was an MMO.

Anyway in keeping things "fair" by insisting that everyone uses the same interface devices i really don't see the difference in one person using a joystick fighting one person using a mouse when in space when you compare that to one person using a 12 button mouse and a keyboard with a load of macro keys fighting someone with a standard 3 button mouse and normal keyboard on the ground. For your argument of fairness to really stand up then the game would have to somehow restrict people from using anything but a basic set up.
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