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Let's see if we can create a majority vote list of needed tweaks.

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Sage / Sorcerer
Let's see if we can create a majority vote list of needed tweaks.

MidichIorian's Avatar


MidichIorian
11.02.2013 , 06:17 PM | #1
I know, there are a lot of other threads, including the brainstorming thread, in which people are allowed to post their ideas and although a lot of people are pointing to some of the same thing it's hard to get an overview. So I created this thread, in which I ask you to list the five things, in priority order, you'd like to see the most.

It's not a thread for discussion. Its only purpose is to reach some form of majority vote, based on the amount of times a certain thing is listed. I'll update the OP with the things you list and the amount of times it has been listed. We've been through most things so many times now that they have become self explanatory so try to keep things as basic as possible, it makes it easier for me to keep track of things. Additional thoughts can be added at the end of your posts.

1. Baseline Egress
2. Baseline insta- WW or atleast as a speced option
3. 360 KB, preferably with a baseline root
4. Armor debuff or finisher in the madness tree.
5. 30 m stun range back.

Now, I'd like to see better force regen in the madness tree too but I believe that the things I wished for indirectly would have improved madness force management, by allowing us to actually channel full force lightnings more frequently. My tweaks would, with the exception of the finisher (which is situational), have no direct effect on our output or make us OP, they would however have a positive indirect effect on output by allowing us to get away and cast more frequently.

AdrianDmitruk's Avatar


AdrianDmitruk
11.02.2013 , 11:56 PM | #2
I speak as a healer so of course that means I would put baseline egress/execute lower than a DPS would, but I am aware of the need and fully disclose the bias. Judge my response accordingly.

Baseline insta WW (if spec, remove reserves from 1st tier lightning and subsume its effects into the AC, replace with insta WW, sins should NOT get it as they already have CC)
360 overload back preferably with movement impairment attached
30m stun back
Fadeout baseline
Execute for madness

If I *did* play DPS more I'd probably want Fadeout for first priority but execute for madness would still be my last priority of the choices queried. There's so much wrong with the concept of a kiting class with toothless CC that an execute talent barely registers on the radar by comparison, frankly.
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FrumpytheClown's Avatar


FrumpytheClown
11.03.2013 , 12:46 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by MidichIorian View Post
I know, there are a lot of other threads, including the brainstorming thread, in which people are allowed to post their ideas and although a lot of people are pointing to some of the same thing it's hard to get an overview. So I created this thread, in which I ask you to list the five things, in priority order, you'd like to see the most.

It's not a thread for discussion. Its only purpose is to reach some form of majority vote, based on the amount of times a certain thing is listed. I'll update the OP with the things you list and the amount of times it has been listed. We've been through most things so many times now that they have become self explanatory so try to keep things as basic as possible, it makes it easier for me to keep track of things. Additional thoughts can be added at the end of your posts.

1. Baseline Egress
2. Baseline insta- WW or atleast as a speced option
3. 360 KB, preferably with a baseline root
4. Armor debuff or finisher in the madness tree.
5. 30 m stun range back.

Now, I'd like to see better force regen in the madness tree too but I believe that the things I wished for indirectly would have improved madness force management, by allowing us to actually channel full force lightnings more frequently. My tweaks would, with the exception of the finisher (which is situational), have no direct effect on our output or make us OP, they would however have a positive indirect effect on output by allowing us to get away and cast more frequently.
1. Baseline Egress? What kind of exit are you talking about? Like a teleportation when using Barrier?
2. Agreed.
3. Agreed.
4. I would prefer over this, a better Force regen - Devour ALSO gives Force as well as Health.
5. Agreed.
"Peace is a lie, there is only Passion..." Ghandi was peaceful, now he is dead. Ghangis Khan was passionate and nearly conquered the known world.

AdrianDmitruk's Avatar


AdrianDmitruk
11.03.2013 , 01:43 PM | #4
Quote: Originally Posted by FrumpytheClown View Post
1. Baseline Egress? What kind of exit are you talking about? Like a teleportation when using Barrier?
He means giving the Egress/Fadeout talent (root/snare break+immunity thereto during the duration of our sprint) to all sorcs/sages, without having it locked halfway up the healing tree.

TBH as I play heals it's not as much a priority for me as it is for DPS sages/sorcs but I do readily concede that a kiting caster class that can be permarooted is just LOL fail.
Adrian-Defense Guardian | Kerrik-Vigilance Guardian | Matari-Scoundrel Healer | Treston-Pyromaniac Vanguard | Eamen-Sage Healer
Kendrew-Op Healer | Andreus-Sorc Healer | Matarion-Juggernaut Smasher | Darrien-Veng Juggernaut
The Makaryk Legacy of Healing to Full - Begeren Colony
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verfallen's Avatar


verfallen
11.03.2013 , 02:11 PM | #5
1- Baseline Fadeout
2 - Static barrier and consumption be taken out of the GCD, with a 1,5 second cooldown instead.
3-madness has no force cost to apply static barrier on themselves, and add a proc that allows the spec to have 1 free consumtion every 15-20 seconds.
4-remove pushback reduction on Crushing Darkness from sith efficacy and put it in Subversion. Also make Lightning Barrage proc immune to pushback. Its currently EXTREMELY COSTLY to take a hit with it. Half the damage runs off. Immune to interrupt as a bonus, but pushback is a most.
5-Defensive cooldown : add a disengage that gives a short immunity to grapple CC and jumps after usage (2-3 sec) and rework barrier to be affected more by specs.

Ex. Corruption barrier now cover a 8m area around the sorc that also reduce damage to allies by a large ammount and make them immune to CCs/Leap for the duration, lightning doing some aoe damage around it, something of that style)

skarlson's Avatar


skarlson
11.05.2013 , 01:27 PM | #6
A second go of it for lightening:

Increase root to 2s for Lightening Swarm so it is more than a speed bump
Increase range of Electrocute to 30m
Add CC immunity to Polarity Shift with Chaos Nexus
Decrease base cast time for Whirlwind to 1.5s
Increase distance of KB slightly for Overload
Add immunity to and removal of movement impairing effects baseline e.g. fadeout
Increase Force Slow movement reduction to 70% as it is a single target slow

Fixed or see how it goes before further changes.
"Unlimited powahahaha! I can't say it..." -Darth Sidious as a Sorcerer

FrumpytheClown's Avatar


FrumpytheClown
11.05.2013 , 03:20 PM | #7
Quote: Originally Posted by AdrianDmitruk View Post
He means giving the Egress/Fadeout talent (root/snare break+immunity thereto during the duration of our sprint) to all sorcs/sages, without having it locked halfway up the healing tree.

TBH as I play heals it's not as much a priority for me as it is for DPS sages/sorcs but I do readily concede that a kiting caster class that can be permarooted is just LOL fail.
Okay. Make sense and I agree.
"Peace is a lie, there is only Passion..." Ghandi was peaceful, now he is dead. Ghangis Khan was passionate and nearly conquered the known world.

MusicRider's Avatar


MusicRider
11.05.2013 , 06:06 PM | #8
1. 100% needed if not buffed to provide full cc immunity (snipers roll has full cc immunity and damage mitigation, so no it won't be OP).
2. Insta force lift much needed for balance, if not for all trees
3. Although no doubt these changes would be most welcome, I think I can live without it if 1 comes into place.
4. Would be nice utility. Armor debuff good for both pve and pvp, execute very good for pvp, but healers should not have that.
5. 30m stun is not needed as the current state of the game is.

6. Dots, at least weaken mind and sever force in balance don't break mezzes; helpful for both class' own protection and the team.
7. Instead of 4 utility could be tied to bubble which should have its own gcd. There are many nice things that could be done with it. Healing, crit bonus, damage bonus, reflect damage which works on anyone you put the bubble and counts for your own damage , etc...

I would like to see better force management in balance also, but IMO 1,2 and 6 are the first priorities and would solve many many problems with the class.

MusicRider's Avatar


MusicRider
11.05.2013 , 06:10 PM | #9
Quote: Originally Posted by verfallen View Post
Ex. Corruption barrier now cover a 8m area around the sorc that also reduce damage to allies by a large ammount and make them immune to CCs/Leap for the duration, lightning doing some aoe damage around it, something of that style)
That would be corruptively awesome . Can't imagine how many qq from leapers there will be though since all you need in arenas then is sorcs .

verfallen's Avatar


verfallen
11.05.2013 , 07:54 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by MusicRider View Post
That would be corruptively awesome . Can't imagine how many qq from leapers there will be though since all you need in arenas then is sorcs .
There are many ways to make it no so bad. Its on a 3 minute cooldown, and prevent healer from taking any action so focusing someone might force him to drop it. At any rate its a suggestion to make it interesting.

In PvE what sorc mostly need however and i forgot to put there, is utility in its dps trees. Offheal are widely disregarded, and while lightning sorc can arguably be the best class to offheal due to its abundance of ressource compared to every other AC, most fight bork that by requiring every bit of dps you can. You can think of HM Styrak where even healers add some dps due to the tight enrage timer. So a DPS offhealing just borked the team. So DPS can be fine, that question brings what is the sorc bringing to the raid from its class?

I normally hate bringing ideas from other games, but a month or so ago a few friends and I did a gaming night and the fun thing in that is I saw a friend playing wow. From talking to him he had a class that looked a lot like a madness sorc (shadow thingy) of DoTs and channel, but he showed me a neat little utility skill he had that converted his damage 1:1 to heal on his raid.

So roughly if you do 8k damage and there is 8 person in your raid, they are all heald by 1k.

Thats imo a great utility idea.

BW have managed safe a few exception to bring class close to each other in DPS, and the brainstorm threads make it seems like it will get better. What some class really lack tough is specific utilities, that make marauder and snipers priceless compared to them.