ETA on Advanced Class change?

This is exactly what I mean. They did not design them as a full class. This is EXACTLY WHAT HE SAYS.

DE:...inside one of those we treated them LIKE a full class, and in an MMO you always have options.

He did not say "we treated them AS a full class" like is often posted. He said LIKE a full class. Which falls perfectly in line with all the other statements made about them looking at them LIKE they are unique class designs, seeing them as very similar to a new class, etc. Also note he was speaking to ROLE OPTIONS in context. Cherrypicking to make a point AND changing what was said....not good.

Does he mean they are a class? You could say that. You could also say what I contended. They see them that way, but they were not designed that way.

This misquoting seems to happen quite a bit from the anti folks...taking direct quotes and changing what was said to match what you want.

The proof?

Listen to it yourself. Also note the context of what he was talking about and the fact that he said it could all change.

I say if your going to make an argument using Bioware statements you have to AT LEAST make sure you the statements you post are accurate. I go through GREAT PAINS to make sure every quote I post is verbatim.

You are welcome to check every single quote I have posted to see that I am telling the truth. I will gladly stand up to that scrutiny.

Oh...BTW, the old forums are not gone. Wayback machine. Most of it is there.

Lose the attitude, especially towards this gentleman, he has stated multiple times his views towards this, and none of them have been strongly for AC changes. He is playing the middleman in this thread.

So how about you get your facts straight and go read through previous posts before you open your trap.

Makes me think that they are trying to figure out a way to put this feature in the game. If they were standing next to no they would have shut this thread down 100 pages ago.

This was my point earlier, people are against AC changes but are willing to go for it if theres a huge penalty...why? its still AC changes. Lol people are so silly they just want to make a big deal out of it.

And how is changing ACs any different then changing up your spec/soul in any other game?
Paladin = Paladin abilities + holy/ret/prot abilities + skill tree abilities
Trooper = Trooper abilities + commando/vanguard abilities + skill tree abilities

Now before you tell me that Holy Ret and Prot are the skill trees, think back to when you hit level 10, you HAD to pick one of them so you would gain certain abilities that the other 2 could not, but you still learned your paladin abilities.
Its the same thing.

You really can't be serious.

Or you don't know how to make statements and present them as opinion instead of facts. Which one do you think is more reasonable or likely? My guess would be the person that actual goes by what was said instead of what I think when it comes to claiming facts.

Every contention you make Majik can be seen as reasonable and logical. The problem is not your logic, it is how you present it and beat everyone else over the head with it.

The game does not tell me AC is a class. It tells me the choice is permanent. One can infer that means it is a meaningful or important choice and perhaps it is a unique class if they stretch it that far. But that is not a verbatim definition for AC.

Yes I am. The facts that you seem to ignore and continue to do so. Might be good if you read the last two quotes. It's pretty relevant to our discussion.

No. and No. You want the info, look for it in the thread yourself. It's has been posted more than enough times.

There are so many things wrong with this statement I couldn't even begin to correct them. I will only say hyperbole does not help your argument, an argument that makes little sense in the first place.

Yes, Majik, upper left, the one below right under chat. Enough about the dot. It wasn't there for very long when I started in beta. It got removed shortly after that.

I thought one of my pixels in my monitor was bad. I even posted about it in the forums. Got me a little miffed to be honest, almost bought a new monitor.

In the end Majik, this is what I think you are saying, after leaning out all the diatribe....

1) AC choice is meaningful enough, there is no need to make any statements, changes to the game or the like.
2) AC is a class. Bioware has certainly STRONGLY INFERRED this on more than one occasion. They have not said anything to the contrary to date.
3) There is no reasonable reason to allow AC change. It is contrary to the original decision Bioware made to remove the option in Beta. That decision was made for valid reasons that remain valid today.

If I am wrong, let me know.

They are all certainly reasonable viewpoints and you are entitled to them...though I may not completely agree, I think we agree mostly on the important points.

The real contention between us is of course my desire to have them "put this to bed", so to speak and the idea that I see ACs as being different to be considered classes, where you see them as clear and concise classes with no doubt.

Right so getting gear from an op, that requires other players is the same as leveling a character on your own.

Come on, is that the best you got?

You can't even respond to my points that destroyed whatever argument you had. So how are you any different?

Nice hyperbole. The mere fact that you have to go to those extreme's means that you have lost this argument a long time ago.

Start staying on topic and talking about the situation at hand. Not these "end of the world" scenario's you proclaim will happen but still have yet to provide any proof to support such claims.

You should learn to accept change, otherwise the world will leave you behind. I guess you must be fine with that since you battle any change in the game at all cost. So who wants to go back to level 14 sprint? This poster above does!