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Master Jun Seros, TOTAL *******

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Story and Lore
Master Jun Seros, TOTAL *******

swtonewbie's Avatar


swtonewbie
07.01.2013 , 03:08 AM | #11
Quote: Originally Posted by Bleeters View Post
The "take it up with my employer" thing annoys me a bit. Specifically in the circumstance that it's used, I mean.

Spoiler



Spoiler
For the BH story there are some inconsistencies with Markons briefings. On DK they specifically mention who is handing out the contract, you even meet two of the three. But later on they dont do this as much...you are kinda left guessing. But just because they dont mention it in later stories doesnt mean there isnt a contract. Bounty Hunters dont work for free right? someone is paying them to take out the target. The BH does share some responsibility but really, who should the crazy, angry jedi be focused on? t

Spoiler
I'm not really a noob...

xxforcardassia's Avatar


xxforcardassia
07.01.2013 , 07:18 AM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Wicked View Post
He isn't a part of the Empire either and that's why the BH has to be held accountable: Hell, the BH doesn't even follow an ideology or anything of the sort, other than going for the quick buck, without thinking of the consequences.
That's open for interpretation based on play through. There are options from beginning to end for the BH to establish their views and reasons behind their actions. The most prevalent is, of course, the money factor... but it is possible to take the route of honor (/revenge) and loyalty. Especially after the end of chapter one.

Spoiler


As far as the OP goes, I agree... Master Seros did act like a total **** and tool But he had his reasons, just like the BH had his/her reasons for all of their actions. It's all a matter of perspective.

Bleeters's Avatar


Bleeters
07.01.2013 , 02:25 PM | #13
Quote: Originally Posted by swtonewbie View Post
Spoiler
Yeah, I get that. My point was that much of what you do to win the great hunt - especially the last thing - aren't business contracts per se. The BH is being instructed to do it, sure, but what's the motivation for it? To win a competition. Personal fame and glory. The BH could've walked away at any point,

I mean, I don't accept the whole 'it wasn't my choice, I'm just the weapon' mercenary excuse in the first place for a whole mess of reasons, but having the BH claim it wasn't their fault and that they should 'take it up with their employer' is just reckless hypocracy.

BrianDavion's Avatar


BrianDavion
07.01.2013 , 02:58 PM | #14
going afetr the BH was fine, but the way Seros went about it was waaaaaaaaay out of line. especially when he basicly accused the BH of horiffic crimes they had no part in. the minute that happens it's no longer about justice.

SithKoriandr's Avatar


SithKoriandr
07.01.2013 , 04:57 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by BrianDavion View Post
going afetr the BH was fine, but the way Seros went about it was waaaaaaaaay out of line. especially when he basicly accused the BH of horiffic crimes they had no part in. the minute that happens it's no longer about justice.
Will have disagree with that one. It's a nasty tactic, but Seros was going after THE BEST bounty hunter around. You don't find THE BEST bounty hunter that ever lived by putting up wanted posters.

And it's not like the BHs that were killed at the party were innocent. They all try to act like they're not doing something wrong, but when anyone can place a contract for a BH to take, the BH is a hired killer. Sure your BH can take the "don't kill route" but never take it? Not always an option. And capturing them alive and taking them to the contract placer to kill is just as bad.

Seros failure was he went against his own Jedi teachings, but then, outside of the PC, it looks as if all members of the Jedi Order fail to keep to one of the teachings.

It's not helped further by the fact that if one has force abilities, one is either considered Jedi or Sith. If you have a lightsaber, you must be one or the other.
"It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more...than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so *********** what." - Stephen Fry

Connorsan's Avatar


Connorsan
07.02.2013 , 01:55 PM | #16
At the end of chapter 2 i was thinking "Alright, my BH get's to go to a party-wait how would that work....eh....*arrive* Noooo does this mean i don't get a cake? NO? Time to shoot 'em up

That moment i wanted to kill this jedi, he was annoying and i didn't get any cake, but he had his reasons and i have mine. Now, Time for a HUNT!
"All shall know my name and they shall know it to be Fear itself" Mylokii

Callaron's Avatar


Callaron
07.03.2013 , 03:14 AM | #17
Quote: Originally Posted by SithKoriandr View Post
Spoiler
A guy in one of Coruscant's cantinas is hiring a Bountyhunter to off his wife - I doubt it's legal though, since they are meeting in some shady den.
It's one of the random NPC dialogues when you walk up to them.
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SithKoriandr's Avatar


SithKoriandr
07.03.2013 , 07:03 AM | #18
Quote: Originally Posted by Callaron View Post
A guy in one of Coruscant's cantinas is hiring a Bountyhunter to off his wife - I doubt it's legal though, since they are meeting in some shady den.
It's one of the random NPC dialogues when you walk up to them.
Even in the BH storyline there's comments about proper paperwork for the job versus just taking a job and basically being hired assassins/thugs.

Some of the issues with it, may be the SW definition of Bounty Hunter, and what real life (NA anyways) bounty hunters do. SW version of BH's can very well just be hired muscle/killers.
"It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more...than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so *********** what." - Stephen Fry

Beniboybling's Avatar


Beniboybling
07.04.2013 , 03:22 PM | #19
People seem to be defending Jun Seros on some sort of moral grounding with all kinds of nonsense about him bringing a hired killer to justice. But in reality all that this was about was eliminating a potential threat to the Republic and its war effort against the Sith Empire. We have to remember that the Republic and the Sith were at war here, they don't have to respect each other and each others boundaries. If a BH kills an important Jedi, regardless of the circumstances, they are going to be hunted down, because simply put they are a threat. So I reject that Jun Seros was on some heroic campaign for justice and the stuff he comes out with makes me sick. Case in point:

"You chose to murder Kellian Jarro. Just like you murdered everyone sent to bring you to justice. You could have surrendered at any time."

Everyone the BH has 'murdered' have been armed and enemies of the Empire, this is wartime (let's face it the Cold War was just a facade) people die, this has nothing to do with justice, this is simply war. On the other hand, slaughtering a group of unarmed bounty hunters entirely unaffiliated with the Sith Empire? And wrongly accusing the BH of crimes he did not committ? That is a breach in justice.

I expect Jun Seros has killed his fair share of Sith, so he is equal with the BH in that respect. The above however puts him in the wrong, not the Bounty Hunter. Simply put, he had no grounds whatsoever to refer to his mission as bringing the Bounty Hunter to 'justice'. He can't even uphold his own Jedi Code. He got what was coming to him.

SithKoriandr's Avatar


SithKoriandr
07.04.2013 , 04:12 PM | #20
Quote: Originally Posted by Beniboybling View Post
People seem to be defending Jun Seros on some sort of moral grounding with all kinds of nonsense about him bringing a hired killer to justice. But in reality all that this was about was eliminating a potential threat to the Republic and its war effort against the Sith Empire. We have to remember that the Republic and the Sith were at war here, they don't have to respect each other and each others boundaries. If a BH kills an important Jedi, regardless of the circumstances, they are going to be hunted down, because simply put they are a threat. So I reject that Jun Seros was on some heroic campaign for justice and the stuff he comes out with makes me sick. Case in point:

"You chose to murder Kellian Jarro. Just like you murdered everyone sent to bring you to justice. You could have surrendered at any time."

Everyone the BH has 'murdered' have been armed and enemies of the Empire, this is wartime (let's face it the Cold War was just a facade) people die, this has nothing to do with justice, this is simply war. On the other hand, slaughtering a group of unarmed bounty hunters entirely unaffiliated with the Sith Empire? And wrongly accusing the BH of crimes he did not committ? That is a breach in justice.

I expect Jun Seros has killed his fair share of Sith, so he is equal with the BH in that respect. The above however puts him in the wrong, not the Bounty Hunter. Simply put, he had no grounds whatsoever to refer to his mission as bringing the Bounty Hunter to 'justice'. He can't even uphold his own Jedi Code. He got what was coming to him.
I don't recall the spy or wife of an Imperial officer he was sleeping with, being armed. Though, that was less a BH quest and more a side quest.

Of course he's killed Sith. There's no such thing as a good Sith (outside of possibly the PCs and even then, I swear there were some options where you were just going to do something evil regardless, but for different motivations for LS or DS).

And a group of BH's who would kill any target for the right price. Some of the contracts weren't "Oh this is a terrible person" some of those contracts where "This good person upset me in some way" and some of them for the Great Hunt was basically "Ooooo...this target would be a great challenge for anyone."

The Great Hunt is all about turning murder into a game "Let's play who's the better killer."

You think people are in the wrong to think the Jedi was on some noble cause, but the BH wasn't doing anything noble, other than killing for glory/money.

Now if choosen, the BH could have some sort of moral code.

But face it, the BH kills a Jedi Master because he kicked Mandalorian butt when they sided with the Sith on the Sacking of Curoscant. That's right, they wanted to kill a Jedi because they invaded and then got their butt kicked.

They put a bounty on a Jedi, because the Jedi was freeing people who were invaded and then put under martial law by an evil government (or if you'd rather, a government they didn't want over them).

So you kill that Jedi, and Seros comes in, seeking justice and revenge, and willing to do anything possible to get it.

Now I loved the BH storyline, it's one of my favorites (more so than the JK or SW ones, which are generally considered the best because of the epic feeling), but let's not kid ourselves. BH is not an innocent person, and neither were the other bounty hunters.

And with how the storyline plays out, I'd guess it was written with the idea that you kill the Padawan too.
"It's now very common to hear people say, 'I'm rather offended by that.' As if that gives them certain rights. It's actually nothing more...than a whine. 'I find that offensive.' It has no meaning; it has no purpose; it has no reason to be respected as a phrase. 'I am offended by that.' Well, so *********** what." - Stephen Fry