Please upgrade your browser for the best possible experience.

Chrome Firefox Internet Explorer
×

Where did EA go Wrong?


Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
06.20.2013 , 06:20 PM | #1
That's the question on a lot of people's minds.
How did EA take such a successful franchise, get a lot of followers, and then lose them, almost in an instant.
What did EA do that could have been better, where did they fail?

This is a thread i made to vent my frustrations with this game, but i want to get a few thins straight.
  • I am NOT Unsubbing.
  • This is not Meant to be a QQ thread,
  • Some criticisms will come about but thats not the point of the thread.
  • I love this game.

I want to compare SWTOR to another game on the market. First thought? WOW. But no, so many people will chime in with the "Wow's been around longer" comment.....
So how about a game that's about the same age as tor? Hmm? How about Rift?

First thing to compare. Gameplay.

Rift Revolutionized skill trees. Sounds so simple to do, but they did. 4 base classes, like tor, but Rift has many, MANY skill trees to pick from, you pick from them all, 3 trees to go together, which means tanks can heal themselves and have a dps tree if they want, (They'd probably suck, but hey ho, they can if they want) Dps can go into support roles as a side tree, so can healers, so can even tanks (more sucky tanks) Its not advised, but its customizing your Character! And its great!
Lets look at SWTOR. It did great with advanced classes, they really feel like 2 different classes.
However, lets take the Jedi Consular class. Sage tree's = Seer, Telekenetics, and Balance. Shadow = Kinetic Combat, Infiltration and Balance.
Overall, making about 5 trees, one slightly different depending on class.
If this was rift, you could have Telekenetics, Kinetic Combat and Seer, or Balance, Seer, and Infiltration. It'd be your choice.

Now i can't say this is a fault of bioware, they made an awesome system, it could have just been done better.


Next, is well, fun....
Swtor just doesn't really have the fun aspect of an MMO, hell, thats the reason most people play games, to have fun. In Rift, you can find little items on adventures, that turn you into an imp, a water elemental, a goblin, a bat etc.... of course, combat breaks it, but hey hum, it's still fun as hell! Running around Rift's version of the imperial fleet as a bat, wondering over to the auction house, or even queing for pvp.... It's hilarious.
Its the small things bioware, hell, even a day/night cycle. a lot of MMO's have done it, why not you?

Group content.
Rift has a world event with every major patch, spontanious world events too, between patches, that about half an hour and happen often through the day. It depends on how many people is there too, and it has real CONSEQUENCES.
If theres a lot of people in the area, the invasion becomes huge. And i mean huge. And people can't fight them by themselves, you have to group to save the city, the state, whatever you want to call it its yours to defend.
And if you dont, the consequences are dire. Dont protect your cities? Say goodbye to your quest NPC's.
If no one went to do the Gree Event, bioware wouldnt give a ****. It's true, they wouldn't. Nothing would happen. The Gree wouldn't exact revenge on the Galaxy, you would pay no price.
You're not even asked to group. The biggest groups, the most social thing about that event was the Levelling Boosters, and that even got shut down.

Finally, the last thing i want to touch on.... The F2P model.
I currently Sub to TOR, and F2P rift. To be honest, theres no difference between the two.
I have no Warfront/Warzone caps in Rift, no Dungeon caps, no Raid limits.... The Subs get benefits though, they get to summon trainers and vendors wherever, they get free EXP boosts every day, they get free pets etc, and monthly grants and Loyalty rewards.
They have a cash shop in rift, but most of the things in there can be earnt in game anyway, its just easier through the cash shop, and that WORKS!

I want to sub to Rift now simply because it seems they care about their Subs and F2P players alike, and i swear, the F2P model for TOR is tyrannical. Even Preferred Status players have too many limits, my guildies sub lapsed the other day because his boss hadn't payed him yet, and he could do a couple PVP games with us before he was forced to log because there was nothing else he wanted to do, and he had to pay IRL money, or 200,000 credits as it is on our server, for a Warzone pass that he'd use for a day or two....



Anyway, i wanted to get that off my chest, and i have to ask, what do you guys think?

I'd like to keep this thread free of Flaming etc, but i doubt that'll happen, but i want to know, what do you think they could have done better?

I'll say it one last time, i love TOR, i wont leave anytime soon, but it saddens me to see what this game is becoming.
The Mandalorian Wars were a series of massacres that masked another war, a war of conversion. Culminating in a final atrocity that no Jedi could walk away fromů save one.
Zarys Sorcerer Cathinka Seeliara Sage
Force In Balance - The Harbinger

TheBBP's Avatar


TheBBP
06.20.2013 , 06:30 PM | #2
Quote: Originally Posted by Selenial View Post
  • This is not Meant to be a QQ thread,
Oddly enough, by all appearances this is a "I wish TOR was more like RIFT" QQ thread. You probably meant something completely different though.

However, when you use words like "tyrannical" to describe how a game is run, you are indeed QQing.
REPUBLIC TROOPERS
Crosswire - Heavy GunnerElÝta-one - Combat Medic
Canonball - Pointman

Ebon Hawk

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
06.20.2013 , 06:34 PM | #3
Quote: Originally Posted by TheBBP View Post
Oddly enough, by all appearances this is a "I wish TOR was more like RIFT" QQ thread. You probably meant something completely different though.

However, when you use words like "tyrannical" to describe how a game is run, you are indeed QQing.
Yeh, re reading it i know that's how it came out....

Basically, it was meant to show where Ea could have pushed the boat out..... EG, they Havn't put Cross Server que's because it's too hard and complex, yet Rift has it because they know its what their subs want and they can't just rely on a Sub base loyal to the idea of the MMO, not the MMO itself.


I don't want it to be like rift... I want it to be like an MMO...
The Mandalorian Wars were a series of massacres that masked another war, a war of conversion. Culminating in a final atrocity that no Jedi could walk away fromů save one.
Zarys Sorcerer Cathinka Seeliara Sage
Force In Balance - The Harbinger

Altaress's Avatar


Altaress
06.20.2013 , 06:36 PM | #4
TL: DR it's pointless to discuss EA won't hear you
Darth Anţmus - Sith Juggernaut - Midian

Selenial's Avatar


Selenial
06.20.2013 , 06:37 PM | #5
Quote:
it's pointless to discuss EA won't hear you
Don't you think it's odd that this entire community seems to think the Devs dont give a **** about them?
The Mandalorian Wars were a series of massacres that masked another war, a war of conversion. Culminating in a final atrocity that no Jedi could walk away fromů save one.
Zarys Sorcerer Cathinka Seeliara Sage
Force In Balance - The Harbinger

Suromir's Avatar


Suromir
06.20.2013 , 06:43 PM | #6
Quote: Originally Posted by Selenial View Post
Don't you think it's odd that this entire community seems to think the Devs dont give a **** about them?
as long as enough are subbing and they continue to make money from the CM..they really don't.

In Beta WE TOLD THEM they NEEDED to change the EXACT THINGS that lead to the exodus of players and to SWTOR becoming f2p...they didn't listen.

discussing it is fine...I've brought up similar points in other threads and continue to do so...however, don't expect them to listen or care about what you have to say.

it's like this...the game will continue the way it is as long as it makes money. And once it drops below the threshold EA deams worth keeping it going..it will just be shut down.

snoopy's Avatar


snoopy
06.20.2013 , 06:48 PM | #7
1) Underestimated how quick MMO players burn through content.

2) Did not have an attractive enough end game--at least at the time--for those who burnt through content.

3) Led to people burning through story content in a month or two and quitting.

Grayseven's Avatar


Grayseven
06.20.2013 , 06:58 PM | #8
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink

Problems are reported, bugs discussed, various issues debated but we can't make the Development team listen. It is obvious that they do pay attention to the forums but it is also obvious that what they consider to be critical is probably not the same thing that we as players see as critical.

Otherwise Cybertechs would have been able to RE Adv Cybertech droid parts, the Alderaan bonus series bug would not still exist, we wouldn't still see our GCD fire off without an ability firing and the thousand other things that still happen even though they've been reported and discussed for a long time would be fixed...or at least someone could have said something about the state of fixes (you know, we are working on it but...) at the least.

EA/BW went wrong in the same ways countless other MMO's have gone wrong. That's pretty sad considering that they had all of those other Dev mistakes to look at and try to avoid. It's not specifically an EA/BW issue as a number of new MMO's have made the very same mistakes, but I really expected better considering the amount of resources that were dumped into this game.

Where exactly did they go wrong? That's a question with a lot of answers that all completely depend on the person answering. For me, it's Customer Service and the little things like apparently simple bugs not being fixed and the fact that only class story missions are supported by CS. A company not willing to put the effort into the details (and this is solely my perception) fails in my eyes.

Everyone would have to answer this question for themselves, continue to fight the good fight and hope that someone opens their eyes to the issues before it is too late.
"50 Grades of Shae", a heart-warming novel about a Mandalorian that delivers beat-downs and assigns grades to her victims.

Mindshard's Avatar


Mindshard
06.20.2013 , 07:10 PM | #9
EA may have rushed it, but it was BW that designed a game where (even before beta started) they said endgame was rolling a new class and experiencing that story, where voiceovers were top priority.
It's fun and all to blame EA, but the game design was BW for better or worse.

Monkfishysnow's Avatar


Monkfishysnow
06.20.2013 , 07:11 PM | #10
They went wrong when they screwed up the end-game and the balance of Imperiai and Republic.

If you were here at the start you should remember the Ilum massacres that occurred every day. Most Imperials reached Battlemaster in a matter of a few hours slaughtering Republicans meaning PvP balance got thrown way out of proportion, 90% of the Imps were in Battlemaster gear wrecking everyone and the Republics had everyone stuck in some Champion gear.

Gear was major luck based. The most annoying thing ever. You would grind for hours to get enough commendations for a Lockbox, open it and voila a piece of gear you have or do not need and there's nothing you can do about it. If you looked at my cargo hold you would see about 4 sets of Champion Gear and Battlemaster Gear which is what I had to go through just to get the 1 set of Battlemaster Gear I needed.

Operations and Flashpoints got boring. Fast. They were full of bugs and again the luck based drops was atrocious.

Their final grave digger was the fact that they flipped endgear on its head. Got rid of The tionese, the columi the Rakata the Recruit, Champion, Battlemaster gear. Everything that players from the start were used to and they get rid of it all and mash together some new gear (which is all ugly as hell and all looks the same for both pve and pvp). They also made Battlemaster gear redundant, the gear most of us spent hundreds of hours to obtain by releasing that stupid expertise bolster update and this majorly puts anyone off from trying it again after being away for a while. - I know from personal experience, you can't get back into SWTOR if you played the first few months and come back now, not without MAJOR dedication which only the 1% will be willing to put in.