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Why no acknowledgement of overpowered heals?

STAR WARS: The Old Republic > English > PvP
Why no acknowledgement of overpowered heals?

VigDiath's Avatar


VigDiath
05.15.2013 , 02:11 PM | #11
I won't lie. I went up against a Sorc Healer/TankSin combo in VoidStar the other night. Could not kill either of them no matter how much I focused the healer and the tank was good at peeling. We probably had half of our team trying to kill them while they stayed near the doors the whole time guarding. They had Snipers, Operatives and Bounty Hunters making it hard for us too but this duo knew what they were doing.

Now I may not have been able to kill them because I was balance spec. I did it for sh*ts and giggles since I normally spec for Infiltration when I go DPS in matches or Tank spec. But we had good healers as well and I came out with 690k+ damage and maybe 3 deaths.

I won't chalk that up to a healer who was OP, but rather to a good team dynamic who knew what they were doing and were geared to the teeth, fully optimized, fully augmented and knew how to play. The tank had the healer guarded, taunted at all the right times and had team mates who made it hard for dps to kill their healer. Nothing else.
Jedi Covenant (The Baltimore Legacy)
Laaron - 55 (Shadow Tank) Eulora - 55 (Sage Healer)
Madmartygan - 55 (Guardian DPS) Skylaadawn - 55 (Sab Smug)
Akon - 55 (Carnage Marauder) L'aron - 53 (Sorc Healer)

MajinUltima's Avatar


MajinUltima
05.15.2013 , 02:17 PM | #12
Quote: Originally Posted by Natharon View Post
So if 1 player could in theory kill a healer who is doing everything he can to stay alive with everything he can to kill that healer, that isn't balanced?
You are right the post was inane.
If the healer is being aggressively focused by a competent dps, with both giving it their all, the healer SHOULD eventually go down within a reasonable timeframe. The healer isn't being allowed to freecast, which SHOULD be a big dent to their efficiency. All healing specs have multiple escape and disabling mechanisms to reduce the amount of incoming pressure a player can apply thoguh. Healing should not be so overpowered that the ONLY thing a healer has to do is run away with a HOT on themselves and live indefinitely, which is currently the case.

The only healer which currently even seems to suffer from being attacked is Merc/Commando. Sage/Sorc has plenty of tools to escape with. Op/Scoundrel does way too much instant-cast and really is annoyed more than anything by having to move, and can even use Cover to disable several positioning tools melee specs use.

I'm fine with a freecasting healer doing more healing than players do damage. I'm not fine with a fleeing healer being attacked being able to outheal though, that IS imbalanced.

Not to mention this doesn't even factor in tanks' Guards and Taunts.

Baedwulf's Avatar


Baedwulf
05.15.2013 , 02:18 PM | #13
Being a strictly DPS player I'd like them to acknowledge the over powered heals, AND TANKS and basically anything else that my character doesn't do.
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ForsakenKing's Avatar


ForsakenKing
05.15.2013 , 02:19 PM | #14
these are my favorite threads on the forums. now if only we can get a remove premades argument going here...

/popcorn

MajinUltima's Avatar


MajinUltima
05.15.2013 , 02:22 PM | #15
Quote: Originally Posted by Baedwulf View Post
Being a strictly DPS player I'd like them to acknowledge the over powered heals, AND TANKS and basically anything else that my character doesn't do.
I love that TOR uses Tanks in a useful PVP capacity. Unfortunately, with healers already being overpowered WITHOUT Guard/Taunt assistance, Tanks just make things more ridiculously unkillable.

For the record, I've played max-level PVP on:
- Sage
- Sorc
- Assassin
- Shadow
- Juggernaut
- Guardian
- Sentinel
- Marauder
- Vanguard
- Operative

I'm quite familiar with how specs and roles work, and am just as familiar with BEING overpowered. I'm not bringing this issue up from the perspective of someone who hasn't experienced both sides of it. I don't heal in PVP because I don't WANT to, I shouldn't be forced onto a bandwagon because the game is imbalanced. I could also exclusively heal spec and be overpowered, but that doesn't make the game fun.

Lunez's Avatar


Lunez
05.15.2013 , 02:28 PM | #16
Time to chime in, although the topic is pretty much answered.

1) Healing is NOT overpowered
2) Winning teams often consist of pre-mades (this is true)
3) Winning teams are not lop-sided (they have well balanced mechanics)
4) Losing teams are often not balanced
. 4a) If your output (dps) cannot outperform the enemy healers, then you're lacking qualified dps
. 4b) If your input (healing) cannot outperform your enemy output, then you're lacking qualified healing
5) Do not let rule #4 discourage you. The answers are very quite clear as to what you need to do next:
. 5a) You (or your teammates) need better gear, AND / OR
. 5b) You (or your teammates) need to re-evaluate the balance of your team, AND / OR
. 5c) You are merely being outperformed by a superior opponent. You must increase your learning curve.

THis pretty much nails everything on the head. Trust me when I say right now, things are incredibly balanced, with the sole exception being the learning curve of your oponents. If you are being outperformed, you need to ask yourself what are they doing that is outperforming you. Many people use gaming mice and gaming keyboards.

I personally use a razor naga mouse, I have 12 thumb buttons, each with their own macro'ed set of rotations or actions. My healing, dps, tanking, etc--- will always outperform those without a gaming mouse, with the exception of those players who are just flat out better than me, and there are indeed, many who are better than me.

I hope this response helps you. Please do not blame a class, a skill, or a particular action for the performance of your team. If your team is broken, thiink about ways to fix it. Be a contender, strive for greatness. You can do it, I have faith in you.

abhaxus's Avatar


abhaxus
05.15.2013 , 02:31 PM | #17
There is nothing you can say that makes it more obvious you are bad than saying healers are overpowered. Heals are fine, learn to focus. Play a healer, you'll learn how to kill them. I can still take down healers easily on my PT pyro after the nerf. Healing is fine.
Abhaxus - Sorc heal/dps | Op-haxus - op heals | Buubi'sett - PT | Snugglenaut - Jugg hybrid | Wayward'son - sniper | Abhaxuus - Mara | Weezles - Scoundrel | Aßhaxus - Sage | Spankasin - tankasin | Aßhole - Commando

Baalzamon's Avatar


Baalzamon
05.15.2013 , 02:39 PM | #18
Healing need to be nerfed by 30% at least.

MajinUltima's Avatar


MajinUltima
05.15.2013 , 02:40 PM | #19
Quote:
1) Healing is NOT overpowered
1. It mathematically objectively is.

Quote:
2) Winning teams often consist of pre-mades (this is true)
2. Stacking a disproportinate amount of healers and hybrid healers.

Quote:
3) Winning teams are not lop-sided (they have well balanced mechanics)
3. Because it is intended that HALF or MORE of a team is healing or off-healing. That is not lop-sided at all if you consider the game is generally designed from the perspective that 1/4 of the players in a group are healing, not half or more.

Quote:
. 4a) If your output (dps) cannot outperform the enemy healers, then you're lacking qualified dps
4. Mathematically untrue. Healing specs outperform DPS by huge margins EXCEPT in cases of AOE inflation, with healing numbers being understated and damage numbers overstated. Not only does healing outstrip damage, the margin is much larger than the objective scoreboards will reflect.

This is the typical "I don't care about facts! Healing is balanced because I say so, even when objective mathematical data shows otherwise! You suck at DPS! You're bad! I'm not overpowered! Learn to play!". Really now, I'm not sure who believes it other than those seeking to reinforce their own falsehoods. You are literally objectively mathematically wrong.

Quote:
Play a healer, you'll learn how to kill them.
I have played healing and more often healing hybrid specs multiple times. I run away with Kolto Probes up, I don't die, period. The ONLY way I die is literally if my entire team is already dead AND I'm alone AND I'm trapped. It is completely insanely overpowered that I can do that. The problem is, I don't WANT to do that, I want the freedom to actually play specs and be competitive... not be forced to heal because it's overpowered.

Quote:
I can still take down healers easily on my PT pyro after the nerf. Healing is fine.
I can 1v1 against almost any spec in the game 95% of the time, while playing any class myself. Healers, DPS, Tanks, doesn't matter. Does that mean every class is perfectly balanced, or that it's just easy to find bad players who wandered off alone?

NoTomorrow's Avatar


NoTomorrow
05.15.2013 , 02:50 PM | #20
Its pointless to argue. Healer players will never admit that cross healing is overtuned. Let them rejoice for now.

1.2 will happen again. And then we, DPS guys, will be coming to gloat in your "why healers have been nerfed" threads. I want to see sorc and operative players threatening to quit swtor, if their lolheals will not be unnerfed.
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