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Fixing Shadow Tank Spikiness

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > Classes > Jedi Consular > Shadow
Fixing Shadow Tank Spikiness
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Berjiz's Avatar


Berjiz
09.12.2013 , 09:25 AM | #651
Quote: Originally Posted by THoK-Zeus View Post
21:39:45.464 Mercenary Demolitionist's Rocket Launcher hits I'risa for 7997 kinetic damage, causing 7997 threat.
21:39:52.017 Mercenary Demolitionist's Rocket Launcher glances I'risa for 6293 kinetic damage, causing 6293 threat.

Out of your log, you died 2 seconds afterwards. Not bothered to comment that anyway. I tanked trasher 16 hm atleast 20 times without a single time dieing, with a lot of different and mostly random healers.

I posted several things about migating damage on thrasher (countering swipes with Resilience...). As i see that you did also shroud excactly 0 swipes on this fight, you should probably rather improve then complain.

Also i see your start rotation is totally wrong, as you start with Taunt!!!! on a boss (yeah gives you 1542 threat to use it, that will help you against your dps). You know that there's a force pull ability that generates about 6 times as much threat as your taunt at the very beginning?

If you are using a standard rotation you won't lose aggro against your dps like on this fight.

In the end i just see from your logs that you did bad. You have the wrong starting rotation, you get uneccersary damage, you use your cooldowns at the wrong times.
I don't know really what you did right. Your damage output seems on par for this fight (1488 after 2:30 is average for thrasher assassin fight) and that's about it i suppose.
Does trasher have f/t attacks on hm? I though that was only nim. Trasher 16 man hm is a good example of big spikes against assasins but they are doable since you take at max 28k if you get sniped+swipe. The followup on that atttack is a little while after so there is time to heal.

Nim 16 man thraser numbers would be far more useful, does anyone have that?
Drebi Darkness Assassin
Ve'shix Carnage Marauder

The Red Eclipse

Vaidinah's Avatar


Vaidinah
09.12.2013 , 05:38 PM | #652
Quote: Originally Posted by Berjiz View Post
Does trasher have f/t attacks on hm? I though that was only nim. Trasher 16 man hm is a good example of big spikes against assasins but they are doable since you take at max 28k if you get sniped+swipe. The followup on that atttack is a little while after so there is time to heal.

Nim 16 man thraser numbers would be far more useful, does anyone have that?
Yes, he does. Swipe will be resisted by Force Shroud/Resilience on HM. It also happens on a predictable basis with one happening roughly 10-11 seconds after the knockback. So you use Force Shroud about 8 seconds after you get knocked into the wall (or your co-tank if you guys swap on the boss) and you will resist a ton of damage.
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Berjiz's Avatar


Berjiz
09.12.2013 , 06:14 PM | #653
Quote: Originally Posted by Vaidinah View Post
Yes, he does. Swipe will be resisted by Force Shroud/Resilience on HM. It also happens on a predictable basis with one happening roughly 10-11 seconds after the knockback. So you use Force Shroud about 8 seconds after you get knocked into the wall (or your co-tank if you guys swap on the boss) and you will resist a ton of damage.
Thanks a lot That is going to be very useful.
Drebi Darkness Assassin
Ve'shix Carnage Marauder

The Red Eclipse

Stavroz's Avatar


Stavroz
09.15.2013 , 12:43 AM | #654
Quick suggestion

How would ppl feel that if they changed Kinetic ward to:

Erects a Kinitic ward with 15 charges that increases you armour by 1% per charge. Every time you are hit you lose 1 charge.
Then for Kinetic Bulwark in the Kinetic Combat tree:
Every time 1 charge of kinetic ward is consumed Kinetic ward increase armour rating by .5%. Stacks up to 8 times.

So basically at full charge a shadows armour will increase to 49% (similar to guardian) and will drop down to 38% at 1 charge while kinetic ward is active.
Do you think this would help?

I know the Devs said they wanted the shadow to be a skill tank it seems to me that using Kinetic ward to pump up our Armour is the way to go in anticipation for dmg.
Quote: Originally Posted by Recon_Grim View Post
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Okyr's Avatar


Okyr
09.30.2013 , 01:10 PM | #655
I have no idea of the actual math or if it'd be OP or anything....but wouldn't the easiest thing to do be a bump up so we can wear medium armor as tanks?

Simmerr's Avatar


Simmerr
09.30.2013 , 03:54 PM | #656
Quote: Originally Posted by Okyr View Post
I have no idea of the actual math or if it'd be OP or anything....but wouldn't the easiest thing to do be a bump up so we can wear medium armor as tanks?
This would be more resource intensive compared to just giving us an armor increase in our skill tree, but yes, this would help. Would have to completely change all our gear around though...
Str'iker -- Assassin Tank
Str'yker -- Merc DPS
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Aelanis's Avatar


Aelanis
10.01.2013 , 11:38 AM | #657
Unfortunately, both the increase to medium armor and the +1% armor per stack of Kinetic Ward would be a really heavy handed change to balance. Both of those options would give Shadows so much mitigation that it would more than make up for the spikiness, and make them outright better than the other tanks. Shadows have low armor rating because they heal off the damage they take or resist it in other ways. We already need 5% less healing on average, so upping our armor rating by anything as extreme as these two options would give us a damage profile almost as smooth as a Vanguard in addition to all the other ways Shadows prevent or heal damage.
Ellendra (Kinetic Combat), Markan (Sawbones), Tenthiumus (Vigilance), Imilvos (Watchman), Mintilvos (Combat Medic),
Theraton (Madness), Xekran (Marksmanship)
The Shadowlands

Ancaglon's Avatar


Ancaglon
10.02.2013 , 08:48 AM | #658
Don't you think that actively maintaining 2 buffs to keep your mitigation somewhere near what the other 2 tanks get passively from just their heavy armor should be worth something extra?

This change addresses many of the conceptual problems with Shadows, including the fact that we were far too good in lower level content, then shockingly bad in high-end content (16-man ops and nightmare) -- if the design team can be sure that all 3 tanks are pretty much as "tanky" as each other, it significantly reduces the amount of effort they need to spend on making sure that one category of tanks isn't being insta-gibbed while another can sleepwalk through it, and hence work on making the rest of the events actually fun.

dipstik's Avatar


dipstik
10.02.2013 , 03:41 PM | #659
its more like 5 buffs now

slow time, force breach, kinetic ward, kinetic bulwark, harnessed shadows

depending on how much more armor the heavies get, we will require the least healing still, and it will all be front loaded mitigation, which is nice.

helpmewin's Avatar


helpmewin
12.12.2013 , 01:34 PM | #660
Ok guys. This whining helps u to close NiM content? And this changes make shadow more valueable for PvP tanking on ranked, PvE tanking? Are u happy? Just want to know. Am i only who didn't happy with this changes?
Sithexecutor(where Tactics buff?)
Helpmewin
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