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Macros for pvp, respecing, grabbing huttballs. Legal?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Macros for pvp, respecing, grabbing huttballs. Legal?
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beattlebilly's Avatar


beattlebilly
07.04.2013 , 11:03 AM | #361
Huh, nvm. Wow, they really need to get with Razer about the marketing of that keyboard LMAO .

From Amazon description:

Quote:
Extreme Anti-Ghosting for Multi-Key Press Destruction
The Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ Gaming Keyboard by Razer™ complete anti-ghosting of up to 10 key presses to let you further expand your repertoire of boss-killing, Flashpoint-destroying, and world-exploring macros and skills. With the ability to execute more than a single key command at one time, it’s an absolute competitive advantage for taking your game to the next level.
Jedi CovenantThe Paranormal LegacyPacific Trident Global Jundland Biscuits and Gravy

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

Dragonexadon's Avatar


Dragonexadon
07.05.2013 , 06:19 PM | #362
Quote: Originally Posted by beattlebilly View Post
Huh, nvm. Wow, they really need to get with Razer about the marketing of that keyboard LMAO .

From Amazon description:
This.
I am 100% upset by this thread. I am a huge SWTOR fan. I bought a SWTOR mouse and headset . I even bought the keyboard but returned it due to poor quality.

The mouse and keyboard have built in macro software. More-so the keyboard (with an ability to record macros while playing and Icons that come from swtor to label your macros)

To be honest I never did macros before, but today I decided to make one. Leveling a shadow i found it easy to map kinect ward to hit every-time I use project or telekentic throw. Smeone from my guild later said OI could get banned for such an action.

"No way! " I said "I am using what was advertised by SWTOR a product made for SWTOR" but surely he was right. I saw this thread and choked.

Macros have been going on forever in this gaming environment forever. If you did not want in in the game then perhaps you should not have had a SWTOR keyboard or mouse, which company claimed they worked closely with you to make it work well, record macros.

I defend BioWare a lot. But not on this. No matter what you say about how the mouse opr keyboard was advertised it is clear to all that they were meant for macros. An ability I could now be banned for. Come on BioWare please adjust this to allow the functionality of the razor synapis.
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DTuloJr's Avatar


DTuloJr
07.10.2013 , 02:05 PM | #363
This thread has been thoroughly enjoyable to read. Here's my two cents on the subject...

1. Allowing macros in-game would require a macro programming language to be actually be present in the game engine, end-user accessible, and user-friendly to learn. As the HeroEngine is the core of SWTOR, and at least as of the time of SWTOR's design, test, and early release phases did NOT include anything end-user accessible nor user-friendly to learn, it would likely require something custom-written that would translate the end-user macro language into backend SWTOR developer tool language (likely including HeroScript or something akin to it). This is not something likely to be trivial.

2. The ONLY way macros could be entirely undetectable would be to use a mechanical keyboard that was isolated from the operating system. They DO exist, but are insanely impractical. As this scenario is likely to only occur in *EXTREME* ($$$$$$$$!!!) multi-boxing scenarios, software, interacting with the operating system through various function calls, will be running and in memory. Running processes and memory can be monitored, examined, forensically preserved, and logged. Don't think it can occur or is legal? Two words for 'ya: Blizzard. Warden. There is no reason BioWare can not do the same. And may have. Or may be thinking about it. That's how a lot of MMO engines are monitoring for hack's and exploits at the game client.

3. Someone at BioWare needs to have a chat with the Razer folks about their product marketing. It's basically advertised in a very direct manner telling us we can buy their Officially Licensed SWTOR product, play SWTOR, and violate SWTOR ToS. Consumer protection complaints might actually have real traction.
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foxmob's Avatar


foxmob
07.10.2013 , 02:31 PM | #364
kinda surprised (not quite shocked) that BW is adamantly opposed to...macros. they're part and parcel with any mmorpg afaik. but whatever. not my game.

as for the respeccing thing, the problem isn't the macro. it's that they can respec mid-WZ in the first place.

:2cents:
Krackerjack/Deinon/Antiphon
JC -- Harb -- TEH

DTuloJr's Avatar


DTuloJr
07.10.2013 , 04:30 PM | #365
Quote: Originally Posted by foxmob View Post
kinda surprised (not quite shocked) that BW is adamantly opposed to...macros. they're part and parcel with any mmorpg afaik. but whatever. not my game.

as for the respeccing thing, the problem isn't the macro. it's that they can respec mid-WZ in the first place.

:2cents:
They didn't used to be opposed to it during SWTOR development, and I'm not entirely convinced they are now. Simply put, they bought the HeroEngine core game engine and server architecture and modified it to suit their purposes. Adding in and/or maintaining a macro language into an MMO is not a trivial undertaking. Other MMO's that have allowed a macro language tend to have been built with that macro language as part of their foundation; often, devs of those MMOs actually use a superset of that macro language to program the MMO... and the scripting language used for backend SWTOR, if its modified off of what comes with HE, is a true programming language, not suitable for end-users to learn and play with.

I was part of the original crowd that implored BioWare to build in LUA support. Unfortunately, there have been no surprises on the progress and results of that, so far.
Join The Dark Side™. We have coffee, doughnuts, and cookies.

foxmob's Avatar


foxmob
07.10.2013 , 04:41 PM | #366
gonna be honest, I only got the gist there. technicalities not so much. but we're talking about software, built into every mmo input device ever invented, being used to press one key and activate a string of commands. it's outside the parameters of coding (I realize you can actually macro inside of wow). not a big deal.
Krackerjack/Deinon/Antiphon
JC -- Harb -- TEH

Aluvi's Avatar


Aluvi
07.10.2013 , 06:02 PM | #367
Whether or not macros, or peripherals that produce them, are allowed is kind of irrelevant when Bioware has no real way to prevent players from using them, and I don't believe that they have the technical competency to actually monitor and catch said players, considering that other players have used blatant hacks and exploits (200% speed hack that doubles your movement as well as your GCD rate / cooldown recharge speed, among others), FLAUNTED those exploits and hacks (go look up gingers) in BW's face, and they did nothing for months, and months, and months. You would have to stand outside of BW HQ with a giant sign that says "HEY MY ACCOUNT IS XXXXXXXXX AND I HACK, BAN ME" for half a year straight before they would even notice you.
Aluvien Sith Marauder <Infinite Darkness> Shadowlands
Aluviann Jedi Sentinel <Triumph> Shadowlands

enabe's Avatar


enabe
07.13.2013 , 05:33 PM | #368
Quote: Originally Posted by Aluvi View Post
Whether or not macros, or peripherals that produce them, are allowed is kind of irrelevant when Bioware has no real way to prevent players from using them, and I don't believe that they have the technical competency to actually monitor and catch said players, considering that other players have used blatant hacks and exploits (200% speed hack that doubles your movement as well as your GCD rate / cooldown recharge speed, among others), FLAUNTED those exploits and hacks (go look up gingers) in BW's face, and they did nothing for months, and months, and months. You would have to stand outside of BW HQ with a giant sign that says "HEY MY ACCOUNT IS XXXXXXXXX AND I HACK, BAN ME" for half a year straight before they would even notice you.
Well i can tell you for a fact that people that are using macros are getting a week ban from the game and a ban from the forums that according to the account will never be lifted but BW as you said does nothing to people when they are report by other player that they are speed hacking so i say that BW just needs to forget about the macros and look more in to the people that are speed hacking and also more into the gold farmers i get a tell at least 4 times a day from gold farmers and i report them every time and the next day they are back doing the same thing and they keep coming back lets get the gold farmers and the speed hackers out of the game before worring about the macros. Macros are a small thing that still has to go by game mechanics unless their is a speed hack to rest GCD faster which most people i know that run macros do not use so leave the macros in the game and get the people that are hacking the game.

Glzmo's Avatar


Glzmo
11.15.2013 , 05:11 PM | #369
Quote: Originally Posted by Phillip_BW View Post
Chiming in....

I'll be as clear as I can be.

Automation of the game in any way is against the ToS. This includes macro'ing in order to respec during Warzone matches.

Remapping keys on a keyboard (or Nostromo or Logitech) device so that one key press == one click or ability cast within the game is fine. Using a programmable keyboard or software macro so that one key press == multiple clicks or ability casts in the game is not.

Hopefully that doesn't leave room for 'interpretation'. If it does, ask a binary question and I'll give a yes/no
Could you please at least add all emotes to the keymap and give us the ability to put them into toolbars so we don't have to macro much-used emotes anymore?

DeadDogBarking's Avatar


DeadDogBarking
11.16.2013 , 12:04 PM | #370
Quote: Originally Posted by Glzmo View Post
Could you please at least add all emotes to the keymap and give us the ability to put them into toolbars so we don't have to macro much-used emotes anymore?
I record allot of WZs and will specifically send in proof of someone "spitting" on me if it happens as I die or when the player is still hitting on me. I believe in hard competition in everything I do, but sportsmanship is part of it. If I have the ability to reply to a knee jerk insult that they were too lazy to type out - they reap what they sow etc. I am pretty sure bioware is not going to ban them specifically for this one action, but where there smoke etc, and it is obvious they have access to and use macros (and a very liberal view of how their actions may affect others).

I do agree that one qwik key should enable the emotes an "emotes" window with assignable keys for the emotes. I do not want to have to fit the emotes into my general kwik keys (I am running out of space)