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Hey Look At Me- I'm A Sensational PvP Bug, Fix Me

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Hey Look At Me- I'm A Sensational PvP Bug, Fix Me
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RyanReagan's Avatar


RyanReagan
06.17.2013 , 04:35 PM | #251
Quote: Originally Posted by Jherad View Post
On armor, absolutely. I'm really talking about weapons here. Specifically, is the static amount of expertise granted to PvP weapons enough to offset the ever increasing power of PvE weapons?

At what point will the latest and greated PVE tier weapon be better than Partisan in open world PvP? Are we close to there yet?
in open world. expertise is going to be king over anything pve. yes, technically, if they kept increasing the stats on pve weapons past the 72's, you would eventually reach a point where the stat increases make up for the difference -- but i think they'd probably have new tier of pvp gear by that point.

for now, in open world conq is better than the best pve gear.
C.K. <Infinite Darkness> S.N. <Infinite Darkness> K.R. <Infinite Darkness> C.K.▓ <Infinite Darkness>

Jherad's Avatar


Jherad
06.17.2013 , 05:16 PM | #252
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthBloodloss View Post
I think conqueror is better in open world.

2018 expertise = 60% damage boost
1009 expertise = 30% damage boost
100.9 expertise = 3% damage boost
300 expertise = 9% damage boost

The difference in using 2 conqueror weapons in open world PvP is a 9% damage boost over any PvE weapon. A 2000 damage attack will gain 180 damage or the equivalent of 900 power. I don't think any PvE weapons will have a standard 900 higher power (or 180 more damage) than a conqueror weapon.

Using 2 conqueror weapons: With a 7000 damage crit, it adds 630 damage, or the equivalent of 3150 power per attack. PvE looking even worse in this crit scenario.

And this is not to mention the healing bonus or damage reduction from expertise.
What about just a single hilt/barrel? The penalty for mixing pvp/pve mods does not apply in open world, so I'd be curious if the 68 expertise makes up for the extra weapon damage and stats of the PvE hilt.

Advanced Might Hilt 33: 96 str 81 end
Advanced Rage Hilt 28X: 68 str 68 end 68 exp

174 Lightsaber weapon damage: 539-808
154 Lightsaber weapon damage: 423-635
Zachar´ah - Commando / Chasso - Merc
Youtube / Twitch
2.4 is the PvP Patch! ... J/K, Removing RWZs trolololol

DarthBloodloss's Avatar


DarthBloodloss
06.17.2013 , 06:44 PM | #253
Quote: Originally Posted by Jherad View Post
What about just a single hilt/barrel?
So we are talking....full conqueror weapon but swap the barrel for a bigger PvE barrel.

**My reply is taking into consideration using a PvE barrel/hilt with a PvP Mod and Enhancement for the purpose of open world PvP** Please note that these are top-of-the-head numbers and I'm sure there are a few errors somewhere...but I did my best.

PvE barrel (in main hand) will add (rough guess) 75 additional damage over a PvP barrel when you consider the higher damage range, and the additional tech/force power. But like I said, this is a rough guess and could be anywhere from 60-100 additional damage.

I come to this conclusion by giving an extra +45 damage for the min-max damage range of the weapon, and an extra +30 bonus damage from the increased tech/force power. So when compared to a PvP weapon....a high end PvE weapon will do roughly 75 more damage per attack.

Now if we compare that to the same weapon with a PvP barrel instead....
We have determined that the PvE barrel adds 75 damage, and the PvP barrel adds 60 expertise. Now how much is that expertise worth?

So we are looking at an expertise bonus of roughly 1.7% bonus damage. On a 2000 damage attack, this adds 34 damage which is less than the 75 added via PvE barrel. On a 4500 damage attack, it adds about 75 damage which is equal to the PvE barrel. On a 7500 damage crit, the expertise adds 127 damage which is more than the PvE 75 damage.

So my conclusion (with a decent margin of error) is that the PvP barrel/hilt will slightly benefit the big hits/crits (because it adds a flat percent to the already big damage numbers). But the PvE barrel benefits non-crits slightly more (because it adds a decent static amount to the low damage attacks). In theory, a mixed weapon could be a little better (then full PvP or PvE) in open world pvp, but by a very small margin (and won't boost crits as much as the full PvP weapon).
Bloodloss Mercenary
DESTROYER OF WORLDS || KEEPER OF SOULS

Warforever's Avatar


Warforever
06.17.2013 , 06:51 PM | #254
Quote: Originally Posted by Glower View Post
This is crazy...



Sure lol!


Also: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=6378208 "Relic placed in bottom slot not triggering"
Lol he wrote that to me...I think
How does one earn a Bronze Star but not a CAB or CIB

DarthBloodloss's Avatar


DarthBloodloss
06.17.2013 , 06:57 PM | #255
Random comment to that link you posted about bottom relic not triggering.... I wanted to test for myself so I used my WZ dummy and was able to have 2 different relics proc back-to-back.

PvP Power Proc and PvP Damage Proc

The bug I found with them is that one of the relics only proc'd from Tech attacks, and one only proc'd from Ranged. I wouldn't be surprised if they are acting different due to being on my ship.

My test was:
1) Tracer: Power Proc triggers (keep repeating until it procs)
2) Rapid Shots: Damage Proc triggers right away (sometimes)

I was able to get back-to-back procs on my ship.
Bloodloss Mercenary
DESTROYER OF WORLDS || KEEPER OF SOULS

Warforever's Avatar


Warforever
06.17.2013 , 06:59 PM | #256
I think bolster should just go away at endgame. Bring back recruit gear. I played through it, go my arse stomped but I'd rather that than have full pvp gear and still get stomped by someone in PvE gear
How does one earn a Bronze Star but not a CAB or CIB

Jherad's Avatar


Jherad
06.18.2013 , 04:36 AM | #257
Quote: Originally Posted by DarthBloodloss View Post
So my conclusion (with a decent margin of error) is that the PvP barrel/hilt will slightly benefit the big hits/crits (because it adds a flat percent to the already big damage numbers). But the PvE barrel benefits non-crits slightly more (because it adds a decent static amount to the low damage attacks). In theory, a mixed weapon could be a little better (then full PvP or PvE) in open world pvp, but by a very small margin (and won't boost crits as much as the full PvP weapon).
Thanks for that! Based on this and what the ID peeps (/waves) have said it looks like yeah, we're at least at tier from having to worry about it too much.

Appreciate the time you all put into answering the question.
Zachar´ah - Commando / Chasso - Merc
Youtube / Twitch
2.4 is the PvP Patch! ... J/K, Removing RWZs trolololol

adiwantinova's Avatar


adiwantinova
06.18.2013 , 06:20 AM | #258
I don't know why they won't just take anything that isn't with +expertise on it & just force it into 90% of the base stats for Partisan.

Have Underworld min/maxed gear? Congratulations! You have 90% of Partisan base stats.

Exploiting level 54 purple unmoddable Power stacking? Congratulations! You have 90% of Partisan base stats.

Completely naked? Congratulations! You get no stats (why would you be naked?).

The only thing that I'd be okay with them doing beyond this would be them applying PVE set bonuses to the 90% of Partisan bolstering. I can even be convinced that this can go away in pvp, too.
ADI-WAN TINOVA
Adi-Wan, Sentinel | Theresee, Sage | Kahlvin, Guardian
The Shadowlands | <RotJ> | <Triumph>

Helig's Avatar


Helig
06.18.2013 , 06:25 AM | #259
Quote: Originally Posted by adiwantinova View Post
Completely naked? Congratulations! You get no stats (why would you be naked?).
Made me smile, thanks.
"I'm not *giving* him cake, I'm *assaulting* him with cake!" - Pinkamena Diane Pie

Jherad's Avatar


Jherad
06.18.2013 , 06:31 AM | #260
Quote: Originally Posted by adiwantinova View Post
I don't know why they won't just take anything that isn't with +expertise on it & just force it into 90% of the base stats for Partisan.

Have Underworld min/maxed gear? Congratulations! You have 90% of Partisan base stats.

Exploiting level 54 purple unmoddable Power stacking? Congratulations! You have 90% of Partisan base stats.

Completely naked? Congratulations! You get no stats (why would you be naked?).

The only thing that I'd be okay with them doing beyond this would be them applying PVE set bonuses to the 90% of Partisan bolstering. I can even be convinced that this can go away in pvp, too.
Yeah. Even better - They could have a template piece for every slot that you are effectively given behind the scenes when PvPing IF you are not wearing PvP gear (with all +expertise mods) in that slot.

Avoid any fancy math completely. Less room for odd scenarios and exploits. Just update the templates whenever a new tier of PvP gear comes out. Job done.
Zachar´ah - Commando / Chasso - Merc
Youtube / Twitch
2.4 is the PvP Patch! ... J/K, Removing RWZs trolololol