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Where did EA go Wrong?


LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
06.28.2013 , 06:56 PM | #321
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
A few clarifying comments to what I quoted above:

1) This is not EAs first foray into MMOs... it's Bioware's. There IS a difference. EA is a large holding company that acquires and holds game companies.. including MMO game companies (read: Mythic).

2) EA did not win the vote for "worst company" on the basis of it's MMOs. MMOs are a very small part of EAs total business... less then 5% in fact on a revenue basis (which is what holding companies are all about). So the entire premise is misplaced in the context of a thread about "wrong" on the part of the game developer for a particular MMO (SWTOR) in an SWTOR forum.

3) And NOW.....for a bit of cheeky sarcasm --> I thought MMOs were heavily dependent on whiny cry baby customers who can never be satisfied or happy no matter what.....because frankly... who else plays MMOs really? Yeah...not every MMO player is a whiny cry baby who cannot be satisfied... but the irony here.. I'm more right then being simply sarcastic.
Lol...I mostly agree, though perhaps I would not have worded number three that way hehe.

Yes, this is not EAs first MMO, yes they did not get the vote because of their MMOs but how they had been treating their customers over the year for many products and services....

...and yes. MMO players, generally speaking of course, are very picky and demanding. Especially now.

LordArtemis's Avatar


LordArtemis
06.28.2013 , 07:16 PM | #322
Quote: Originally Posted by Darth_Moonshadow View Post
They earned that title by a a bunch of First World Problem having bunch of armchair activists, whose idea of "Worst Day Ever" is Tuesday Maintenance.

EA may treat you bad, but they are way kinder than other companies. Waiting an hour for a server to clear in SimCity is a far better fate that needing an experimental medical trial to save your life and being told "Sorry, but we're not paying. Have a great remaining week!"
That is a matter of opinion of course. I do agree that EA customers were rather hard on EA...but they wre hard for a reason....

Hired fake religious folks to protest Dante's Inferno
Used Childs Play to promote Battlefield Heroes DLC without permission
SecurROM scandal and dishonest public statements following the discovery
Banning players from online play and rendering all purchased games linked to that account unplayable
Banning a player for speaking out publicly against EA (ban was reversed when revealed)
Spyware scandal, public denials, homepage hijacks and advertising
Poor customer service and poor communication with customers
DLC provided on paid products that requires additional purchase
SimCity online DRM locking out paying customers from play (fixed as far as I can tell)


That is just a few of the dozens and dozens of missteps and bad judgement calls the company has made over the years. EA just doesn't seem to understand it's customers, what they will accept and what will enrage them.

Understand...I do not think EA is the worst company, nor do I think the rating was deserved. But they did earn it by treating their customers badly on many occasions.

This just proves that customers will, in the end, make you pay for your mistakes.

CosmicKat's Avatar


CosmicKat
06.28.2013 , 07:16 PM | #323
Quote: Originally Posted by Arkerus View Post
You missed my point completely. I was actually agreeing with you more than disagreeing and yet you STILL had to make some kind of point. Yeesh.

Like it or not, MMOs have a much wider audience now than what they did 10 years ago. Any bid budget game ( and All games are getting much more expensive to make) need to hit a wider "mainstream" audience in the gaming community. That doesn't mean its a mainstream product...like popular jeans or t-shirts.

Your OPINION is that the mainstreaming and dumbing down to hit a wider audience has hurt the genre in general. No...it has hurt it FOR YOU. You want something different. That's fine...and you can have that opinion.

But fact states that MMOs are big business now. They cost a lot but they also have the potential to make a lot of money for the company that produced it. Many, many more gamers are playing MMOs now. If the genre was actually worse then the population would decline but the facts do not support that assertion. Millions upon millions of gamers are playing some type of MMO. Facts would say the genre is much more successful than 10 years ago.

That doesn't mean its better in your eyes, but from a business perspective the genre is growing rapidly.

If you want a certain type of game you have many choices. Understand that this game will never, ever be a complicated MMO with tons of underlying systems and rules. That is not the audience. You can either accept that or you can pretend to hate it. Pick one.
Worldwide, MMO's may be far more successful now than they were, but in the Western world, they are pretty much at exactly the same point they were in the heyday of EQ. You have one or two games with a large percentage of the players, and the rest fighting over the scraps.

If you take out the Asian games, which are huge in their market, but non-entities in the West, the numbers are comparable to where they were 10 years ago.

CosmicKat's Avatar


CosmicKat
06.28.2013 , 07:25 PM | #324
Quote: Originally Posted by Arkerus View Post
The core of the game has nothing to do with the length. The core of the game is the underlying design and combat systems. Everything is built on that foundation.

Content equals length. Content is not the core of the gameplay. I agree, for some people the leveling process was too quick and there wasn't enough content at launch. Not for me...but for some people.

But make no mistake, content is not the core gameplay design. Content is...well content.
The core of the game has a lot to do with how long it is.

If the combat system were slower, more tactical, more RPG-like, the level progression would be slower. Adding a few seconds to each of the 82 billion mob fights one will experience in TOR, cumulatively would add many hours of gameplay to the game.

PlasmaJohn's Avatar


PlasmaJohn
06.29.2013 , 07:11 AM | #325
Quote: Originally Posted by Andryah View Post
1) This is not EAs first foray into MMOs... it's Bioware's. There IS a difference. EA is a large holding company that acquires and holds game companies.. including MMO game companies (read: Mythic).
Weren't their other MMO(s?) inherited when they acquired the developer(s?) Regardless, what I meant was they threw a green team at a AAA MMO project with a hot franchise. 20/20 hindsight suggests they should have tackled something a bit less ambitious first.

Quote:
2) EA did not win the vote for "worst company" on the basis of it's MMOs.
Didn't say they did EA has a long history of being customer hostile. Lord Artemis' post mentions several of their missteps.

Assume for a moment that voting is limited to subscribers of Consumer Reports (the Consumerist is CR's website). If that's true, the only fault with it is the name of the "contest". Instead it should be called "Worst Customer Service/Experience". On the whole BoA and Halliburton have excellent customer service.

Quote:
3) ... Yeah...not every MMO player is a whiny cry baby who cannot be satisfied... but the irony here.. I'm more right then being simply sarcastic.
I see more opinions I agree with than not. Sure things can be worded better, but I also understand a lot of the frustration. Too many issues are not being addressed or even acknowledged in a timely manner. And that gets back to the core of "go Wrong?" and "Worst Company [Customer Service] in America"

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Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
06.29.2013 , 09:04 AM | #326
I know how to make a successful MMO, cater to my specific tastes and nobody elses!

Andryah's Avatar


Andryah
06.29.2013 , 12:15 PM | #327
Quote: Originally Posted by PlasmaJohn View Post
Assume for a moment that voting is limited to subscribers of Consumer Reports (the Consumerist is CR's website). If that's true, the only fault with it is the name of the "contest". Instead it should be called "Worst Customer Service/Experience". On the whole BoA and Halliburton have excellent customer service.
There are a good number of Customer Service tracking and reporting services on the internet. If you review them, on the basis of Customer Service (or Customer Care) you would be hard pressed to find one where a Video Game Holding company is even in the top 25 "worst". Whereas BoA will be in the top 10 worst on almost every tracking source.

Let's pick one, just for example reference, that does continuous data gathering (rather then flashpolling): http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-li...stomer-service

Interestingly enough...you see a lot of regular names in the top 20 here, but not EA. Why is that? Now.. the reason I sighted this example ranking site is because they apply contemporary approach and technology, they keep is Facebook simple (ie: meta-dumbed_down) listing+voting, it's user driven in that nobody gives the consumers a list to vote..the consumers make the list and vote, they report out on a continuing basis but track important linear factors like reranking, and they provide key-flag (see right hand column) about interesting context (like most voted, most voted as bad, etc.etc.). Now, Ranker is small, so I am not submitting it as a gold standard vote result..but rather as a gold standard in methodology.

Now.. let's go back and visit the Consumerist poll for worst company. They polled for multiple factors... 1) Provide a product people want and like, 2) sell your products for a reasonable price, and 3) support the products You Sell. these were the criteria. The actual problem with the Consumerist poll is they mix dissimilar companies with dissimilar products in radically different parts of the free market and then ask internet wonks to vote which is worst. How does one compare a Bank, a Telecom company, A software company, and game company, and a brick and mortar merchant on the same broad criteria and gain any objective view of what is actually taking place? The answer is..you can't really...at least not in a pre-selected elimination sports competition style like Consumerist did. And they do it on a flash basis (which means which ever company is the currently visible consumer scandal that week gets disproportionate votes).
The MMO player would do well to embrace the nature of reality: Everything is relative, a projection based upon a malleable set of universal laws. Reality is an elastic process in which our individual choices play an active role.

Hessen's Avatar


Hessen
06.30.2013 , 01:19 PM | #328
I'm gradually coming to the conclusion that nobody actually wants content and just want the shinies at the end. Moreso than ever before.

Doing random Flashpoints or Operations with all manner of people from casuals to very active gamers, there's such a huge amount of "omg press space quicker to skip dialogue" and trash skipping, even boss skipping where possible just to blast through everything as quick as possible.

And this isn't a case of "this is the 100th time I've done this same dungeon". These are people who have either only done the content a small amount of times or even never before.

Add to that the general skipping and speed through the story content that a lot of people do (again, not people who are repeating the content, just general MMOers) it begs the question, do people actually want content or do they just want to coast through bashing things over the head.

I'd guess that a small amount of people want engaging story and a small amount of people want challenging content. But the majority in my experience so far want to quickly go through content, gets the top tier of armour and look awesome and unique and then complain that there's nothing to do.