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Attention: Assassin Tanks

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes
Attention: Assassin Tanks

Dyronis's Avatar


Dyronis
08.31.2013 , 01:47 PM | #1
I'd like to start off by saying that I am mainly a Juggernaut tank, and I do play all 3 tanks on both factions. Tanking is what I do, and what I enjoy most out of most MMOs I have played. This post is mainly to throw some ideas out there to fix the spikiness of assassins. Here's two ideas I have myself. Just curious what other people's thoughts are.

1. When a damaging attack brings you below 30% of your maximum health, the cooldown on your Overcharged Saber ability is refreshed, and all damage taken is reduced by 25% for 8 sec. This effect cannot occur more than once every 45 seconds.

2. When a stack of Dark Ward is consumed you will be healed for 1% of your maximum health.

With the stacks being 15 stacks it will be 15% total health being generated. That in itself may be a bit too strong, but again it's just an idea. I'm hoping to come up with something that will make the assassin unique. Just adding damage reduction and calling it a day just seems dull in my opinion. Please share your ideas.

LoRdTyRANTz's Avatar


LoRdTyRANTz
08.31.2013 , 05:28 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by Dyronis View Post
I'd like to start off by saying that I am mainly a Juggernaut tank, and I do play all 3 tanks on both factions. Tanking is what I do, and what I enjoy most out of most MMOs I have played. This post is mainly to throw some ideas out there to fix the spikiness of assassins. Here's two ideas I have myself. Just curious what other people's thoughts are.

1. When a damaging attack brings you below 30% of your maximum health, the cooldown on your Overcharged Saber ability is refreshed, and all damage taken is reduced by 25% for 8 sec. This effect cannot occur more than once every 45 seconds.

2. When a stack of Dark Ward is consumed you will be healed for 1% of your maximum health.

With the stacks being 15 stacks it will be 15% total health being generated. That in itself may be a bit too strong, but again it's just an idea. I'm hoping to come up with something that will make the assassin unique. Just adding damage reduction and calling it a day just seems dull in my opinion. Please share your ideas.
I doubt we will get any new abilities on our skill tree. A more simple approach would be to switch abilities. Maybe switch corrupted flesh and conspirator's cloak so that both trees could benefit

Gnimish's Avatar


Gnimish
08.31.2013 , 05:59 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by Dyronis View Post
I'd like to start off by saying that I am mainly a Juggernaut tank, and I do play all 3 tanks on both factions. Tanking is what I do, and what I enjoy most out of most MMOs I have played. This post is mainly to throw some ideas out there to fix the spikiness of assassins. Here's two ideas I have myself. Just curious what other people's thoughts are.

1. When a damaging attack brings you below 30% of your maximum health, the cooldown on your Overcharged Saber ability is refreshed, and all damage taken is reduced by 25% for 8 sec. This effect cannot occur more than once every 45 seconds.

2. When a stack of Dark Ward is consumed you will be healed for 1% of your maximum health.

With the stacks being 15 stacks it will be 15% total health being generated. That in itself may be a bit too strong, but again it's just an idea. I'm hoping to come up with something that will make the assassin unique. Just adding damage reduction and calling it a day just seems dull in my opinion. Please share your ideas.
Would be nice. But the following patch we would get whacked with the nerf bat from the pvp community

mwissie's Avatar


mwissie
09.01.2013 , 11:52 AM | #4
However much I li ke the second idea, it wouldn't actually fix shadow spikyness more the opposite:
The problem is with nearly dieing if you don't shield, so adding a healing cd is pretty useless (often, not always) and adding a healing effect to KW is just making sure that if you get hardly any damage due to shielding you get extra healing??
Really nice try, but sorry, it doesn't fix problems in nim.
One option is to bring back the armour buff in martial prowess.

nagatamen's Avatar


nagatamen
09.02.2013 , 06:27 PM | #5
Quote: Originally Posted by Dyronis View Post
I'd like to start off by saying that I am mainly a Juggernaut tank, and I do play all 3 tanks on both factions. Tanking is what I do, and what I enjoy most out of most MMOs I have played. This post is mainly to throw some ideas out there to fix the spikiness of assassins. Here's two ideas I have myself. Just curious what other people's thoughts are.

1. When a damaging attack brings you below 30% of your maximum health, the cooldown on your Overcharged Saber ability is refreshed, and all damage taken is reduced by 25% for 8 sec. This effect cannot occur more than once every 45 seconds.

2. When a stack of Dark Ward is consumed you will be healed for 1% of your maximum health.

With the stacks being 15 stacks it will be 15% total health being generated. That in itself may be a bit too strong, but again it's just an idea. I'm hoping to come up with something that will make the assassin unique. Just adding damage reduction and calling it a day just seems dull in my opinion. Please share your ideas.
First off thanks for taking a swing at the issues, it's more communication than we Shadows/Assassins have gotten from the Devs (if you're reading this Devs, please just tell us that you're working on it and throw us some of your ideas if possible). I see some issues, but I'm not necessarily the most proficient at understanding all the inner workings of everything so feel free to correct me everyone.

#1 - The idea sounds really good, but it is very very powerful if it were implemented as you stated. Just quick glance at what you're saying brings up two possible implementations in my head, first the 45s cooldown starts as soon as the ability is used (meaning in all likelihood we're probably looking at usage in the 50-60 second range) or secondly the 45 second cooldown starts after the 8 seconds (at which we're probably looking at about 60-70 seconds between usage). Those are numbers off the top of my head, but it roughly cuts the cooldown in half, which as much as I'd like it to be that way, is overpowered. It would kind of turn it into a "use when ready" type cooldown instead of a "major amount of damage about to hit" cooldown. I can't speak for better geared tanks, but in full 72's that bumps my DR up to 60.53% which is higher than a Guardian or Vanguard's DR, but it also increases our self-healing. When you add all that together the 2 minute cooldown roughly makes sense (I think it needs to be shortened a little bit, maybe 15 seconds or so, given the strengths of some other tank class cooldowns).

#2 - The self-heals generated by that are good, but as others have mentioned it wouldn't do much for when we die to spikiness (ie shields and defense didn't proc so we take a big hit). In addition self-heals are a pretty good sized chunk of our Mitigation budget (I think I heard somewhere in the neighborhood of 25%), increasing the amount of self-heals would force the Devs to take away from the other aspects of our Mitigation budget (ie shields, defense and DR) to keep things "balanced." Most of the well-known Shadow/Assassin theorycrafters that I've seen have been asking for a self-healing reduction in favor of other forms of mitigation that prevent damage instead of react to it.

How to fix them (from my perspective)

#1 - Instead of resetting the cooldown, what about granting a buff that gives us a chunk of DR that fades with time? To expand what if we got a 10 stack buff that granted 1% DR per stack and have the stacks fall off every 1-2 seconds? This would of course need some kind of internal cooldown (45ish seconds?), but it still is reactive instead of preventative, but the extra DR would make us a bit less spikey between these low health times. I will admit that I don't understand the full implications of what I'm describing in the PVP realm of the game, but I think it sounds like a good starting point.

#2 - I honestly don't have any suggestions on how to make the Dark Ward stacks viable as healing. About all I can come up with is a "bubble" type mechanism instead of healing, but that still doesn't help much on the no shield/defense spikes that are the major concern.

Svii's Avatar


Svii
09.03.2013 , 01:06 AM | #6
I canned my Assassin Tank when 2.0 hit and made a Jugg instead, the extra damage mitigation from armor alone makes life so much less frustrating. I remember back in the day when Assassins had much higher armor rating, it was nerfed into the ground. Since the problem (IMO) is mainly deadly unpredictable spikes:

My simple suggestion is to make Insulation (30% armor rating) available to Darkness, self healing would probably have to be slightly reduced to balance it out.

MGNMTTRN's Avatar


MGNMTTRN
09.04.2013 , 07:10 PM | #7
While it's fun to dream up new abilities, I think the problem over at Bioware isn't that they are lacking ideas for how to buff Sin tanks; the problem is that they don't consider it to be an urgent issue.

Hockaday's Avatar


Hockaday
09.05.2013 , 03:19 AM | #8
Apparently a GM (I assume a dev...or someone in contact with them) has admitted to knowing the sin issue...and has commented that it was / is due to a lack of feedback on the pts (swear only me and 2 others said sins were in trouble) and lack of manpower.

They also said that they are working on the issue.

Though, I wish they'd -say- more on the subject here.
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Snarkasms's Avatar


Snarkasms
09.05.2013 , 03:22 AM | #9
And I wish they wouldn't use only the PTS as a barometer for success. What percentage of the population actually plays on PTS? What percentage manage to try out stuff like ops in hard and nightmare, 8 and 16-man modes?

XisscVekno's Avatar


XisscVekno
09.07.2013 , 05:21 AM | #10
The problem is PVP, no matter what is decided to fix our spikiness can't affect PVP to much. If it does we are just begging to be put back in the same boat we where in pre-2.0 with all the nerfs we got back then.
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