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Retuning the old operations


Helmholtzz's Avatar


Helmholtzz
09.10.2013 , 02:31 PM | #1
I want to know what the community thinks. Do you think creating a separate version of EV, KP and EC tuned for level 55 players. It will only drop BM gear so people can't just get all Arkanian pieces in 1 week. The tune up will only need hp tune and armor tune for the bosses. It will give casual 55 raiders more raids to do. I think it provides with more content and takes very small amount of effort. What do you people think?
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Delta_V's Avatar


Delta_V
09.10.2013 , 02:44 PM | #2
Personally, I think they should hold off on this until the next level-cap increase (let's say lvl 60), where they could revamp EV/KP/EC, but leave the current ops at 55, since people will be bored with them by that point. Then the expac after that (level 65) could bring back the current ops. That would set up a rotation between the sets of ops so that they don't get as stale (of course new ops would still need to be released).

In addition to comms and non-set bonus gear, I think these revamped ops would be a good place to bring back the old endgame gear as orange adaptive shells. KP/EV/EC could drop Tionese/Columi/Rakata shells, and then when TfB/S&V are brought back in two expansions, they could drop Campaign/Dread Guard shells.

AlixMV's Avatar


AlixMV
09.10.2013 , 03:15 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Delta_V View Post
Personally, I think they should hold off on this until the next level-cap increase (let's say lvl 60), where they could revamp EV/KP/EC, but leave the current ops at 55, since people will be bored with them by that point. Then the expac after that (level 65) could bring back the current ops. That would set up a rotation between the sets of ops so that they don't get as stale (of course new ops would still need to be released).
I think this is a terrible idea for one reason: there would be very little content for people to do post-50/51 through 55 (or the next level cap -5 ) if the Classic and current Level 55 Ops were constantly being re-engineered to be higher and higher levels.

Right now, class story nominally carries a character from 1-50. Ilum and Makeb could carry a character through from 51-55, but let's face it--with a single track, those can get kind of stale. They have the SM and HM 50 Flashpoints, but that and possibly Dailies would be it under this scheme.

I don't think the OP's idea is a bad one, although it would effectively be a NiM+ difficulty. But I'd wait and see how 2.4 and the two new 55 Operations there makes things.
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SleepyKing's Avatar


SleepyKing
09.10.2013 , 06:05 PM | #4
I'm not sure that there's anyone who would disagree with this. Having five endgame ops (or seven, once 2.4 comes out) is way, way better than the two we currently have. We've lost a lot of guild members out of sheer boredom at the endgame. Running the same operations over and over again (and no, new difficulty levels do not count as "different") is killing a lot of people's interest in the game.

I think EC could drop the good stuff - set bonus pieces - since that's a mechanical challenge on par with TfB and S&V. If EV and KP were to stay the same mechanically, they'd probably have to drop lesser gear, since they're much easier to execute with the possible exceptions of the G4-B3 Heavy Fabricator and Soa (and even they're not very hard).

Given BioWare has just announced that all subs will be getting the Makeb expansion and a ticket to level 55 for free, I actually think this is on the cards. Here's hoping, anyway...

Marius_Xerxes's Avatar


Marius_Xerxes
09.10.2013 , 07:10 PM | #5
On a similar note, I think they should make Nightmare modes of the "classic" flashpoints for lvl 55's. False Emperor, Battle of Ilum, Directive 7 etc.

Up until 2.0, doing the hard mode versions of those flashpoints yielded you the same level gear as the story mode OPs of the time did (KP and EV in specific). Heck, by the end, you could even get a Rakata piece (HM gear form those OPS) from a 4 man flashpoint on hard mode (Lost Island).

It would be nice to have a way to get Arkanian gear without having to find 8+ person groups. At least on a pvp server, the current 8 person story mode ops you can Q for via group finder rarely (if ever) pop.

oaceen's Avatar


oaceen
09.10.2013 , 07:21 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by AlixMV View Post
I think this is a terrible idea for one reason: there would be very little content for people to do post-50/51 through 55 (or the next level cap -5 ) if the Classic and current Level 55 Ops were constantly being re-engineered to be higher and higher levels.
i will say first that there is plenty of content for players to participate in from 50-55, and i would also point out how difficult it is to find 8-16 people of level 50 to even run this content in the first place, so there's a lot of 55s, and the content is rather trivialized.

but really, they don't have to be mutually exclusive. lv50 ops and lv55 ops. i imagine that nothing was done in the initial design to make this easy to implement though, and that's probably why we just see adjustments to the operation as a whole (like tfb going to 55 and retuned for that level), but it would be nice to give us more content to do at endgame.

as it is now, there's 3 raids for level 50, and only 2 for 55, and only one of them is relatively new. the other is about a year old now. granted, yes, that is about to change in about a month, but endgame really should have more of this stuff to do.

i think that they did well with the flashpoints, and i agree with Marius_Xerxes that we should get some nightmare mods of lv50 HMs for 55
i would also love some nightmare modes of the current 55 HMs that drop actual endgame gear, but are just as challenging as an operation in terms of mechanics.
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uniz's Avatar


uniz
09.10.2013 , 08:42 PM | #7
I don't know about you but I am bored to death with those zones and really have no desire to go back into them as is. but if you want to add new bosses with new mechanics and a new story that fits in with the old zone then that would be entertaining.

Delta_V's Avatar


Delta_V
09.10.2013 , 11:20 PM | #8
Quote: Originally Posted by AlixMV View Post
I think this is a terrible idea for one reason: there would be very little content for people to do post-50/51 through 55 (or the next level cap -5 ) if the Classic and current Level 55 Ops were constantly being re-engineered to be higher and higher levels.

Right now, class story nominally carries a character from 1-50. Ilum and Makeb could carry a character through from 51-55, but let's face it--with a single track, those can get kind of stale. They have the SM and HM 50 Flashpoints, but that and possibly Dailies would be it under this scheme.

I don't think the OP's idea is a bad one, although it would effectively be a NiM+ difficulty. But I'd wait and see how 2.4 and the two new 55 Operations there makes things.
I wasn't thinking of replacing the lvl 50 version with an updated version of the ops (like they did with TfB in 2.0), but rather having them exist side-by-side. There could still be level 50 versions of these ops (and level 55 versions of TfB/S&V) that are exactly the same as they are now, and then copies that have been updated for the current level cap.

RikuvonDrake's Avatar


RikuvonDrake
09.11.2013 , 06:36 AM | #9
I rather see that Bioware put their energy, people and money on developing new content such as raids, flashpoints and new areas instead of revamping old raids. There is no need for more lvl55 raids, when 2.4 is released you will have **** loads of bosses to kill if you are 55, there is no need to delay new content just to recreate old...
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SleepyKing's Avatar


SleepyKing
09.12.2013 , 04:34 PM | #10
Quote: Originally Posted by RikuvonDrake View Post
I rather see that Bioware put their energy, people and money on developing new content such as raids, flashpoints and new areas instead of revamping old raids. There is no need for more lvl55 raids, when 2.4 is released you will have **** loads of bosses to kill if you are 55, there is no need to delay new content just to recreate old...
Of course we'd prefer new raids to revamped old raids. But there's no equivalence here. A new raid takes an entire team of people weeks or months to develop. Rejigging the older raids should take a developer a few days to re-adjust the numbers. That's why people suggest updating the old raids - it gives us more stuff to do with minimal effort from BioWare.